Slotted Dancing

[Sheepman]

With yet another discussion starting on this topic, I think the time is right for a poll, a thread I've been meaning to start for months, (OK it wasn't my idea originally).
Slotted dancing is where you are dancing from point A to point B, at either end of the slot - like you do in all (?) MJ classes. If there is space, the slot can widen - with the travel going perpendicular to the original slot, though you normally return to the original slot. Keeping your bearings is easy in most venues - because they tend to be rectangular, the circular venues are more of a problem!

At a friend's party recently, I was grabbed for a dance by a young lady I didn't know, after a minute or so she asked "What are we doing?"
My stock answer to something like this (because it's true!) "I don't know."
She said "We seem to be walking up and down?"
My reply "Oh, I do a lot of West Coast Swing."
"Oh no! I Don't do that, I only do jive, where you go round and round. "

I just managed to hold back from having an apoplectic fit!

So for me, after years of "going round and round" it has to be slotted. It's safer, more stylish (IMO), gives you more space, and probably easier. Of course it doesn't stop you doing circular moves, but you return to the slot by going round a half or full circle, as you would in the lesson.

So what is the best way of squeezing more people on the floor.

Less than 2.5 square metres, and something has to give.
- You can shorten the connection to make the circle smaller. A 1.5 m circle and you can get almost 50 couples on the floor without bumping, or 55 with.
- You can take the WCS idea of dancing in a slot - you can still move a lot, but the man has to be better at controlling the lady's direction (A 2m by 1m slot and you get 50 couples on the 10 by 10 m floor.)
- Or do both, and you get 65 couples on the floor.

So it might be better to suggest to people to dance in a slot as the floor gets busier, and make the most of the available room.

He has encouraged people to dance in a slot as you take up less room. Every jive lesson is taught in a slot in order to maintain the rows and if dancers choose not to use this in freestyle, then there will be less floor space.

Kate

[under par]

With yet another discussion starting on this topic, I think the time is right for a poll, a thread I've been meaning to start for months, (OK it wasn't my idea originally).
Slotted dancing is where you are dancing from point A to point B, at either end of the slot - like you do in all (?) MJ classes. If there is space, the slot can widen - with the travel going perpendicular to the original slot, though you normally return to the original slot. Keeping your bearings is easy in most venues - because they tend to be rectangular, the circular venues are more of a problem!

At a friend's party recently, I was grabbed for a dance by a young lady I didn't know, after a minute or so she asked "What are we doing?"
My stock answer to something like this (because it's true!) "I don't know."
She said "We seem to be walking up and down?"
My reply "Oh, I do a lot of West Coast Swing."
"Oh no! I Don't do that, I only do jive, where you go round and round. "

I just managed to hold back from having an apoplectic fit!

So for me, after years of "going round and round" it has to be slotted. It's safer, more stylish (IMO), gives you more space, and probably easier. Of course it doesn't stop you doing circular moves, but you return to the slot by going round a half or full circle, as you would in the lesson.

I am just getting my head around what slotted dancing is.

I feel that without ever having been taught (ie the theory)of it or fully understanding what it is I feel I sometimes use it when it is busy.

The more threads about
1.lead and follow
2. frames
3. slotting and
4. Gadgets superb introspective on his abilities,
that I read the more the more I go out to dance trying to use or put into practice some of these theories.

I find whilst I am out dancing when I try to put into practice the theories I am currently concerned with I become more "wooden" as the mind races.

Perserverance with different aspects has paid dividends for me and I now try to set a little objective for myself each evening.

[Gus]

I remember the (former) Mrs Ceroc (aka Janie) had a big downer about 'crabbing', i.e. continually circling ... so for that perspective I agree with Messr Sheepman. HOWEVER, I find the 'slot' dance a bit restrictive ... I like to see dancer using room and using broad sweeping movements to interpret dance and put a bit of life into the game (dance room permitting). In fact I think was Amir that really got me thinking about using floorspace and dynamic movement as an added dimension to musical interpretation. Gladly, there are still a few larger venues where ther is room to dance 'un-economically' with space.

[Emma]

As a follower one doesn't have much choice, if the lead is dancing in a slot and you're follwing, you dance in a slot.....

[spindr]

Ah, I think that there's two concepts that are getting mixed:

1). The man leaves the lady's line free.
2). The lady dances in a slot.

1) doesn't necessarily imply 2) as you can rotate, but still keep the lady's line free.

I generally dance 1). and then if it gets crowded I dance 2).

[under par]

Ah, I think that there's two concepts that are getting mixed:

1). The man leaves the lady's line free.
2). The lady dances in a slot.

1) doesn't necessarily imply 2) as you can rotate, but still keep the lady's line free.

I generally dance 1). and then if it gets crowded I dance 2).

I tried to do a bit more "slot" dancing tonight.......found it extremely difficult with beginners but I was more successful with more experienced dancers.

I do not think I could enjoy dancing like this all the time though.!!

[Gadget]

FWIW, here's my thoughts on 'slotted dancing':

Why we dance in circles.
Because it's natural and flowing. Wrap a lady into a basket, and the momentum rotates you slightly. Draw a lady behind you for a catapult and you take a gentle step right to line up. On a step-across, you step to her left and turn to face....Most movements involve moving the lady to your right or stepping lightly left. Most ladies don't spin on the spot; they 'step' and spin (normally stepping to the right).
If the lady is going to be "out of position" relative to the floor, it will be more to the right; then the man rotates slightly to face "square on". If they over-rotate, the man will compensate by stepping slightly to the left and rotating.
Round and round we go.

Why dance in a 'Slot'?
Several arguments, but all fairly weak - If you like dancing in circles, then continue.
- Takes up less space; you can get more folk in a venue and on the floor if everyone would just keep to their "slot" {line dancing anyone?}
- Looks more controlled; you are actually 'dancing' rather than just moving with the music.
- Moves are taught linearly; If you are learning from the teacher, and you dance in class in a line, why change it for freestyle?
- Easier to follow; the lady gets more idea of where she should be, regardless of the man's lead.
- Better floor-craft; you know where people are going to be and where you are going to lead the lady - less accidental impacts.
- Better use of space; it is easier to see and take advantage of spatial openings around you on the dance floor

How to dance "slotted"
Imagine a thick line, the width of your body, extending from you to your partner on the floor. It extends beyond them and behind you. All moves should move along this line and end up on this line. Keeping within it is not vital, as long as you are parallel, move along it and return to it.

Expanding this concept, you get "cross shaped" dancing {I first was introduced to this by Marc at a fairly recent workshop}.
Narrow that slot and put a shorter one extending right/left to either side of the lead. Now the object is to actually contain all moves within this cross - leading the lady to move forward and back along the slot and stepping onto your tangent slot to get out of her way. Step off the cross and the crocodiles get you.
This is really hard to master - but I think that it works well. On some traditionally "circular" moves, you move the lady onto your 'slot' and everything snaps round 90 degrees. And again, and again...
One of the more difficult things to do is to make sure that all your turns, spins and flowing movements stop so that the angles of the cross shape are maintained.

Personally, I think that it takes a lot of concentration and very good leading (&following) to be able to pull it off. Once it's embedded, it should be easier, but the precision required can only improve your dancing. (At least I hope so...)

As a side effect, I've found that I do a lot more "walks" since trying this method of dancing (and I have never 'liked' walk moves )

{BTW I am both flattered and humbled that any comments I make here affect anyone's dancing - I'm not a teacher, I'm not even a taxi dancer; I just have a passion for this dance we call MJ. I only hope any influence is in a positive way. (and nothing to do with licking eyeballs )}

[under par]

FWIW, here's my thoughts on 'slotted dancing':

Why we dance in circles.
Because it's natural and flowing. Wrap a lady into a basket, and the momentum rotates you slightly. Draw a lady behind you for a catapult and you take a gentle step right to line up. On a step-across, you step to her left and turn to face....Most movements involve moving the lady to your right or stepping lightly left. Most ladies don't spin on the spot; they 'step' and spin (normally stepping to the right).
If the lady is going to be "out of position" relative to the floor, it will be more to the right; then the man rotates slightly to face "square on". If they over-rotate, the man will compensate by stepping slightly to the left and rotating.
Round and round we go.

Why dance in a 'Slot'?
Several arguments, but all fairly weak - If you like dancing in circles, then continue.
- Takes up less space; you can get more folk in a venue and on the floor if everyone would just keep to their "slot" {line dancing anyone?}
- Looks more controlled; you are actually 'dancing' rather than just moving with the music.
- Moves are taught linearly; If you are learning from the teacher, and you dance in class in a line, why change it for freestyle?
- Easier to follow; the lady gets more idea of where she should be, regardless of the man's lead.
- Better floor-craft; you know where people are going to be and where you are going to lead the lady - less accidental impacts.
- Better use of space; it is easier to see and take advantage of spatial openings around you on the dance floor

How to dance "slotted"
Imagine a thick line, the width of your body, extending from you to your partner on the floor. It extends beyond them and behind you. All moves should move along this line and end up on this line. Keeping within it is not vital, as long as you are parallel, move along it and return to it.

Expanding this concept, you get "cross shaped" dancing {I first was introduced to this by Marc at a fairly recent workshop}.
Narrow that slot and put a shorter one extending right/left to either side of the lead. Now the object is to actually contain all moves within this cross - leading the lady to move forward and back along the slot and stepping onto your tangent slot to get out of her way. Step off the cross and the crocodiles get you.
This is really hard to master - but I think that it works well. On some traditionally "circular" moves, you move the lady onto your 'slot' and everything snaps round 90 degrees. And again, and again...
One of the more difficult things to do is to make sure that all your turns, spins and flowing movements stop so that the angles of the cross shape are maintained.

Personally, I think that it takes a lot of concentration and very good leading (&following) to be able to pull it off. Once it's embedded, it should be easier, but the precision required can only improve your dancing. (At least I hope so...)

As a side effect, I've found that I do a lot more "walks" since trying this method of dancing (and I have never 'liked' walk moves )

{BTW I am both flattered and humbled that any comments I make here affect anyone's dancing - I'm not a teacher, I'm not even a taxi dancer; I just have a passion for this dance we call MJ. I only hope any influence is in a positive way. (and nothing to do with licking eyeballs )}

Excellent post again Gadget I personally get a lot out of your postings.

Long may it continue.

You have certainly given me lots of things to think about when I go out dancing.

I have taken to more walks too!!

[Trish]

I've just been thinking about this slotted dancing and trying to work out what I do when I lead (which I do quite frequently - there often aren't enough men at Peterborough). I think I have tended to do a lot of circle dancing, but have recently realised that I prefer it when men lead me in a cross or a line for at least some of the time, so I have tried to transfer this to my own leading. I agree with Gadget (if I've understood his point correctly!), that the reason you tend to dance in circles is often to compensate for the girl getting slightly off the line. I have now got to a stage where I dance in circles for a while and then try to vary it with a more linear move such as a walk. Hopefully the girls dancing with me will find this more interesting. Surely Slotted moves all the time are just as samey as circling moves all the time? And also I would have thought that as long as you look out for where you're going, and lead into the space, then circling can be just as successful. Or am I wrong about that?

Trish

[Rhythm King]

I learned a lot of my MJ in a small, crowded venue, where slotted dancing was the norm. We had a truly excellent, Latin-influenced teacher (Michaela Walker ), who, amongst other things, taught us to make good use of floor space as it became available, including various walks, promenades etc, but to remain situationally aware, in order to avoid stealing other people's intended manouevre room and to protect our partners. As I've moved round the MJ circuit, I have come across a certain number of ladies who will dance in a circle, no matter how hard you try to keep them in line (short of brute force ). Aside from becoming dizzy, it cuts down severely on one's choice of leadable moves and variations and therefore I don't care for it (he says as diplomatically as he can ).
Whether I use slot, or cross, or every inch of available space is therefore dependent on manouevre room, confidence of/with partner and musical interpretation.

[Stuart M]

I've started practicing dancing more in a slot recently, mainly to try to cut down on my floorspace use, and also to try the cross thing Marc taught in his workshop.

Thing is, I've developed a suspicion that the circling starts as a way of compensating for followers not turning/returning on the spot - Trish has already noted this above. More pertinently, it's a way for leads to disguise the lack of precision in their lead*, which is usually the cause of followers not turning/returning on the spot.

Thoughts? It's just a theory - happy to see it shot down by the experts out there.

*Could even be argued that it's a form of imprecise lead in itself!

[Trish]

I've started practicing dancing more in a slot recently, mainly to try to cut down on my floorspace use, and also to try the cross thing Marc taught in his workshop.

Thing is, I've developed a suspicion that the circling starts as a way of compensating for followers not turning/returning on the spot - Trish has already noted this above. More pertinently, it's a way for leads to disguise the lack of precision in their lead*, which is usually the cause of followers not turning/returning on the spot.

Thoughts? It's just a theory - happy to see it shot down by the experts out there.

*Could even be argued that it's a form of imprecise lead in itself!

You could be right there Stuart, perhaps these ladies are out of position because I don't lead them right, although I think I'm fairly precise (I shall have to watch myself and try to work out if this is the case).

I think the problem I have with this is that as a lot of the Peterborough ladies I dance with are fairly inexperienced dancers, they pull the lead off-centre as they haven't learnt to spin on the spot. I am sure this is the case with beginners when I'm taxi dancing, as I often find my shoulders aching from trying to keep them from spinning into other people and causing an injury! Perhaps I just need to go down the gym and develop the muscles to lead them or stop worrying about it and just let them collide!

Peterborough is often crowded, so if beginners are totally off-centre I'll try to get them to dance at the side away from the main dance floor to avoid these problems. Everyone's got to start somewhere, and I was probably the worst spinner you've ever come across when I first started!

Actually I think my dancing is perhaps a little more linear when I dance with the more experienced girls, as they don't look at you blankly if you ask them to do a columbian or lead them into some walk.

[DavidB]

Thought it was tome to confuse everyone.

There is a concept taught in Hustle of a 'rotating slot'. Instead of imagining a simple slot or a cross, think about a bicycle wheel with spokes. The man is the axle, and stays roughly in the middle. The spokes don't go straight through the centre of the axle - they touch the edge of the axle. The lady goes from one point on the wheel rim to another via the spokes, and not around the rim. (That would make her tyred...) She won't make it all the way to the opposite end of the slot - instead she will be slightly to one side.

You still get most of the benefits of keeping the dance slotted (the look, the control, the safety) but you do take up more space than a pure slot.

A slot can be hard to keep to with faster music. A 'rotating slot' makes things a bit easier.

[Graham W]

Nigel & Nina teach slotting well, too

If more people took it up it's great for crowded dance floors & challenging..

G :-)

[RobC]

There is a concept taught in Hustle of a 'rotating slot'. Instead of imagining a simple slot or a cross, think about a bicycle wheel with spokes. The man is the axle, and stays roughly in the middle.

So that's how you get to dance on the spot and make the women do all the travelling ?

[thewacko]

As a follower one doesn't have much choice, if the lead is dancing in a slot and you're follwing, you dance in a slot.....

OK i am one of the three who can not grasp what you are all talking about so
Em my love looks like i will have to have a dance with you again so you can enlighten me, and if I like it I may try some slotting on you!

[Zebra Woman]

I like a mixture of slot and swirling depending on the music. But for expressive dancing I think the slot has more opportunities.

When a venue gets really crowded and also if I'm tired I only really want to dance in a slot. I feel much safer and it's even better if the surrounding dancers are slot dancing too.

I have danced with a vigorous swirler at a really crowded venue and we collided with another couple a few times. The other man said 'watch it mate' then after two more bumps, he stopped dancing to tell my partner off. I was actually relieved he'd spoken, 'cos I was getting a bit battered and was starting to worry about the next hit. Embarrassing, but IMHO on a busy dance floor reckless swirling can be anti-social.

My slot dancing near- collisions have been more amusing than painful, I have been up close face to face with other women, hastily reversed out of a columbian , when another couple have advanced, and had some funny stand-offs. There is more time to play with the other couple and it can turn into a game.

[Andy McGregor]

I have danced with a vigorous swirler at a really crowded venue and we collided with another couple a few times. The other man said 'watch it mate' then after two more bumps, he stopped dancing to tell my partner off. I was actually relieved he'd spoken, 'cos I was getting a bit battered and was starting to worry about the next hit. Embarrassing, but IMHO on a busy dance floor reckless swirling can be anti-social.

Was this me?

I usually just glare like this

The guys that dance in circles on a busy dance floor must think that they're so good all the other dancers are giving them room. Meanwhile, us slotted dancers are dancing smaller and smaller to keep out of their way

Someone recently told me about a Paris dance club where the slots are marked out on the floor and people get chucked off the floor if they stray out of their slots - you'd have to give those swirling dancers at least 3 slots: maybe they should pay 3 times as much to come in as well

[Zebra Woman]

Was this me?
:

No but feel free to speak out in future...please

I have experienced the shrinking dance space many times. It is often really good dancers being squeezed out by the space grabbers. It takes them a great deal of thought and skill to keep the woman safe, no wonder they don't get into the groove on those nights.
There are a few slot dancing men who seem to maintain their space effortlessly no matter how bad it gets, I don't know how they do it.

How do you do it guys?

[RobC]

The guys that dance in circles on a busy dance floor must think that they're so good all the other dancers are giving them room. Meanwhile, us slotted dancers are dancing smaller and smaller to keep out of their way

Personally if I find myself dancing next to one of these inconsiderate types, I tend to back into 'their dance space' and do a few moves where I'm stationary and keep my partner just out of their reach. When they invariable collide with me, trust me, they feel it more than I do, and I'm in the right 'cos I'm stationary and they came into me

IMHO, slotted dancing is the only way to dance safely on a crowded floor, and everyone ought to be taught how to do it. What am I saying - everyone is taught how to dance in a straight line - afterall, that's exactly what they should be doing in their lessons. So why do dancers regress into circle dancing ?