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Thread: This week's routine?

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    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    This week's routine?

    I heard that Ceroc HQ mandate that every beginner's class should use the same set of moves in a given week, is this true?

    For example, this week in Finchley, the beginner's routine was:
    • Swizzle
    • Basket
    • Shoulder-slide
    • Catapult


    Was that the same everywhere across the UK? Did you do that routine in your beginner class?

    If so, it might be interesting, as we could discuss "This week's routine" despite being in different venues.

    I'll kick off - I thought the shoulder-slide was a naff move, I never use it, I'd much rather use the manspin instead (because I can lift my right arm up then rather than leave it dangling). Also, the link between the shoulder-slide and the catapult only really worked if there was a return in between, which seemed a bit iffy to me.

    I liked the swizzle-into-basket combo, it flowed nicely.

    The catapult seemed a bit much for the end of a beginner's class, I think a comb might have worked better.

    ANy other comments?

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    Registered User Gojive's Avatar
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    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    I heard that Ceroc HQ mandate that every beginner's class should use the same set of moves in a given week, is this true?

    For example, this week in Finchley, the beginner's routine was:
    • Swizzle
    • Basket
    • Shoulder-slide
    • Catapult


    Was that the same everywhere across the UK? Did you do that routine in your beginner class?

    If so, it might be interesting, as we could discuss "This week's routine" despite being in different venues.

    I'll kick off - I thought the shoulder-slide was a naff move, I never use it, I'd much rather use the manspin instead (because I can lift my right arm up then rather than leave it dangling). Also, the link between the shoulder-slide and the catapult only really worked if there was a return in between, which seemed a bit iffy to me.

    I liked the swizzle-into-basket combo, it flowed nicely.

    The catapult seemed a bit much for the end of a beginner's class, I think a comb might have worked better.

    ANy other comments?
    Well quelle coincidence mon ami! That's exactly what I did at Wuking...sorry, I mean Woking, last night, under the tuition of Howard and Nicola , so I guess the mandate seems a distinct possibility.

    As far as the moves are concerned, I have no qualms about them - but then they were moves that I started on all those years ago, so I didn't really give it a second thought.

    The reason I attended my first BC for years last night , was to encourage a friend to have a go at MJ (it worked a treat btw, he's hooked! ). On the journey back, we were talking about what he found the hardest...it was the basket . He just had a mental block when it came to the 'twist the lady out, twist the lady in' bit.

    For my part, I really struggled to prevent myself jumping ahead (which Howard picked up on once or twice ), and breaking moves like the catapault down to 1/2 or even 1/4 beat segments

    I think I learnt a lot about how cocky I may have become last night

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    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gojive View Post
    On the journey back, we were talking about what he found the hardest...it was the basket . He just had a mental block when it came to the 'twist the lady out, twist the lady in' bit.
    Interesting. I think our problem was with the catapult, but that's because we started a bit late, and had problems moving 2,000 women round or whatever it was.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gojive View Post
    I think I learnt a lot about how cocky I may have become last night
    Could have been worse, you could have messed up the routine when everyone was watching you. Not that I'd ever do that, oh no...

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    Registered User El Salsero Gringo's Avatar
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    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    I heard that Ceroc HQ mandate that every beginner's class should use the same set of moves in a given week, is this true?
    It is true that there is a set of suggested beginners routines, and a set of suggested dates on which they could be taught.

    On the plus side: The routines are well thought out: They cover all the current beginners moves; they repeat one move from the previous week, and they flow together nicely. Having a schedule to teach them on is a necessary corollary, since a lot of people go to more than one venue per week (particularly beginners in the first few months when they're in "Ceroc-frenzy") and it would be a pain to have two venues cover the same routine on different nights of the same week.

    On the minus side: ...well, I'm struggling to think of one. No doubt I'll read about the disadvantages somewhere in the next hundred and twenty posts in this thread. Again and again and again.

    Contrary to what I suspect a lot of people would like to believe, there is no centrally mandated compulsion to use these routines. As far as I am aware, the closest thing to such "regulation" comes from the individual franchisees - some of whom run more than one venue - and some of whom do restrict their teacher's latitude by insisting on particular class formats, routines etc. That's not a Ceroc thing though.

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    Registered User Gojive's Avatar
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    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    and had problems moving 2,000 women round or whatever it was.
    Heh! We had one moment of chaos last night, when Howard said "move 5 ladies on", but over the background music 9 ladies thought he'd said "move 9 ladies on", and "5 ladies thought he'd said "move 9 ladies on".....I thought he'd said 'six', so I messed it up even further!

    That incident apart most of the time the move round went very smoothly. In fact it seemed to be much better than the intermediates...I'm wondering it that's becuase beginner's pay more attention to the teacher, and spend less time talking to each other, than intermediates do?....it's just an idle thought though, before I get slapped for saying it .

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    Registered User Gojive's Avatar
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    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by El Salsero Gringo View Post
    On the plus side: The routines are well thought out: They cover all the current beginners moves; they repeat one move from the previous week, and they flow together nicely.
    This approach I like. To me, it covers the idea of MJ not being a 'course of dance lessons', and yet it still retains continuity and structure from week to week - which can be so beneficial to committed beginners IMO.

    For example, if the friend I mentioned above does continue to go to classes, it'd be nice for him to repeat something like his catapault that he learnt last night, when he returns home to Exeter next week, so he doesn't feel like he's starting all over again.

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    Registered User El Salsero Gringo's Avatar
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    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    I'll kick off - I thought the shoulder-slide was a naff move, I never use it, I'd much rather use the manspin instead
    Does that mean it shouldn't be taught ever?

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    Registered User AllanMcC's Avatar
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    Re: This week's routine?

    Same routine in Edinburgh on Monday evening, so looks like it's throughout the country.
    Allan

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    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post

    I'll kick off - I thought the shoulder-slide was a naff move, I never use it, I'd much rather use the manspin instead (because I can lift my right arm up then rather than leave it dangling). Also, the link between the shoulder-slide and the catapult only really worked if there was a return in between, which seemed a bit iffy to me.
    No I think the shoulder slide is one of the better beginner moves. It's susceptible to being danced with style and has a number of easy variations to appeal to dancers of all standards. Especially when compared with that stepping in and out side to side thing..........come to think of it, I like to use it myself......

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    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: This week's routine?

    Re: shoulder-slide:
    Quote Originally Posted by El Salsero Gringo View Post
    Does that mean it shouldn't be taught ever?
    Well, I'm not sure it's a key beginner move, that's for sure. If there's only 16 beginner's moves, I'd rather not have 2 such similar moves - and to me, the manspin is better, because the man gets to do something with his spare arm.

    So, I'd rather have each beginner move designed so that it teaches a key (and separate) concept - and I don't see how the shoulder-slide does that?

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    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by El Salsero Gringo View Post
    On the minus side: ...well, I'm struggling to think of one.
    The most obvious potential downside is that people going to more than one beginner class a week will still only learn 1 routine. However, you could argue that they'll learn it really well

    I think, if I were a beginner, I'd prefer to learn different moves on different nights. But then, I could be wrong.

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    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    I heard that Ceroc HQ mandate that every beginner's class should use the same set of moves in a given week, is this true?
    My understanding is that it's a different routine every day of the week. So the set routines on Monday are different to the set routines on Tuesday and so on...
    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    If so, it might be interesting, as we could discuss "This week's routine" despite being in different venues.
    .. so no - we'd have to discuss "This Monday's routine"
    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    For example, this week in Finchley, the beginner's routine was:
    • Swizzle
    • Basket
    • Shoulder-slide
    • Catapult


    Was that the same everywhere across the UK? Did you do that routine in your beginner class?
    I was taxiing yesterday so I was vaguely paying attention. Yes we had that routine, but with an In-and-Out between the Armjive Swizzle and the Basket
    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    Also, the link between the shoulder-slide and the catapult only really worked if there was a return in between, which seemed a bit iffy to me.
    We also had the "without return in-between" variant...
    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    I liked the swizzle-into-basket combo, it flowed nicely.
    But maybe not with an In-and-Out (including the semi-circle/bouncing motion)
    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    The catapult seemed a bit much for the end of a beginner's class, I think a comb might have worked better.
    But isn't it better to stick the hard move at the end rather than at the beginning? If people struggle with the first move in a routine, then their chances of stringing the rest together are greatly reduced, even if they're easy moves.
    Love dance, will travel

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    Registered User El Salsero Gringo's Avatar
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    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidY View Post
    My understanding is that it's a different routine every day of the week. So the set routines on Monday are different to the set routines on Tuesday and so on.....
    That is correct. You can go to six beginner's classes in the same week and not get the same routine twice. The following week, each of those same six classes will use the next routine in the list from the one it used the previous week, again different to the routines used on all other nights of the same week. Some of the routines might have in fact been used on a different night of the previous week (or possibly the next week) but definitely not the same as any other night of the same week. Except for two classes on the same night. This is unlikely to be a problem as it would be difficult to attend two beginners classes in different venues on the same night. I hope that's all clear.
    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames
    The most obvious potential downside is that people going to more than one beginner class a week will still only learn 1 routine.
    I hope you can now see this is not the case!
    Last edited by El Salsero Gringo; 3rd-October-2006 at 11:11 PM.

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    Registered User Whitebeard's Avatar
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    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    I heard that Ceroc HQ mandate that every beginner's class should use the same set of moves in a given week, is this true?

    For example, this week in Finchley, the beginner's routine was:
    • Swizzle
    • Basket
    • Shoulder-slide
    • Catapult


    Was that the same everywhere across the UK? Did you do that routine in your beginner class?

    If so, it might be interesting, as we could discuss "This week's routine" despite being in different venues.

    I'll kick off - I thought the shoulder-slide was a naff move, I never use it, I'd much rather use the manspin instead (because I can lift my right arm up then rather than leave it dangling). Also, the link between the shoulder-slide and the catapult only really worked if there was a return in between, which seemed a bit iffy to me.

    I liked the swizzle-into-basket combo, it flowed nicely.

    The catapult seemed a bit much for the end of a beginner's class, I think a comb might have worked better.

    ANy other comments?
    'twere the same hereabouts.

    But H always inserts an In and Out as an introduction to the Basket, which I feel does aid the transition.

    Personally I do use the shoulder slide quite a lot (it being so easy) and, whilst I pay little attention to that right arm, it must be moving in such a way as to connect with the lady's right as the turn completes. One hopes; in a stylish way ;-) What I found interesting in the following freestyle is that I usually chose to do either a Yo Yo or a Hatchback after a shoulder slide. In both cases I was conscious of leaving my left hand at the right shoulder so that, as I led the following move by taking my right hand to the left shoulder I was, for a moment, in the curious position of having my arms crossed in front of my chest. Is that a style point or sheer incompetence ?

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    Lovely Moderator ducasi's Avatar
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    Re: This week's routine?

    We had a different routine at JJ's tonight ending with a Ceroc Spin, and I think starting with a First Move... Hmm.. I think there was also a Yo-Yo and a Shoulder Slide in their somewhere...

    I guess it must have been: FM, SS, YY, CS.

    I believe that each routine has a number that corresponds to a routine of the Ceroc Beginner's DVD.

    As for the shoulder slide... It's a nice "other way" of getting from your left to your right... And when you've only got 6 or 7 moves figured out, having a few choices is a good thing!

    I don't think I use the move much, though I do use a right-handed variant which is good for switching from right to left...
    Let your mind go and your body will follow. – Steve Martin, LA Story

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    Registered User Dizzy's Avatar
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    Re: This week's routine?

    That's different from what I was taught tonight at ISH.

    The routine I had was: Shoulder Slide, Octopus, Man-Spin, Ceroc-Spin.

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    Lovely Moderator ducasi's Avatar
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    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dizzy View Post
    That's different from what I was taught tonight at ISH.

    The routine I had was: Shoulder Slide, Octopus, Man-Spin, Ceroc-Spin.
    Shocking! Has someone told Ceroc HQ?!?!
    Let your mind go and your body will follow. – Steve Martin, LA Story

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    Re: This week's routine?

    Interesting.

    In Culter tonight, I think that we had first move, man spin, something, and finished with an octopus.

    I can't really remember what the 3rd move was, but I was paying more attention to my laptop than the class really

    That's 3 different variations already for the same night!

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    Registered User Whitebeard's Avatar
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    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by ducasi View Post

    I don't think I use the move much, though I do use a right-handed variant which is good for switching from right to left...
    Funny, strange, I quite often do that though it's never been taught.

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    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: This week's routine?

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidY View Post
    Yes we had that routine, but with an In-and-Out between the Armjive Swizzle and the Basket
    You altered the Sacred Text?
    BURN HIM!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidY View Post
    We also had the "without return in-between" variant...
    Ah, well, err, the return may have been added in at the suggestion of, umm, someone, whoe felt that it flowed better that way. Please don't burn me...

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidY View Post
    But maybe not with an In-and-Out (including the semi-circle/bouncing motion)
    Yeah, that seems a bit weird - I'd have thought that the two double-handed moves were best taught without a break in between.

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidY View Post
    But isn't it better to stick the hard move at the end rather than at the beginning? If people struggle with the first move in a routine, then their chances of stringing the rest together are greatly reduced, even if they're easy moves.
    I don't think so - because you'll have less time to practise the difficult move. If you learn the tough one at the start, then you'll be able to practise it every time you do the whole routine, so you have a better chance of getting it - at least, that's what I found. Sometimes a move only clicks when you've done it a certain number of times.

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