Page 3 of 6 FirstFirst 123456 LastLast
Results 41 to 60 of 115

Thread: Are 'Better' dancers an 'Elite'

  1. #41
    Lovely Moderator ducasi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Glasgow
    Posts
    10,015
    Rep Power
    14

    Re: Are 'Better' dancers an 'Elite'

    Quote Originally Posted by Gadget
    It's a social gathering. It has it's own sub-set of social rules and etiquette.
    Yep Gadget, I think this is the key thing that makes UP's post wrong.

    Everywhere you go there are social rules which tell you what you should and shouldn't be doing.

    That said, I don't think anyone should feel obliged to dance with beginners if they don't want to. But it's nice if you do.
    Let your mind go and your body will follow. – Steve Martin, LA Story

  2. #42
    Registered User KatieR's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Somewhere dark
    Posts
    1,271
    Rep Power
    10

    Re: Are 'Better' dancers an 'Elite'

    Quote Originally Posted by ducasi
    Yep Gadget, I think this is the key thing that makes UP's post wrong.
    This above statement is the kind of thing that drives us all crazy.... how can one person be wrong and one person be right..?? We are all very different creatures with very different opinions.

    I on one hand agree with UP, but it is my OPINION. Im not going to go around saying, well you must be wrong. I respect the fact that you have an opinion and it is different to mine.

    Ive said it before and Ill say it again.. Live and let live.

    4634 fluffy bunnies.... hurumph.

  3. #43
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    bedford
    Posts
    4,899
    Rep Power
    13

    Re: Are 'Better' dancers an 'Elite'

    IMO UP's suberbly expressed post is quite right, if his argument is directed at dancers at a dance. Gadget et al are also quite right for the etiquette at a dance class. If there is a lesson it is a dance class, a place where people go to learn how to dance and learn how to dance better. If that lesson is a beginners lesson, then it is an event put on for the benefit of non-dancers wanting to learn. It should not be usurped by dancers demanding more advanced lessons and more advanced music. IMO the elite should seek their own special place for those things.
    At the Ceroc classes I go to the Taxi Dancers have the last half hour off. I think that it is fair to assume that that half-hour is not aimed at beginners, and the dancers have a right to make demands on that time.

  4. #44
    Commercial Operator
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Sussex by the Sea
    Posts
    9,276
    Rep Power
    15

    Re: Are 'Better' dancers an 'Elite'

    Quote Originally Posted by El Salsero Gringo
    If you're happy with the way you feel about dancing with "the common masses" - or even if you're just happy using that phrase - who on earth cares if someone gives you some label?

    Why are you letting the way someone else feels about you become *your* problem?
    ESG seems intent on getting Forumites onto his therapist's couch. My own opinion is that in this instance he's got nothing to add but doesn't like the tone Gus has used.

    Now, students, what does this observation tell us about the way Mr Gringo views the world? Does he see people as his equals to debate with or does he see himself as a far cleverer observer and commentator? Or does Mr Gringo think he's better than Gus? And, finally, why does Mr Gringo feel the need to tell everyone what he thinks about Gus? One thousand words by next Tuesday ...

  5. #45
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Worcester, UK
    Posts
    4,157
    Rep Power
    12

    Re: Are 'Better' dancers an 'Elite'

    Quote Originally Posted by under par
    Why do we keep hearing "I went to this/that venue where they were not very friendly. or they were cliquey"
    People go to different venues, and sometimes they post their impressions on this forum. Some venues have better dancers. Some have more pop music. Some are more cliquey. Some have a faster dancefloor. Some have a "no row". Some have better teachers. Wouldn't it be dull if all venues were the same?

    Quote Originally Posted by under par
    join in as best you can
    I think that's good advice. If I go to a venue where the music is not really to my taste, I'll join in as best I can. If I go to a venue where most dancers are much better than me, I'll join in as best I can. If I go to a venue that is very cliquey and unwelcoming, I'll join in as best I can. I'm a big boy - I can cope.

    Quote Originally Posted by under par
    Why don't you keep your poor perceptions to yourself ....just for change!
    I think it's inevitable, and desirable, that dancers (sorry, "paying customers") will talk to each other about different venues, and what they each liked and didn't like, and that will include thoughts about the culture of the place. I don't see why this type of discussion should be barred.

  6. #46
    Registered User stewart38's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Ambrosden it gets
    Posts
    7,480
    Rep Power
    13

    Re: Are 'Better' dancers an 'Elite'

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy McGregor

    Now, students, what does this observation tell us about the way Mr Gringo views the world? Does he see people as his equals to debate with or does he see himself as a far cleverer observer and commentator? Or does Mr Gringo think he's better than Gus? And, finally, why does Mr Gringo feel the need to tell everyone what he thinks about Gus? One thousand words by next Tuesday ...
    If were all equals then I guess we are all never going to agree with each other because we will all have our own views on the TRUTH or FACT

    Therefore old wise one where do i go to find the oracle that gives me the TRUTH and or FACTS

    I did think it was Mr Gringo ,if im wrong where do I look for it

  7. #47
    TiggsTours
    Guest

    Re: Are 'Better' dancers an 'Elite'

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy McGregor
    ESG seems intent on getting Forumites onto his therapist's couch. My own opinion is that in this instance he's got nothing to add but doesn't like the tone Gus has used.

    Now, students, what does this observation tell us about the way Mr Gringo views the world? Does he see people as his equals to debate with or does he see himself as a far cleverer observer and commentator? Or does Mr Gringo think he's better than Gus? And, finally, why does Mr Gringo feel the need to tell everyone what he thinks about Gus? One thousand words by next Tuesday ...
    Whereas Mr McGregor, on the other hand, seems to find it necessary to point out to the world, at every opportunity, every time ESG, and a select few others, say anything at all that he doesn't agree with, in a highly patronising fashion, and seems desperate to highlight all their flaws for the world to see. What does this say about him? I wonder.

  8. #48
    Commercial Operator
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Sussex by the Sea
    Posts
    9,276
    Rep Power
    15

    Re: Are 'Better' dancers an 'Elite'

    Quote Originally Posted by TiggsTours
    You know, its funny, when I first started dancing there were a number of really good dancers around who now would be (or even are) called hotshots or elitist by a number of people on this forum.

    These people always had time to dance with me, the beginner, but still preferred dancing with people of the same standard, and we didn't have the added benfit of taxi dancers then, so we relied on these people.
    I was starting dancing at around the same time as TT and in the same venue. I had a very different take on the situation. There was a friendly class on a Monday and a Tuesday class packed with hotshots and quite a few of them turned me down when I asked them for a dance

    I think I know why...

    Andy McGregor - Male beginner, 40, short, balding, knows 3/4 moves and does them badly with little regard for the beat.

    Amanda (not yet Tiggs Tours) - Very pretty, vivacious young blonde.

    Now why I got turned down by the good women and she got asked to dance by the good guys is a mystery to me But, I learned from this situation: I started wearing blonde wigs and being pretty

  9. #49
    TiggsTours
    Guest

    Re: Are 'Better' dancers an 'Elite'

    Quote Originally Posted by Gadget
    The following is not so much bout the views put forward, but the language used in putting them forward....
    So by implication, you don't want to dance with those 8 dancers of lesser ability. You feel you have to. An obligation to be fulfilled so you can justify selecting the good dancers you want to dance with. What happens with the nineth? "Sorry, I've had my quota of poor dancers this evening..."

    owes it to them? People are there to dance. No matter their ability to 'hear' the music, interperate it, make a connection, hold a frame, or do moves. To have "People you really want to" dance with, implys to me that there are people you really don't want to dance with. And these people are beginners and people of a lesser ability.
    The term "Hot Shot" or "Elitist" to me is about attitude. This attitude. The "I suppose I will come down to your level and dance with you if I must" attitude. The "I will dance with you, but I really don't want to" attitude.

    I think it must be something about the mentality: "Willing" to dance with you? Dancing should not be a chore. Not even with partners who are challenging.

    Ablility only comes into the equation if you think that the only challenge is one of music. Dancing is a three way connection - you, your partner and the music. Each one has it's own set of difficulties to overcome and it's own techniques to learn.

    They have done it to you, so you should just do it back. Revenge. Rubbing salt in the wounds. Cruel, unforgiving and simply nasty.
    If they say no, then that's their loss. Move on. Ask them again next week.
    Putting words in to my mouth, somewhat, aren't we?

    I said "want" maybe I should have said "would prefer to" lets not split hairs here! Would I rather dance with someone who's been dancing 3 weeks & will do the same 4 moves over and over again, badly, and not in time to the music, whilst struggling to remember what else he's learnt, or, would I prefer to dance with someone who is going to lead me smoothly in such a way that I don't even know what moves he's doing, while I glide effortlessly around the floor as if dancing on air? I'm not even going to begin to justify my preferences! Why should I?

    That does not mean I do not enjoy dancing with beginners, I do, why else would I have chosen to have the fact I do it stamped across my chest on a none to stylish t-shirt once a fortnight for the last 3 and half years?! I just enjoy dancing with the second option more!

    I really like vanilla ice cream, but I prefer Haagan Daz Baileys ice cream!

  10. #50
    Commercial Operator
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Sussex by the Sea
    Posts
    9,276
    Rep Power
    15

    Re: Are 'Better' dancers an 'Elite'

    Quote Originally Posted by stewart38
    If were all equals then I guess we are all never going to agree with each other because we will all have our own views on the TRUTH or FACT

    Therefore old wise one where do i go to find the oracle that gives me the TRUTH and or FACTS

    I did think it was Mr Gringo ,if im wrong where do I look for it
    D-

    Please rewrite this essay. The clues are in the questions. There is plenty of material out there about ESG so you will need to be selective to keep your essay down to 1000 words

    N.B. For TT's benefit, ESG and I get along just fine. He loves it when I talk dirty

  11. #51
    Registered User David Franklin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    London
    Posts
    3,426
    Rep Power
    14

    Re: Are 'Better' dancers an 'Elite'

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy McGregor
    Andy McGregor - Male beginner, 40, short, balding, knows 3/4 moves and does them badly with little regard for the beat.

    But, I learned from this situation: I started wearing blonde wigs and being pretty
    Sounds like a plan. When are you going to learn move number 5? (I'm not sure there's much hope on the beat thing).

  12. #52
    Commercial Operator
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Sussex by the Sea
    Posts
    9,276
    Rep Power
    15

    Re: Are 'Better' dancers an 'Elite'

    Quote Originally Posted by David Franklin
    Sounds like a plan. When are you going to learn move number 5? (I'm not sure there's much hope on the beat thing).
    Now I'm old I can't even remember the 4 moves I knew all those years ago

    Why do you think I went blonde and learnt to follow?

  13. #53
    Registered User El Salsero Gringo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    London
    Posts
    4,881
    Rep Power
    12

    Re: Are 'Better' dancers an 'Elite'

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy McGregor
    And, finally, why does Mr Gringo feel the need to tell everyone what he thinks about Gus? One thousand words by next Tuesday ...
    I don't think I've ever said what I think about Gus, and I've certainly never posted my opinion on the Forum. If I were to say what I thought of him, Andy, you, and possibly he, might be a little surprised. In any case, I have little to go on since (regretfully) he and I have never really spoken. I have however commented on his posts - good and bad - just as you and he have on mine. There's difference between commenting on what someone writes, and commenting on the person - I'm surprised you haven't spotted that.

    Quote Originally Posted by TT
    Whereas Mr McGregor, on the other hand, seems to find it necessary to point out to the world, at every opportunity, every time ESG, and a select few others, say anything at all that he doesn't agree with, in a highly patronising fashion, and seems desperate to highlight all their flaws for the world to see. What does this say about him? I wonder.
    I'm happy for Andy to hilight what he sees as my flaws, and I always listen carefully to what he has to say.

  14. #54
    Registered User stewart38's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Ambrosden it gets
    Posts
    7,480
    Rep Power
    13

    Re: Are 'Better' dancers an 'Elite'

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy McGregor
    Andy McGregor - Male beginner, 40, short, balding, knows 3/4 moves and does them badly with little regard for the beat.
    Now given on another thread you remember Nixons Assassination of 1963 the age thing is hard to believe Surely your worse then you make out ?

    What we need for MG is a new campaign

    I hear Marlboro are sponsoring the ceroc champs next year and giving out free cigarettes at the venue isnt that great

  15. #55
    TiggsTours
    Guest

    Re: Are 'Better' dancers an 'Elite'

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy McGregor
    I was starting dancing at around the same time as TT and in the same venue. I had a very different take on the situation. There was a friendly class on a Monday and a Tuesday class packed with hotshots and quite a few of them turned me down when I asked them for a dance

    I think I know why...

    Andy McGregor - Male beginner, 40, short, balding, knows 3/4 moves and does them badly with little regard for the beat.

    Amanda (not yet Tiggs Tours) - Very pretty, vivacious young blonde.

    Now why I got turned down by the good women and she got asked to dance by the good guys is a mystery to me But, I learned from this situation: I started wearing blonde wigs and being pretty
    I'd sort of say fair other than, both my parent started dancing at the same venues too. My father started at the age of 61, he loved it, he found it all very friendly, and that all the women there (young pretty ones included) were all very approachable and willing to dance with him.

    My mother on the other hand hated it, she started a year later when she too was 61, and nobody ever asked her to dance (have to say, Andy was an exception to this rule, maybe experience taught him a thing or 2), and she actually used to get flatly turned down!

    So maybe it is a case that only the young pretty girls have no trouble getting dances, and are more willing to dance with beginners? seeing as in the situations we have described, this is the only true line followed, or maybe, its all about the attitude of the individual, on both sides of the fence!

  16. #56
    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Norf Lundin
    Posts
    17,001
    Blog Entries
    1
    Rep Power
    18

    Re: Are 'Better' dancers an 'Elite'

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy McGregor
    Andy McGregor - Male beginner, 40, short, balding, knows 3/4 moves and does them badly with little regard for the beat.
    Christ, that's me now...

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy McGregor
    Now, students, what does this observation tell us about the way Mr Gringo views the world?
    Err, maybe he just thought it was funny? I know I did, I didn't think of it as a world-changing post or anything (i.e. not like all of mine, of course).

  17. #57
    Commercial Operator
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Sussex by the Sea
    Posts
    9,276
    Rep Power
    15

    Re: Are 'Better' dancers an 'Elite'

    Quote Originally Posted by El Salsero Gringo
    I don't think I've ever said what I think about Gus, and I've certainly never posted my opinion on the Forum. If I were to say what I thought of him, Andy, you, and possibly he, might be a little surprised. In any case, I have little to go on since (regretfully) he and I have never really spoken. I have however commented on his posts - good and bad - just as you and he have on mine. There's difference between commenting on what someone writes, and commenting on the person - I'm surprised you haven't spotted that.

    I'm happy for Andy to hilight what he sees as my flaws, and I always listen carefully to what he has to say.
    Welcome to the ESG show. Let's all talk about him. He loves it

    p.s. For the benefit of TT, this isn't serious. ESG and I are just indulging a little bit of light banter and mild character assasination in the absence of anything of substance to argue about. I thought we might start a debate on which foot you step back with in the first move but there's only one debating day left this week and that's a 4 day argument

  18. #58
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Worcester, UK
    Posts
    4,157
    Rep Power
    12

    Re: Are 'Better' dancers an 'Elite'

    Quote Originally Posted by TiggsTours
    So maybe it is a case that only the young pretty girls have no trouble getting dances, and are more willing to dance with beginners?
    Cause and effect?
    The dancers who encouraged me when I started are one of the reasons I try to encourage those who are starting now.

  19. #59
    Commercial Operator Gus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    York
    Posts
    5,203
    Rep Power
    13

    Re: Are 'Better' dancers an 'Elite'

    Quote Originally Posted by Gadget
    It's a fiscal thing? I've paid good money for this, therefore I can do what I like with it.
    !bzzzzzt! incorrect answer. It's a social thing. The money you pay at the door is a contribution to ensure that the venue keeps it's doors open, the teachers keep teaching and the DJs keep playing tunes.
    Hmmm .. I'd always assumed it was a business thing ... since when did Ceroc(tm) become a charity?

  20. #60
    Lovely Moderator ducasi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Glasgow
    Posts
    10,015
    Rep Power
    14

    Re: Are 'Better' dancers an 'Elite'

    Quote Originally Posted by KatieR
    This above statement is the kind of thing that drives us all crazy.... how can one person be wrong and one person be right..?? We are all very different creatures with very different opinions.

    I on one hand agree with UP, but it is my OPINION. Im not going to go around saying, well you must be wrong. I respect the fact that you have an opinion and it is different to mine.
    Expressing an opinion is one thing, but UP was making statements of fact. In my opinion, he has his facts wrong.

    I don't think that makes him a bad person.
    Let your mind go and your body will follow. – Steve Martin, LA Story

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Asking elite dancers to dance?
    By Achelous in forum Let's talk about dance
    Replies: 118
    Last Post: 28th-September-2006, 03:30 PM
  2. How many dancers are in the UK?
    By David Bailey in forum Let's talk about dance
    Replies: 34
    Last Post: 11th-October-2005, 09:11 PM
  3. Who are the best dancers?
    By sergio in forum Let's talk about dance
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: 23rd-February-2004, 06:38 PM
  4. Best Dancers
    By Dreadful Scathe in forum Chit Chat
    Replies: 64
    Last Post: 10th-February-2004, 05:49 PM
  5. Who were those dancers?
    By Paul F in forum Let's talk about dance
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 18th-January-2004, 02:44 AM

Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •