Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 31

Thread: Dangerous moves w/o asking. Wot do u do?

  1. #1
    Registered User Patrick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Wells in Somerset
    Posts
    360
    Rep Power
    9

    Dangerous moves w/o asking. Wot do u do?

    I guess we should all know you don't do tricky drops and lifts without asking beforehand, but what's the limit, and what do you do if someone exceeds it?

    I have a dance partner who is a relative beginner. Last night someone did an ambitious move with her without asking, and strained her back (as far as I can tell, the cliffhanger airstep as in the Ceroc logo). We are just about to start practising today for a competition... She thought about telling him he should have asked, but didn't. Someone also hugged her so hard she strained her neck.

    Strictly speaking, its none of my business, but I feel a little responsible as other men have probably seen us practicing ambitious moves together and maybe assume its OK? I have deliberately avoided trying moves like the cliffhanger with her as I know her back is not strong.

    What should I do? What should my partner do?

    (serious question, this is not a joke)

  2. #2
    Commercial Operator
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    ascot
    Posts
    815
    Rep Power
    11

    Re: Dangerous moves w/o asking. Wot do u do?

    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick View Post
    I guess we should all know you don't do tricky drops and lifts without asking beforehand, but what's the limit, and what do you do if someone exceeds it?

    I have a dance partner who is a relative beginner. Last night someone did an ambitious move with her without asking, and strained her back (as far as I can tell, the cliffhanger airstep as in the Ceroc logo). We are just about to start practising today for a competition... She thought about telling him he should have asked, but didn't. Someone also hugged her so hard she strained her neck.

    Strictly speaking, its none of my business, but I feel a little responsible as other men have probably seen us practicing ambitious moves together and maybe assume its OK? I have deliberately avoided trying moves like the cliffhanger with her as I know her back is not strong.

    What should I do? What should my partner do?

    (serious question, this is not a joke)
    Try some gentle streching before you practice this should be over a half our period so you are warm before you start.

    Keeping your back straight and not allowing arching would also help

    I would suggest talking to david B or Lilly B for the best advice.


    They proberbly might suggest resting for a few days to let your partners back recover.

  3. #3
    Commercial Operator
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Northeastern Parts
    Posts
    5,221
    Rep Power
    14

    Re: Dangerous moves w/o asking. Wot do u do?

    Always a hard one.
    Hard and fast rules, at least one of which he evidently broke...

    No arials ever without previous discussion with your partner.
    No arials ever on a social floor (there's some debate about virtually empty social floors, but as a general thing, it holds true)

    He needs to be told - if he isn't, he'll keep doing it to other people - he especially needs to be told that he's injured someone. This isn't to make him feel guilty - it's just to make him aware.

    Definitely have a word with some teachers - for a lot of moves, there's ways a follower can block them entirely, if she doesn't want to be led into them (unfortunately, that doesn't hold true for everything). Well worth looking into.

    Oh - and she should maybe think about things like yoga, or pilates, if she doesn't already. I do pilates myself, and the benefits it's had for my back (I have a weak back also) have been amazing.

  4. #4
    Registered User Twirly's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    SE London
    Posts
    4,204
    Rep Power
    11

    Re: Dangerous moves w/o asking. Wot do u do?

    If she feels she can't mention it to him, ask one of the taxi dancers to have a quiet word, or get the teacher to make a general announcement in the class. The latter would be good to serve as a reminder to everyone, and would have the advantage of making the point without singling him out or getting into a confrontation.

    Depending on how bad her back is, she might want to consider seeing a chirpractor or physio as well, particularly if you are going in for a competition. (And good luck btw!)

  5. #5
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Sunny KSA :/
    Posts
    3,383
    Rep Power
    10

    Re: Dangerous moves w/o asking. Wot do u do?

    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick View Post
    I have a dance partner who is a relative beginner. Last night someone did an ambitious move with her without asking, and strained her back (as far as I can tell, the cliffhanger airstep as in the Ceroc logo). We are just about to start practising today for a competition... She thought about telling him he should have asked, but didn't. Someone also hugged her so hard she strained her neck.
    a hug strained her neck?!?! She sounds like a fragile one.


    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick View Post
    I guess we should all know you don't do tricky drops and lifts without asking beforehand, but what's the limit, and what do you do if someone exceeds it?
    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick View Post
    Strictly speaking, its none of my business, but I feel a little responsible as other men have probably seen us practicing ambitious moves together and maybe assume its OK? I have deliberately avoided trying moves like the cliffhanger with her as I know her back is not strong.

    What should I do? What should my partner do?
    the difficulty with this is what is an ambitious move – that is a very large variable – the move in the ceroc logo – looks to me like a move that in Aus is called a Hanger and is considered a baby/beginner aerial and when done correctly by both parties puts no strain on the either parties back. One person’s ambitious move is another’s bread and butter – if a lead asked me are you happy to do ambitious moves I would be rather confused as to what he wants.

    If a girl doesn’t want to do dips/drops at all then she should inform the lead at the commencement of the dance – this has worked for me, haven’t had to do it often but when injured or not 100% would only do those sorts of moves with my dance partner.

    An issue that I see for leads in the UK doing dips/drops/small lifts/aerials with unfamiliar partners is that as these sorts of moves are not taught particularly often many girls don’t know basic technique for them and therefore respond inappropriately and there is an increased risk of injury to both parties

    Not really any advice so far so here goes – sounds like she should probably say no dips/drops/lets/aerials to dance partners she’s not familiar with and yes if a lead is dancing with an unfamiliar or beginner especially a beginner actually he shouldn’t be pulling moves that require prior skill knowledge

    Specific to your partner – if her back and neck are so fragile that a hug can cause strain it may be a good idea if she did some training to strengthen her core/back/neck muscles – my choice would be pilates, yoga is also good for this as well

  6. #6
    Registered User Patrick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Wells in Somerset
    Posts
    360
    Rep Power
    9

    Re: Dangerous moves w/o asking. Wot do u do?

    [QUOTE=Yliander;273482]a hug strained her neck?!?! She sounds like a fragile one.

    Well I saw the post-dance hug - it was very vigorous, so I assumed she knew him well. Actually she had never met him so it was completely inappropriate.

    She said perhaps she should wear a badge saying "Fragile, handle with care", but I don't think she should need to really. But yes, she has unidentified back and neck problems which are easily triggered.

  7. #7
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Sunny KSA :/
    Posts
    3,383
    Rep Power
    10

    Re: Dangerous moves w/o asking. Wot do u do?

    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick View Post
    Well I saw the post-dance hug - it was very vigorous, so I assumed she knew him well. Actually she had never met him so it was completely inappropriate.

    She said perhaps she should wear a badge saying "Fragile, handle with care", but I don't think she should need to really. But yes, she has unidentified back and neck problems which are easily triggered.
    to be injured by even a very vigorous makes her fragile to me.

    I sufferfrom neck problems that used to be easily tiggered strengthing work did wonders on this - IMHO your dance partners best defence is to strengthen her neck and back so they are less easily triggered

    especailly as you two are wanting to get into obviously more complicated moves many of which require a fare bit of stength from the follow

  8. #8
    Registered User David Franklin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    London
    Posts
    3,426
    Rep Power
    14

    Re: Dangerous moves w/o asking. Wot do u do?

    Quote Originally Posted by Yliander View Post
    to be injured by even a very vigorous makes her fragile to me.

    I sufferfrom neck problems that used to be easily tiggered strengthing work did wonders on this - IMHO your dance partners best defence is to strengthen her neck and back so they are less easily triggered
    In my experience, although strengthening is a good thing, it only really helps if you have time to "tense" the muscles - if you're not expecting the move (or hug!) to be violent, it's still quite easy to aggravate things, particularly if you're already carrying an injury elsewhere in your spine.

    And although I agree strengthening is usually going to help, it may well be there's an underlying problem that is always going to be there. I've had neck/shoulder problems for years - I saw physios and did all manner of stretching and strengthening - it helped somewhat, but it was never "right" and every now and then it would "go" again. It turns out I have a bit of bone sticking out of one of my discs, and the only true fix is surgery.

  9. #9
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Location
    Cruden Bay (Aberde
    Posts
    7,053
    Rep Power
    13

    Re: Dangerous moves w/o asking. Wot do u do?

    Can a lead lead this move without the appropriate cooperation (and knowledge) from the follower?

    If the follower knew what was coming up, why go into it?

  10. #10
    Registered User El Salsero Gringo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    London
    Posts
    4,881
    Rep Power
    12

    Re: Dangerous moves w/o asking. Wot do u do?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gadget View Post
    Can a lead lead this move without the appropriate cooperation (and knowledge) from the follower?

    If the follower knew what was coming up, why go into it?
    The leader can try - and then the follower can react badly, or late. Ouch.

  11. #11
    Commercial Operator
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Northeastern Parts
    Posts
    5,221
    Rep Power
    14

    Re: Dangerous moves w/o asking. Wot do u do?

    Quote Originally Posted by El Salsero Gringo View Post
    The leader can try - and then the follower can react badly, or late. Ouch.


    Blocking unwelcome moves takes experience and practice. Not always easy.

  12. #12
    Fake ID to promote Lindsay's events Dorothy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Dunfermline
    Posts
    141
    Rep Power
    0

    Re: Dangerous moves w/o asking. Wot do u do?

    I don't think you men out there should ever assume the lady is willing and able to partake in anything but safe, tried & tested Ceroc moves. If we could reverse roles and throw men into all sorts of lunges, leans and dips, maybe you'd realise how painful it can be! I am not a fan of dangerous moves, but I like to admire them from afar

  13. #13
    Commercial Operator
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Northeastern Parts
    Posts
    5,221
    Rep Power
    14

    Re: Dangerous moves w/o asking. Wot do u do?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dorothy View Post
    I don't think you men out there should ever assume the lady is willing and able to partake in anything but safe, tried & tested Ceroc moves.
    To be completely honest, I've learned not even to assume that much

  14. #14
    Registered User marty_baby's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Sunny Bristol!
    Posts
    575
    Rep Power
    10

    Re: Dangerous moves w/o asking. Wot do u do?

    Quote Originally Posted by Yliander View Post

    to be injured by even a very vigorous makes her fragile to me.

    Hi Patrick,

    I'd have to agree with Y'der on this one. Dancing is physically demanding, and competition dancing even more so.



    But hey, its not all bad:

    1. You have found a nice dance partner, and you are taking her under your wing - thats the nice side of competiting.

    2. Sounds like she really likes to dance. This Competition prep has highlighted weaknesses, which she can work on.

    3. Working on the weakness will improve the whole enjoyment of her dancing - both in competition AND social dancing. It will also act as prevention to injuries for the future.



    Best of luck with Scotland guys!

    Martin

  15. #15
    Registered User David Franklin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    London
    Posts
    3,426
    Rep Power
    14

    Re: Dangerous moves w/o asking. Wot do u do?

    Quote Originally Posted by marty_baby View Post
    I'd have to agree with Y'der on this one. Dancing is physically demanding, and competition dancing even more so.
    Did I miss something? It didn't sound like it was the competition dancing was causing any problems - it was some idiot throwing his partner into an aerial without asking. (Yes, the hug sounds a bit more unusual, but from personal experience, once you've got one injury, it doesn't take much to pull something related).

    Yes you want to be fit for competition dancing, but you also want to be smart. You don't have to do moves that aggravate your anatomical frailties, after all.

  16. #16
    Registered User marty_baby's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Sunny Bristol!
    Posts
    575
    Rep Power
    10

    Re: Dangerous moves w/o asking. Wot do u do?

    Quote Originally Posted by David Franklin View Post
    Did I miss something? It didn't sound like it was the competition dancing was causing any problems - it was some idiot throwing his partner into an aerial without asking. (Yes, the hug sounds a bit more unusual, but from personal experience, once you've got one injury, it doesn't take much to pull something related).

    Yes you want to be fit for competition dancing, but you also want to be smart. You don't have to do moves that aggravate your anatomical frailties, after all.


    Hi DF,

    I didn't say competition dancing was causing the problems.

    Perhaps I should add a bit to my earlier post.....
    "....I'd have to agree with Y'der on this one. Dancing is physically demanding, and competition dancing even more so.... If a Dance partner is more fragile than average - that needs to be taken into account. That is not a bad thing, everyone is different - but its just a factor to be put into the Competiton prep, and choice of moves."


    Best Wishes
    Martin

  17. #17
    The Oracle
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Posts
    2,263
    Rep Power
    13

    Re: Dangerous moves w/o asking. Wot do u do?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gadget View Post
    Can a lead lead this move without the appropriate cooperation (and knowledge) from the follower?

    If the follower knew what was coming up, why go into it?
    You can't 'lead' the lady to do something like this (by my definition of leading anyway.)

    But you can physically 'make' the lady do moves like this quite easily.

    There are some people who appear to define leading as anything you can make the lady do without telling her in advance.

  18. #18
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Worcester, UK
    Posts
    4,157
    Rep Power
    12

    Re: Dangerous moves w/o asking. Wot do u do?

    If she has "unidentified back and neck problems which are easily triggered" then I'd recommend that when dancing with someone new, she states "I have a bad back and neck, so please treat me gently", or something similar.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dorothy View Post
    If we could reverse roles and throw men into all sorts of lunges, leans and dips, maybe you'd realise how painful it can be!
    We can. I find it hard to imagine a painful lean, though. Could you provide a little more info?

  19. #19
    The Oracle
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Posts
    2,263
    Rep Power
    13

    Re: Dangerous moves w/o asking. Wot do u do?

    Quote Originally Posted by MartinHarper View Post
    I find it hard to imagine a painful lean, though.
    Put the lady into a sway, with her hand behind her back. Now make her lean backwards, but keep her hand at the same height.

  20. #20
    Registered User Tessalicious's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Kentish Town
    Posts
    1,650
    Rep Power
    11

    Re: Dangerous moves w/o asking. Wot do u do?

    Quote Originally Posted by MartinHarper View Post
    We can. I find it hard to imagine a painful lean, though. Could you provide a little more info?
    Or do a simple comb lean, but bring your hips out of contact with the lady's so there is no support for the middle part of her body. Too many guys do this because this is taught as an easy lean and so without much technical detail, and it bloody hurts.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Dice Dancing - it's a dangerous game...
    By Get a grip in forum Let's talk about dance
    Replies: 26
    Last Post: 14th-September-2006, 11:08 AM
  2. Online Workshop: Moves, moves, moves
    By Gadget in forum Intermediate Corner
    Replies: 25
    Last Post: 21st-March-2005, 01:56 PM
  3. Happy Birthday Dangerous Curves!
    By Lynn in forum Happy Birthday!
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 24th-September-2004, 02:30 AM
  4. Dangerous moves?
    By Gus in forum Intermediate Corner
    Replies: 51
    Last Post: 18th-October-2002, 01:02 AM

Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •