The Sleaze Thing

[Divissima]

Impertinent Steve wrote:So which one of you is going to be inappropriate??

Steve

Please go away, I'm very important and am trying to work.....

[Franck]

Originally posted by TheTramp
So which one of you is going to be inappropriate??

Well me obviously

I can't imagine Divissima behaving in an inapropriate manner (though I am sure I would not *really* mind but TwK might.. )

Franck

[Franck]

Originally posted by Stuart M
Well, Franck, I considered it only polite to exchange names afterward...

I usually consider it polite to exchange names beforehand

Franck.

[Divissima]

The fiendish Franck wrote:I can't imagine Divissima behaving in an inapropriate manner (though I am sure I would not *really* mind but TwK might.. )

No indeed, I am the picture of innocence TwK is likely to be otherwise engaged dancing in an outrageous flirtatious yet sparkling fashion with another female - so I say, the more inappropriate the better!

[TheTramp]

Originally posted by Divissima
Please go away, I'm very important and am trying to work.....

You see the little 'x' in the right hand top corner of your screen Divi

Steve

PS. When did you become important??

[Basil Brush (Forum Plant)]

Originally posted by Gadget
I thought that's what you should do on every dance?

No Gadget- the point was it's different with every partner. Keep trying....

[Twinkle Toes]

LOL

Steve,

that is definitely your best avatar yet - very amusing.

TT

[Gadget]

Originally posted by Basil Brush
No Gadget- the point was it's different with every partner. Keep trying....

Different, yes; but still should be slightly flirtatious(sp?) no matter who your partner is

[TheTramp]

Originally posted by Twinkle Toes
LOL

Steve,

that is definitely your best avatar yet - very amusing.

TT

Thanks TT. Glad you like it.

Trying to get into the Scottish mindset. My first set of bagpipes are already on order.

I just pity you all when I get my kilt!!

Steve

[TheTramp]

Incidentally, before she gets a chance, I should post that I had several (very enjoyable) dances with Divissima tonight. During which time I was totally inappropriate.

But she seemed to enjoy it :sorry

Steve

[Twinkle Toes]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by TheTramp
My first set of bagpipes are already on order.

I just pity you all when I get my kilt!!

Steve

oh noooo .......

only kiddin big yin ! I'm sure you'll suit it. But will you ever be a true Scotsman ?

.... mmmm ....... must get that camera of mine fixed !

TT

[TheTramp]

Originally posted by Twinkle Toes
only kiddin big yin ! I'm sure you'll suit it. But will you ever be a true Scotsman ?

.... mmmm ....... must get that camera of mine fixed !

TT

Trust me. 1 - You don't wanna know. 2 - You never wanna be in the position of finding out, and. 3 - You definitely don't want your camera fixed!!

Steve

[Basil Brush (Forum Plant)]

Originally posted by Gadget
Different, yes; but still should be slightly flirtatious(sp?) no matter who your partner is

That's the point- different - well done- at last!

[Bill]

Originally posted by Aleks
As I have already said, I don't even notice it any more. I'm far too busy dancing AND I don't want to stop wearing low cut t-shirts/dresses - it's far too hot and sweaty at Marco's to cover up (so I keep telling Luca) and I'm sure you'll agree DD!

well it was last night ( see Scot's new thread !)......... and I didn't look until I had permission

and a nice top it was too Aleks... :sorry

[Wendy]

Isn't is amazing how a topic which only involves 1 % of dancers can "inspire" such discourse !!!

We were having a chat today at a practice and thought I'd share some of the wise words with you all (Forgive me team if it looks like I'm claiming this wisdom as my own although secretly I'd be only too pleased if everyone thought the clever bits were from me and the less clever bits were Graham's idea )

To me CEROC is acting. The dancers, one leading and one following, are in a 4-minute play with the music providing the narrative, the direction, the scenery and all that stuff. A good actor aims to recreate emotions in a variery of roles right ? So in the same way a dancer aims to interpret the emotions in the music and communicate this with their partner. (I'm still on topic believe me - although I am taking bookings for my next "Way Off Topic" workshop )

Anyway. Today we had a revelation about the sleaze thing. When non sleazy people dance they are acting. They are acting passionate or funky or flirty or sexy or skippy or whatever and they can do this with any other dancer even with people of the same sex !!! (I'm talking about straight people here and hope not to offend anyone in the process.. ) Today I danced with several girls and it was just as magical as if I'd been dancing with a boy (even better sometimes but I won't name names ). I was able to look passionately into their eyes and flirt and do all that stuff cos it's acting. The sleaze people are not acting. This is the difference. They don't practise at being better dancers (to lead or follow better), they don't go to workshops (to learn about footwork or musicality) and they churn out the same old moves (cos they clearly ignore what's going on in the class). Their acting-reality boundary is fuzzy and they cross the line.

The time thing. A dance lasts 4 minutes or so. It is the music, therefore, that dictates the length of the exchange, not the dancers themselves. In real life, on the other hand (or on the forum hee hee) you can talk to people as long as you like (well I do !!!). I can only conclude that this is a good thing cos it helps us all to keep our boundaries clear. If I danced 12 records in a row with someone I'd probably start to really feel the emotions I'd only been acting out (and after 3/4 bluesy tracks... jeez.... !!!)
and that's probably why actors often fall in love with their onscreen partner and then it all goes sour in the real world. I wouldn't want to dance with my favourite dancers, even my BTC team, more than 2 dances in a row (maybe 3 at a push) , although I'd be happy to dance with them loads of times throughout the night especially ones I really know. Sleazy people do this with people they do not know.

Conclusion : Sleazy dancers aren't acting - the other 99% of us are (even if it's hard sometimes cos some of you are gorgeous and charming and everything.... )

Wxxx

[newby]

Wendy said
They are acting passionate or funky or flirty or sexy or skippy or whatever and they can do this with any other dancer even with people of the same sex !!! (I'm talking about straight people here and hope not to offend anyone in the process.. )

Wendy, as a female beginner who struggles with male (lead?) beginners, I have really enjoyed the few dances I've had with you as my partner - you've obviously been where I am (I can't get this!) and you make it easy fo us beginners. Thank you - I will persevere - I will survive!

But I don't know everyone and I have felt uncomfortable on several occasions, too touchy, too thrusting.

You're right - it is all a pretence, acting, a bit of innocent fun - but only if your in on the joke - and as a newby, I don't know who is fun ( I know you are!) and who's taking advantage. What you said is so right, but it will be a while until I can separate the 1% who are taking advantage from the 99% innocent!

[Wendy]

Originally posted by newby
I will survive!

Hi newby - Don't know who you are ???? But yes you will and you will love it !!!! We'll get Franck or Robert or Curtain to play Gloria Gaynor just for you !!!!

But I don't know everyone and I have felt uncomfortable on several occasions, too touchy, too thrusting.

That's a pity - but go with your feelings, they are important. You will find the people who you can trust and relax with and the others ?? ... well... we're all working on that as you can see from this thread !!! I think this is probably the most important discussion we have had on the forum. And judging from the response I can only assume I am not alone in thinking that. I was going to bring this up myself but didn't have the guts !!!! (Thanks again Sheena - that's why you are the Head Girl and I'm just a first year smoking behind the bike shed...)

I don't know who is fun ... and who is taking advantage. What you said is so right, but it will be a while until I can separate the 1% who are taking advantage from the 99% innocent!

I still don't get it !!! I am actually very trusting and quite naive and I think that's why I get so angry when I discover someone like Glasgow's Mr Sleaze. I even invited him to my birthday party last year !!! and it's only in the last couple of months that I have felt uncomfortable dancing with him !!! And I'm still practising saying "No thanks" in my head before I actuallyt say it out loud !!!

Wxxx

PS And thanks for all your kind words

[Stuart M]

Originally posted by Wendy
Anyway. Today we had a revelation about the sleaze thing. When non sleazy people dance they are acting. They are acting passionate or funky or flirty or sexy or skippy or whatever and they can do this with any other dancer even with people of the same sex !!!

I can't agree entirely, Wendy - you're not seriously suggesting that when a real couple are dancing, it's all an act. FC and her man James, for instance, or even yourself and Graham...

And by extension, people can "click" on the dancefloor and it can end up as more than a 5-minute play. Dance is part of the old courtship ritual, after all.

My own view is that (particularly as a bloke) you shouldn't get passionate or flirty or sexy, unless you know the other person at some level. Or, alternately, if you can manage a "dialogue" with the other person early in the dance, which shows that they want to play as well .

Sleazy dancers don't bother with that early dialog, they simply assume the other person is willing to take part in/be subjected to their style and go for it.

And now, time to get something interesting together for that 200th post...

[Wendy]

Originally posted by Stuart M
I can't agree entirely, Wendy - you're not seriously suggesting that when a real couple are dancing, it's all an act. FC and her man James, for instance, or even yourself and Graham...

Great you agree a little though.. that must be a first Also great you disagree cos this is such a personal and subjective thing that I wouldn't expect anyone to share my views totally and that makes it all the more interesting.

Funnily enough I find it hardest to flirt with Graham than I do with almost anyone else and that includes girls !! And that's because it would feel "real". Can't talk for Melanie and James of course... but I know that when I dance with James there is a magical connection even although in the real world he would never look twice at me cos he'd think I was his granny

Of course people can "click" - I "click" lots of times and that's an amazing buzz. "Is this for real ?...is it not ?....do I really feel this... is he ???" Afterall, physically we are very close to another human being so our brain must be saying .. "hey last time I was as close as this to a man I was wearing nothing more than a hint of Mitsouko". (Luckily the music is a kind of chaperone and only lasts 4 minutes !) and that's why it can be very hard for some of you guys to dance with another man perhaps ??????..... As I said in my other post, actors often fall in love with their onsceen partner and it must happen all the time at CEROC cos we are not trained dancers or actors who can skip in and out of character at a whim and do the mental gymnastics not to "react" shall we say.

I'd be fascinated to know how people feel when they dance with someone after they have split up or if they've had a fight in the car on the way to CEROC.....?????

Anyway... your 199th post was a great one... looking forward to 200 !! And by the time you get to 600 you might start to let the quality slip a little.... so who cares - noone is really out there right ???

And some of us might even be "acting" a little on the forum. I mean some people think I am bolshy and opinionated and a bit of a loud mouth when we all know I am just a shy wee innocent fragile poppet in reality .....

Wx

[Chicklet]

Wendy and Stuart,

I agree with both of you!!!!!!

It's a great place for acting up - I saw a few raised eyebrows at Roy and I with some of our playing up on Saturday night but at no time did it feel sleazy just a hell of a lot of fun!

I have decided in my head always to assume that it's acting untill and unless I know for sure otherwise but Wendy I know what you mean with the thrill of the is this or isn't it thing cos Stuart is absolutely right that dancing is part of the courtship ritual and if you think about it - if some of the closeness that comes about during Ceroc nights came about anywhere ELSE, (dancing or otherwise) you might be more likely to think / know that it was for real. - Hope that makes sense!!

Also, we are all only human and it is basic human nature to be FLATTERED that someone wants to get close isn't it? Is it possible to be flattered and abhored at the same time????

C


And you are also correct about acting on the Forum - I'm sure there are plenty that think I'm a complete tart - all t*ts and teeth when actually I'm really a very strictly brought up tame little accountant type.


Do hope FC and/or James come on and give us a view from the couples connecting point of view....but then I won't hold my breath cos they're probably too busy doing it rather than reading about it here!!! Lucky things!!!