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Thread: Is it just me ...

  1. #1
    Registered User Clive Long's Avatar
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    Is it just me ...

    ... or do you find the instructions on most modern devices almost incomprehensible?

    I have taken to writing list summary labels and sticking them with transparent self-adhesive sheet (what was known as sticky-back plastic in Blue Peter of the 60's) on to almost every device I own: digital camera, portable MP3 player, 5 band programmable radio, steam-iron (it comes with a 12 page manual !!) and a timer built into a plug (6 page manual with that one).

    Oh for the days of the Light Programme, In Town Tonight and a cup of half-dissolved Horlicks.


    Clive (official M.O.G.)

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    Registered User Feelingpink's Avatar
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    Re: Is it just me ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Clive Long

    I have taken to writing list summary labels and sticking them with transparent self-adhesive sheet (what was known as sticky-back plastic in Blue Peter of the 60's) on to almost every device I own: digital camera, portable MP3 player, 5 band programmable radio, steam-iron (it comes with a 12 page manual !!) and a timer built into a plug (6 page manual with that one).
    If you're offering this as a service to householders, you'd be onto a goldmine ... fancy a change of career?

  3. #3
    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: Is it just me ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Clive Long
    ... or do you find the instructions on most modern devices almost incomprehensible?

    I have taken to writing list summary labels and sticking them with transparent self-adhesive sheet (what was known as sticky-back plastic in Blue Peter of the 60's) on to almost every device I own: digital camera, portable MP3 player, 5 band programmable radio, steam-iron (it comes with a 12 page manual !!) and a timer built into a plug (6 page manual with that one).
    It's not you.

    This "I hate the instructions" pretty much all started with the flood of Japanese-made VCRs twenty years ago. Japanese culture is such that the instructions with those were descriptive rather than proscriptive. In other words, you have a lot of complex diagrams and "how-it-fits-together" explanations, but not much on "to record a programme, do this". Combine this with the fact that, for many families, a VCR was the most complex piece of machinery they'd ever used, and you get an instant bad rep, which the industry has spent 20 years trying to fix...

    Added to this, now most device instructions are written as cheaply as possible - look at any Ikea instructions sheet. Minimizes production and translation costs. Also, for a low-value high-volume product, the manufacturers figure that you get what you've paid for.

    Writing your own instructions down, if you have the time, is eminently sensible - you know your own requirements best.

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    Registered User Lynn's Avatar
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    Re: Is it just me ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Clive Long
    ... or do you find the instructions on most modern devices almost incomprehensible?
    I rarely read them

    I'm a 'figure it out and only look at the instructions if I get stuck' sort of person. I do read instructions if I'm installing stuff on the PC, other than that I tend to use manuals for troubleshooting if I can't get the product to do what I want. (Have to admit to needing to refer to the first digitial camera manual a few times, as not familiar with what it should be able to do, never having used one before).

    Your idea of the labels is good! Maybe we should have a useful tips and ideas thread for people to share.

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    Forum Bombshell - Our Queen! Lory's Avatar
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    Re: Is it just me ...

    This has probably been posted somewhere else before but I couldn't be bothered to find it!

    Some examples of why the human race has probably evolved as far as possible. These are actual instruction labels on consumer goods...

    On Sears hairdryer:
    Do not use while sleeping.
    (Gee, that's the only time I have to work on my hair!)

    On a bag of Fritos:
    You could be a winner! No purchase necessary. Details inside.
    (The shoplifter special!)

    On a bar of Dial soap:
    Directions: Use like regular soap.
    (and that would be how?)

    On some Swann frozen dinners:
    Serving suggestion: Defrost.
    (But it's 'just' a suggestion!)

    On Tesco's Tiramisu dessert: (printed on bottom of the box)
    Do not turn upside down.
    (Too late! you lose!)

    On Marks & Spencer Bread Pudding:
    Product will be hot after heating.
    (Are you sure? Let's experiment.)

    On packaging for a Rowenta iron:
    Do not iron clothes on body.
    (But wouldn't that save more time?)(Whose body?)

    On Boot's Children's cough medicine:
    Do not drive car or operate machinery.
    (We could do a lot to reduce the construction accidents if we just kept those 5 year olds off those fork lifts.)

    On Nytol sleep aid:
    Warning: may cause drowsiness.
    (One would hope!)

    On a Korean kitchen knife:
    Warning: keep out of children.
    (hmm...something must have gotten lost in the translation...)

    On a string of Christmas lights:
    For indoor or outdoor use only.
    (As opposed to use in outer space.)

    On a food processor:
    Not to be used for the other use.
    (Now I'm curious.)

    On Sainsbury's peanuts:
    Warning: contains nuts.
    (but no peas?)

    On an American Airlines packet of nuts:
    Instructions: open packet, eat nuts.
    (somebody got paid big bucks to write this one...)

    On a Swedish chainsaw:
    Do not attempt to stop chain with your hands.
    (Raise your hand if you've tried this...)

    On a child's Superman costume:
    Wearing of this garment does not enable you to fly.
    (Oh go ahead! That's right, destroy a universal childhood belief.)
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    Registered User cheeks's Avatar
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    Re: Is it just me ...


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    Re: Is it just me ...

    Some years ago on a pre christmas shopping trip around Toys R Us it noticed the following warning on the back of a toy box.

    "Contains small parts. Not to be used by children under the age of three years of age or under seven years of age if in the U.S."

    Hmm. The land of the fry and the home of the back to front baseball cap. They are allowed to own guns there you know.

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    Registered User El Salsero Gringo's Avatar
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    Re: Is it just me ...

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames
    Added to this, now most device instructions are written as cheaply as possible - look at any Ikea instructions sheet. Minimizes production and translation costs. Also, for a low-value high-volume product, the manufacturers figure that you get what you've paid for.
    I don't agree. Ikea instructions do not strike me as cheap or anything but extremely carefully thought-out. I have always found them to be clear, concise and easy to follow.

    Their international audience does lead to some interesting anomalies though: IKEA was recently criticised by an equal-opportunities group in a scandinavian country (Denmark?) for showing a bias for having a male figure actively assembling (using tools and so forth) and a female figure "assisting" by holding the workpiece. One of the company's defences was that to show a man assisting a woman would cause offence in Arab countries!

    Many of the other "hilarious" pieces of labeling are the result of possibly over-zealous application of over-detailed product labeling regulations put in place to protect us the consumer. Pay your money, and take your choice...

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    Re: Is it just me ...

    Quote Originally Posted by El Salsero Gringo
    Many of the other "hilarious" pieces of labeling are the result of possibly over-zealous application of over-detailed product labeling regulations put in place to protect us the consumer. Pay your money, and take your choice...

    This is exactly the point I was going to make - plus I think many of the instructions and 'warning's are to protect the companies' backs - it's all part of the new sueing fad that seems to have swept the world and companies just can't afford not to state the obvious anymore.

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    Re: Is it just me ...

    I went around a computer fair yesterday, and I could not even understand what some of the devices on sale actually did.

    I usually write the instruction manual / help file before I start writing a program, and that approach would have benefited so many products that I have bought. Equipping the young designers with a pair of unspectacles would also help us old gits a lot.

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    Re: Is it just me ...

    Yes, I remember hearing about a manufacturer of rubber boats who was successfully sued by someone who had injured themselves when their boat had been swept on to rocks. The basis of the claim was that the instructions had not warned the user that the boat may puncture if swept onto rocks.

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    Re: Is it just me ...

    Methinks most manuals are written either by the techheads or the marketing team. Take your pick.

    Its also highly annoying when said manuals cover lots of models in the range -including ones you can't even buy here! .. trying to wade through the features on your own model can be bad enough but when there's 10 models that each do the same thing differently


    On the computer side though I must say that manuals do seem to have slimmed down a lot ... back in the heady early network days of computing Novell (the then be all and end all of pc networks) gave you a box with no less than 13 manuals! As opposed to the latest Microsoft Windows Small Business Server which manual comes on the equivalent of about one newspaper page!

    Still not sure if I like all this electronic documentation though - seems an easy option for the manufacturers not to bother writing decent manuals.

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    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: Is it just me ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Robin
    Still not sure if I like all this electronic documentation though - seems an easy option for the manufacturers not to bother writing decent manuals.
    Well, the writing effort is proably no different, but they save shedloads on production, storage and distribution costs, especially for a high-volume, low-cost retail product. Of course, the effort you have to put in as a reader is greater, but they're not paying for that.

    It's the equivalent of outsourcing call centres to a foreign country - the level of service and quality of information delivery is reduced, but the managers don't care, they're saving money. Of course, in the long-term, the company will lose any reputation for quality, but in the short-term, it's big bonuses all round...

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    Re: Is it just me ...

    There was a documentary about a guy who used to sell aircraft building kits. The manual had to be of the highest standard to meet regulations and avoid lawsuits. He said that the cost of creating and publishing the manual amounted to 30% of the price of the kit.

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    Re: Is it just me ...

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames
    It's the equivalent of outsourcing call centres to a foreign country - the level of service and quality of information delivery is reduced, but the managers don't care, they're saving money. Of course, in the long-term, the company will lose any reputation for quality, but in the short-term, it's big bonuses all round...
    I have theory about this - On the basis of my own experience . I found that when I have to deal with a call centre where it has been "subbed" out overseas that I have to call at least 2 ,or more times as opposed to once or maybe twice to a UK based call centre.
    Now on the basis that they moved the operations there to save costs and would be paying roughly 1/3 of their uk cost (does this seem a fair assessment?) there does not appear to be any savings on the basis that I have to call more times and the outsource agency would be charging accordingly.

    I bet their stats show that they are handling 3 times more calls for the same cost .... wonder if any bigwig has bothered to ask for a comparison on number of calls per case ... ?

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    Registered User El Salsero Gringo's Avatar
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    Re: Is it just me ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Robin
    Methinks most manuals are written either by the techheads or the marketing team. Take your pick.
    I think that's just a prejudice on your part Robin.
    Quote Originally Posted by Robin
    On the computer side though I must say that manuals do seem to have slimmed down a lot ... back in the heady early network days of computing Novell (the then be all and end all of pc networks) gave you a box with no less than 13 manuals! As opposed to the latest Microsoft Windows Small Business Server which manual comes on the equivalent of about one newspaper page!

    Still not sure if I like all this electronic documentation though - seems an easy option for the manufacturers not to bother writing decent manuals.
    Times have changed since every person who bought a computer was a technical nut. The first computer in my family was a sinclair ZX80 that was sold to electronics enthusiasts - you could buy it in kit form and solder it together yourself. Then next was an Apple ][ which came with a full set of manuals - including the source code for the firmware and a circuit diagram of the motherboard.

    These days most people don't want and wouldn't understand that level of complexity of information about their computers or the software they use on them. To produce paper manuals to accompany every product would just be immensely wasteful, of time, resources and energy - not least the energy involved in schlepping the weight of paper from the manufacturer to the end user. Electronic documentation is light, easily amended, searched, indexed and the luddites among us (me included) can always print out as much or as little as we need to cuddle up to as bed-time reading.

    When you buy a car - you no longer get the technical details. You don't even get much of an instruction manual that tells you how to drive, although I dare say once upon a time you would have, along with the complete workshop manual to boot.

    And please, don't make the mistake of assuming that just because reams and reams of paper isn't supplied with your favourite operating system that decent technical documentation isn't written as a matter of course. As a (former) Cisco specialist I must have had about 40,000 pages of extremely tightly written yet clearly explained documents on my shelves at one point.

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    Re: Is it just me ...

    Sorry , methinks you misunderstood me. My point was that Novell with their 13 manuals had a very clearly documented and easily indexed system .... that is no longer the case . I rest my case if, for example, you look at the MS help on server provisioning for Hosted Exchange. Its a CD with 320mb of documentation only and its fairly poor . I'll burn you a copy and you can peruse it if you like - if you are feelin sad, that is.

    It really overcomplicates things and therein lies my grudge. Its almost as is they are doing that specifically to sell courses on it !!!

    Maybe thats the correct nail

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    Registered User El Salsero Gringo's Avatar
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    Re: Is it just me ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Robin
    Sorry , methinks you misunderstood me.
    Oops, sorry about that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Robin
    My point was that Novell with their 13 manuals had a very clearly documented and easily indexed system .... that is no longer the case . I rest my case if, for example, you look at the MS help on server provisioning for Hosted Exchange. Its a CD with 320mb of documentation only and its fairly poor . I'll burn you a copy and you can peruse it if you like - if you are feelin sad, that is.

    It really overcomplicates things and therein lies my grudge. Its almost as is they are doing that specifically to sell courses on it !!!
    OK, I'm not familiar with the example that you give, but that's an MS-specific complaint, not a "sign of the times" complaint. There's plenty of really good technical documentation out there right now for all sorts of products, just as, when Novell was king of networks, there was a lot of very poor documentation.

    I agree that things have "slimmed down" but that's a good thing to me - if I want hard-backed perfect-bound manuals then I'm happy to pay extra for them (or for the O'Reilly books - documentation by any other name). Meanwhlie I detect no trend - upwards or downwards - in the quality of the content.

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    Re: Is it just me ...

    Quote Originally Posted by El Salsero Gringo
    I agree that things have "slimmed down" but that's a good thing to me - if I want hard-backed perfect-bound manuals then I'm happy to pay extra for them (or for the O'Reilly books - documentation by any other name). Meanwhlie I detect no trend - upwards or downwards - in the quality of the content.
    Agreed . Proper manual= get an O'Reilly!

    However it makes you wonder why the manufacturers can't do it!

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    Re: Is it just me ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Robin
    ...However it makes you wonder why the manufacturers can't do it!
    To write a great manual the writer has to understand the product in depth, and the complete lack of knowledge, and sometimes common sense, of the users of the product. There is a distinct expertise in being able to cope with the range of users that will actually try to read the manual, which is why the task is being delegated more to technical authors and publishers who have the necessary expertise.

    When I was a trainee programmer my boss said "We write programs and documentation to B.S.I. standards.". He then introduced me ty first task, writing a small program for the "British Standard Idiot", a guy called Wilf.

    It was how I learned my first big lesson, "Do not try to tell them which button to press, do not give them a button.".

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