Page 2 of 7 FirstFirst 123456 ... LastLast
Results 21 to 40 of 135

Thread: This week's routine?

  1. #21
    The Dashing Moderator
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Midlands
    Posts
    3,556
    Rep Power
    12

    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    You altered the Sacred Text?
    BURN HIM!!!
    Not me - I was only a taxi dancer on Monday night.
    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    I don't think so - because you'll have less time to practise the difficult move. If you learn the tough one at the start, then you'll be able to practise it every time you do the whole routine, so you have a better chance of getting it - at least, that's what I found. Sometimes a move only clicks when you've done it a certain number of times.
    I see what you mean, but I dunno - I've seen Beginners who haven't "got" it when the teacher has finished teaching & moved to the next move, and every time the teacher goes through the routine from the start, they still struggle, and feel at sea with the later easier moves because they've lost timing with the teacher.

    If I'm taxiing I often do a mini-survey in the refresher class to see which move people found hardest, and then spend some time on that one before doing the rest.
    Love dance, will travel

  2. #22
    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Norf Lundin
    Posts
    17,001
    Blog Entries
    1
    Rep Power
    18

    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by El Salsero Gringo View Post
    That is correct. You can go to six beginner's classes in the same week and not get the same routine twice.
    And then you'd be An Intermediate Dancer, after 1 week

    That system sounds eminently sensible to me, thanks for explaining.

    Re: transition from swizzle to basket:
    Quote Originally Posted by Whitebeard View Post
    But H always inserts an In and Out as an introduction to the Basket, which I feel does aid the transition.
    Really? Howcum? Surely it's easier to simply not let go of your partner's hand?

    Quote Originally Posted by Whitebeard View Post
    as I led the following move by taking my right hand to the left shoulder I was, for a moment, in the curious position of having my arms crossed in front of my chest. Is that a style point or sheer incompetence ?
    Depends how good it looks
    Last edited by David Bailey; 4th-October-2006 at 08:47 AM.

  3. #23
    The Forum Legend
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Nottingham
    Posts
    10,672
    Rep Power
    14

    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    And then you'd be An Intermediate Dancer, after 1 week

    That system sounds eminently sensible to me, thanks for explaining.
    Ummm. I think that they say it takes 12 weeks to be an intermediate dancer. So you'd actually need to go and do a class a day for 2 weeks before you achieve that!!

  4. #24
    Registered User Freya's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Up near the ceiling!!!
    Posts
    2,035
    Rep Power
    10

    Re: This week's routine?

    Hi the Beginner moves at Culter last night were:

    • First Move
    • Manspin catching right
    • Shoulder drop
    • Octopus


    I think! I was messing about with Gadget at the Back of the hall as we got there late. Trying to lead Gadget is not the easiest thing in the world.
    Last edited by Freya; 4th-October-2006 at 08:56 AM. Reason: Confusion

  5. #25
    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Norf Lundin
    Posts
    17,001
    Blog Entries
    1
    Rep Power
    18

    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by TheTramp View Post
    Ummm. I think that they say it takes 12 weeks to be an intermediate dancer. So you'd actually need to go and do a class a day for 2 weeks before you achieve that!!
    Yeah, I thought it had changed to 12 weeks, but I still hear 6 weeks being bandied around, so I dunno.

    Looking at the ceroc.com website, it says:

    Quote Originally Posted by Ceroc website
    We normally recommend that it takes about 5 or 6 beginners classes to master the basic moves and feel comfortable to join in at Intermediate level.

  6. #26
    The Forum Legend
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Nottingham
    Posts
    10,672
    Rep Power
    14

    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    Yeah, I thought it had changed to 12 weeks, but I still hear 6 weeks being bandied around, so I dunno.

    Looking at the ceroc.com website, it says:
    Hmmm.....

    It's always mentioned as 12 weeks up here.

    I'd still prefer to see it done as, "feel comfortable with all the beginner moves, and dancing freestyle".

    Maybe even mention of having completed a beginners workshop too.

    Definitely think that 5-6 weeks (classes), is far too few for almost all leads, and a good number of followers.

  7. #27
    Registered User El Salsero Gringo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    London
    Posts
    4,881
    Rep Power
    12

    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by Freya View Post
    Trying to lead Gadget is not the easiest thing in the world.
    The cannonical quote, I believe, is "You can lead Gadget to a keyboard, but you can't make him think."

  8. #28
    The Forum Legend
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Nottingham
    Posts
    10,672
    Rep Power
    14

    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by El Salsero Gringo View Post
    The cannonical quote, I believe, is "You can lead Gadget to a keyboard, but you can't make him think."
    "Think"? I thought that it was "spell-check"?

  9. #29
    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Norf Lundin
    Posts
    17,001
    Blog Entries
    1
    Rep Power
    18

    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by TheTramp View Post
    Definitely think that 5-6 weeks (classes), is far too few for almost all leads, and a good number of followers.
    I agree. I reckon 3 months is a minimum, and I'd be happier with 3-6 months being a recommendation.

    I mean, we did the straightjacket on Monday in the intermediate's class, and for someone who'd only done 6 weeks, that'd be a nightmare to attempt.

    But CerocTM wants to push the "easy to dance" message...

  10. #30
    The Forum Legend
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Nottingham
    Posts
    10,672
    Rep Power
    14

    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    I agree. I reckon 3 months is a minimum, and I'd be happier with 3-6 months being a recommendation.

    I mean, we did the straightjacket on Monday in the intermediate's class, and for someone who'd only done 6 weeks, that'd be a nightmare to attempt.

    But CerocTM wants to push the "easy to dance" message...
    Brings back the idea of intromediate classes, doesn't it

    And, I still say that it shouldn't be based on a time, but on ability, or opportunity. I did the intermediate class on my 2nd night - but I was good friends with a taxi-dancer at the time. There are some people who are just very talented. Others might well be still doing only beginner classes after several years!

    Maybe people should have to speak to the teacher before moving up!

  11. #31
    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Norf Lundin
    Posts
    17,001
    Blog Entries
    1
    Rep Power
    18

    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by TheTramp View Post
    Maybe people should have to speak to the teacher before moving up!
    Careful, you'll be suggesting we have an evil divisive card system next...

  12. #32
    The Forum Legend
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Nottingham
    Posts
    10,672
    Rep Power
    14

    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    Careful, you'll be suggesting we have an evil divisive card system next...
    Me? Nah! I was just setting you up to mention it!

  13. #33
    Commercial Operator onkar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Cambridge
    Posts
    178
    Rep Power
    10

    Re: This week's routine?

    Not sure how other's do it but in Ceroc Central land, we have a 12 week rota.

    This lists various combinations of the beginners moves 4 normally (or 5 if the in & out is included). Each week will contain one move from the previous week.

    All Ceroc Central venues on that day will teach the same set of moves. The idea being that if someone attends several classes a week, they will not get the same class twice. This structure may well be nationwide, but it is certainly true of Central.


    Onkar

  14. #34
    Registered User El Salsero Gringo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    London
    Posts
    4,881
    Rep Power
    12

    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by onkar View Post
    Not sure how other's do it but in Ceroc Central land, we have a 12 week rota.

    This lists various combinations of the beginners moves 4 normally (or 5 if the in & out is included). Each week will contain one move from the previous week.

    All Ceroc Central venues on that day will teach the same set of moves. The idea being that if someone attends several classes a week, they will not get the same class twice. This structure may well be nationwide, but it is certainly true of Central.


    Onkar
    It is a system that is available to Ceroc teachers nationally. I know of none who choose to ignore it; I also believe that Ceroc Central makes it an absolute requirement of its teachers to follow it.

  15. #35
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Location
    Cruden Bay (Aberde
    Posts
    7,053
    Rep Power
    13

    Re: This week's routine?

    Dropping the return:
    I think that dropping the return from the shoulder slide to the cattapult is good because it makes it harder: you have to actually complete the shoulder slide, finishing with the correct orientation to your partner before the cattapult will flow smoothly on from it. If you put a return in, it makes it easier because you can use that movement to re-align yourself with your partner in readyness for the cattapult.

    The shoulder slide as a move:
    I think again it's good for beginners because it introduces the concept that you hand can be in one of three heights: above your partner's head, shoulder height or waist level. The teacher can make sure that it's not too high, that follower's don't simply turn because a hand is being raised and leads can try to avoid ambiguous signals.
    You can also 'play' with the move more than a man-spin (taking time to slide accross the back), it's easier to catch with the left again from this than the man-spin, and with some crafty leading, it can turn into a comb variation

    same routines
    I like the idea that no matter where you are in the country, everyone learns the same thing on the dame night. Makes for easier discussion and builds more of the 'community spirit' into it.

    being led
    I would be OK (for a beginner ) if I didn't sabotage all the time ... or anticipate... or offer/take the wrong hand... or... {BTW she's a good lead }

  16. #36
    The Forum Legend
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Nottingham
    Posts
    10,672
    Rep Power
    14

    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gadget View Post
    Dropping the return:
    I think that dropping the return from the shoulder slide to the cattapult is good because it makes it harder: you have to actually complete the shoulder slide, finishing with the correct orientation to your partner before the cattapult will flow smoothly on from it. If you put a return in, it makes it easier because you can use that movement to re-align yourself with your partner in readyness for the cattapult.
    I agree.

    However, whether I'd teach it without would depend on whether there were any people in their first couple of weeks in the class. Or whether I was just feeling plain mean!

  17. #37
    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Norf Lundin
    Posts
    17,001
    Blog Entries
    1
    Rep Power
    18

    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gadget View Post
    Dropping the return:
    I think that dropping the return from the shoulder slide to the cattapult is good because it makes it harder: you have to actually complete the shoulder slide, finishing with the correct orientation to your partner before the cattapult will flow smoothly on from it. If you put a return in, it makes it easier because you can use that movement to re-align yourself with your partner in readyness for the cattapult.
    Yeah, but there's "harder" and "not flowing" - a return makes it flow better for me, there's less work involved in trying to align yourself at the end, twist the hand around etc.

    To me, the natural position from the end of a shoulder slide wasn't really appropriate for an immediate catapult - putting a return in made the routine seem more natural.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gadget View Post
    The shoulder slide as a move:
    I think again it's good for beginners because it introduces the concept that you hand can be in one of three heights: above your partner's head, shoulder height or waist level. The teacher can make sure that it's not too high, that follower's don't simply turn because a hand is being raised and leads can try to avoid ambiguous signals.
    You can also 'play' with the move more than a man-spin (taking time to slide accross the back), it's easier to catch with the left again from this than the man-spin, and with some crafty leading, it can turn into a comb variation
    True, but that's not for a beginner's class. And surely the moves like shoulder drop can teach you about the arm positions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gadget View Post
    same routines
    I like the idea that no matter where you are in the country, everyone learns the same thing on the dame night. Makes for easier discussion and builds more of the 'community spirit' into it.
    Me too - in fact, I'm surprised no-one's started a thread like this before.

  18. #38
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Location
    Cruden Bay (Aberde
    Posts
    7,053
    Rep Power
    13

    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    To me, the natural position from the end of a shoulder slide wasn't really appropriate for an immediate catapult - putting a return in made the routine seem more natural.
    But every Ceroc beginner move starts and ends in exactly the same position with the same hand hold and the same orientation. This is what makes any move able to link to any other move with ease.
    ...What you're really saying is that you don't actually perform a shoulder slide as it should be done. *tsk* and from a demo too. {}

  19. #39
    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Norf Lundin
    Posts
    17,001
    Blog Entries
    1
    Rep Power
    18

    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gadget View Post
    But every Ceroc beginner move starts and ends in exactly the same position with the same hand hold and the same orientation. This is what makes any move able to link to any other move with ease.
    ...What you're really saying is that you don't actually perform a shoulder slide as it should be done. *tsk* and from a demo too. {}
    Well, only a part-time demo. I'm not a Real Dancer, after all. The teacher was desperate, I think I was about 15th on her list.

    Seriously, how do you end up in the neutral handhold from a shoulder-slide? Surely the natural handhold is with the guy's hand palm-down from that move? Of course, you can cheat, but that's, well, cheating.

    In fact - looking at the list of beginner moves:
    1. First Move
    2. Basket
    3. Octopus
    4. Comb
    5. Arm jive
    6. Yo-yo
    7. Push spin
    8. Swizzle
    9. Backpass
    10. Catapult
    11. Cerocspin
    12. In and out
    13. Man-spin
    14. Shoulder Drop
    15. Shoulder Slide
    16. Side to side


    Very few of these moves don't require a return to get back to the starting point. Try doing a catapult then a manspin, without the return...
    Last edited by David Bailey; 4th-October-2006 at 01:54 PM.

  20. #40
    Not a spoon! Lou's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Holby
    Posts
    3,772
    Blog Entries
    2
    Rep Power
    12

    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidY View Post
    .... an In-and-Out between the Armjive Swizzle and the BasketWe also had the "without return in-between" variant...


    Quote Originally Posted by Whitebeard View Post
    But H always inserts an In and Out as an introduction to the Basket, which I feel does aid the transition.


    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    You altered the Sacred Text?
    BURN HIM!!!


    To appreciate which moves feel better with/without a return before, try dancing them as a Follower.

    A catapult is always awkward after a return. So kudos to the person teaching with DavidY, for dropping it. Presumably she's female, so has noticed the problem from a Follower's POV.

    To be honest, I disagree with ESG ( ) that the beginner routines are well thought out. It's always going to be awkward for a beginner to lead a catapult directly after a Manspin, because new Leads are not particularly comfortable moving (hell - even DavidB doesn't like doing it ) which is probably why DavidJamesfeels happier leading a return - it gives him some breathing space. But it does feel weird to the follower. It would be better if a Catapult followed a Yo-yo, for instance. It's the anti-clockwise turn of a return going into the anti-clockwise turn under the arm bit of the catapult that feels odd.

    The in-and-out, after a Return, but before a Basket, breaks up 2 consecutive anti-clockwise turns (the bit where you wrap the lady in is an anti-clockwise turn).

    Quote Originally Posted by Gadget View Post
    But every Ceroc beginner move starts and ends in exactly the same position with the same hand hold and the same orientation. This is what makes any move able to link to any other move with ease.
    Are you playing Devil's Advocate, Gadget? Yes, they do. And all combinations are possible. But I'm just explaining why some feel nicer than others.

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    Very few of these moves don't require a return to get back to the starting point. Try doing a catapult then a manspin, without the return...
    You see, it'll work that way because the lady has just completed a CLOCKWISE turn, prior to the anti-clockwise Return

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. How many moves per routine?
    By Beowulf in forum Beginners corner
    Replies: 23
    Last Post: 29th-June-2006, 09:57 PM
  2. Should teachers demo the routine before a class?
    By DavidY in forum Let's talk about dance
    Replies: 97
    Last Post: 2nd-March-2006, 05:31 AM
  3. Teaching the end of the routine first
    By El Salsero Gringo in forum Let's talk about dance
    Replies: 19
    Last Post: 26th-February-2005, 01:03 AM
  4. Urbanmetro - Slow Routine To Be Taught
    By Gordon J Pownall in forum Social events
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 30th-June-2004, 01:28 PM

Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •