Dancing as a woman

[Glasgow Jane]

Well, I've done it ! Last night I danced the beginners class as a follower !

Well done you! I think all men should learn to follow well, after all you expect us to do it
I've been dancing as a man in both beginners' and intermediates' classes for quite a while now and it's improved my dancing no end, in terms of style, confidence, precision and so on, and I think it works the other way around too, giving men a more relaxed, smoother, chilled-out style and a lot more consideration of what a 'lead' is, rather than how much strength they can muster.

ON a similar note, I always make my taxi revisions class (once we've revised the moves) do the whole routine with nothing more than 2 fingers touching (and the fingers must remain straight - no good hooking them onto your partner for dear life). That way the men must lead rather than drag, and the women must follow or they don't stay together. They say it makes an incredible difference to the ease and comfort of the dancing - and these are people who may be there for the first time that night.

Try it with someone!

Jane

[Bigger Andy]

Well done you! I think all men should learn to follow well, after all you expect us to do it
~ snip ~
and I think it works the other way around too

I think that both the gents and the ladies can benefit by dancing the opposite role.

It would give everyone a greater understanding of what the other person is going through during a dance and hopefully lead to a lot more consideration being shown on the dancefloor.

To overcome any shyness and/or the awkwardness of having to dance with another (wo)man , I think it would be a good idea for teachers to run a class where all the men should dance the follower role and all the ladies should dance the lead role. Just occasionally !

However, I have never seen this being tried.

I always make my taxi revisions class (once we've revised the moves) do the whole routine with nothing more than 2 fingers touching (and the fingers must remain straight - no good hooking them onto your partner for dear life). That way the men must lead rather than drag, and the women must follow or they don't stay together. They say it makes an incredible difference to the ease and comfort of the dancing - and these are people who may be there for the first time that night.

Thanks for the extra suggestion.
Any ideas on how to improve one's dancing are gratefully received !

[Gadget]

I think it would be a good idea for teachers to run a class where all the men should dance the follower role and all the ladies should dance the lead role. Just occasionally !

However, I have never seen this being tried.

It's been done up here a couple of times. Same with the occasional suprise Double Trouble class. { Lisa/Lorna/Franck}

[Bigger Andy]

It's been done up here a couple of times. Same with the occasional suprise Double Trouble class. { Lisa/Lorna/Franck}

Yes, we have also done 'Double Trouble' on a number of occasions - mainly due to the large number of "spare" ladies, I assume !

[MartinHarper]

I think it would be a good idea for teachers to run a class where all the men should dance the follower role and all the ladies should dance the lead role. Just occasionally !

However, I have never seen this being tried.

Ceroc Kidderminster did it as a freestyle "fun class" last year sometime. Sadly, I couldn't make it... :-(

[Lynn]

To overcome any shyness and/or the awkwardness of having to dance with another (wo)man , I think it would be a good idea for teachers to run a class where all the men should dance the follower role and all the ladies should dance the lead role. Just occasionally !

However, I have never seen this being tried.

When we did have classes in Belfast (almost a year ago now ) the teacher did this sometimes when the class was smaller and it was mainly regulars, I think it was a good learning experience for everyone.

[baldrick]

Well my experiments with following have come on. Thanks to BeeBee for her leads in beginners classes. I too have taken to a fixed partner, dont think the good men of glasgow are all ready for a dance with me.
Its great fun. Sure my returns are rotten, spins are comming on nicely. I can still fallover sometimes but hey its all practice. But I still seem to need a strong lead, not finding the sublties easy to follow. This coupled with leading more complex moves , I now see how easy it is to miss the leaders intention. Dont worry so much when freestyle goes astray. Grin and keep going its supposed to be fun.
The whole thing has lead (sorry) to a high point of being lead by Franck at the weekend. Ok had to pay for it (ok so Peter bought it for me half in jest). Thanks Franck, bet you wish that dance had had more bidders

[drathzel]

Well my experiments with following have come on. Thanks to BeeBee for her leads in beginners classes. I too have taken to a fixed partner, dont think the good men of glasgow are all ready for a dance with me.
Its great fun. Sure my returns are rotten, spins are comming on nicely. I can still fallover sometimes but hey its all practice. But I still seem to need a strong lead, not finding the sublties easy to follow. This coupled with leading more complex moves , I now see how easy it is to miss the leaders intention. Dont worry so much when freestyle goes astray. Grin and keep going its supposed to be fun.
The whole thing has lead (sorry) to a high point of being lead by Franck at the weekend. Ok had to pay for it (ok so Peter bought it for me half in jest). Thanks Franck, bet you wish that dance had had more bidders

i'm huffing now

[baldrick]

i'm huffing now

Oh don't do that, spoils your dancing.
Dosent seem to affect my follow though. Keep trying, just dont be too subtle or complicated. Remember I only had two lessons

[drathzel]

Oh don't do that, spoils your dancing.
Dosent seem to affect my follow though. Keep trying, just dont be too subtle or complicated. Remember I only had two lessons

I meant cuz i had been helping you follow

[baldrick]

I meant cuz i had been helping you follow

I know, but you've had much more practice as a lead than I've had as follow. You lead moves you can follow, and are frustrated when I fluf it. Please be patient, I'm catching up as fast as I can. Its easier with DT cause I know all of Pauls moves so there are fewer mistakes. Still they creep in when he gets creative.

[drathzel]

I know, but you've had much more practice as a lead than I've had as follow. You lead moves you can follow, and are frustrated when I fluf it. Please be patient, I'm catching up as fast as I can. Its easier with DT cause I know all of Pauls moves so there are fewer mistakes. Still they creep in when he gets creative.

Fair does! I also lead moves others can follow! Paul is a superb lead tho.....we love you and your dt paul!

[El Salsero Gringo]

Tonight having been at the 100 Club with a great swing band playing, and having met there Chicky and her husband I had the great pleasure of being led by him in a dance. It was a total revelation - I now *get* the whole experience of being a follower, how it's supposed to feel, and why ladies queue to dance with the really good, expressive, musically connected men.

It was a complete epiphany to dance the follow part with a leader who really really knew what they were doing, and although I fluffed a lot of the steps there was enough of it that worked to make a fantastic experience.

I feel quite jealous of the girls who can get something approaching that experience at most dance nights, and I certainly recommend it to the guys - you have no idea what you're missing.

Thank you so much, Jim!

[Bulletdog]

Hey Gringo,

It's always fun to dance with a Guy and Saturday with you was no exception

However, I then danced as a woman with Dapper Dan and poor Dan now has very bruised feet. Why he would want to put his feet under mine I have no idea

Very nice to meet you and hope to see you at one of our venues or at one of the weekenders.

Jim

[Bigger Andy]

Well, I've done it ! Last night I danced the beginners class as a follower !

Following 2 weeks of cancelled classes due to the snow I did my second class as a follower last night.

I managed to talk a nice young lady into leading me. It was NOT the same person who did it last time. This person is also a good dancer and also a Taxi Dancer at Canterbury, although she wasn't on duty last night.

I asked a different person last night compared to the first class for 2 reasons :-
1). I wanted to experience a different lead.
2). I don't want to impose on anyone's goodwill too much or else they might not want to do it again.

The routine that we did was :-
'First Move Push Spin', 'Backpass', 'Armjive' and a 'Side to Side'.
Unfortunately, this was very similar to the first routine that I did. 2 moves were repeated and a third move was a variation of one we did 3 weeks ago.

The first problem is still trying to overcome the initial feeling of the weirdness of the situation !

The one main thing that I noticed about the other person's lead last night was :-
1). The lead when going from the 'Return' after the 'Backpass' to the 'Armjive' left a bit to be desired.
When I lead a lady into a 2-handed move I run my hand down the back of her spare arm so that she knows before the previous move is finished what is coming next. If this isn't done, as I experienced last night, there tends to be a bit of last minute grabbing for hands which adversely affects the "flow" of the movement.

Like last time, it was strange how dancing as a follower affected me when I went back to leading later in the evening. I found that same feeling of weirdness when trying to lead for the first couple of dances as I had when I started the class off as a follower !

It was another fun and interesting experience !

[MartinHarper]

When I lead a lady into a 2-handed move I run my hand down the back of her spare arm so that she knows before the previous move is finished what is coming next. If this isn't done, as I experienced last night, there tends to be a bit of last minute grabbing for hands which adversely affects the "flow" of the movement.

As a follower, if my lead isn't giving out those cues, I can compensate some by always keeping my left hand available. I also try to be relaxed if my hand is taken "late" (or rather, later than I would have taken it, had I been leading). Otherwise, we tend to do the mad scrabble thing where both of us are grabbing for each other's hand, which isn't wildly smooth.

[Bigger Andy]

As a follower, if my lead isn't giving out those cues, I can compensate some by always keeping my left hand available. I also try to be relaxed if my hand is taken "late" (or rather, later than I would have taken it, had I been leading). Otherwise, we tend to do the mad scrabble thing where both of us are grabbing for each other's hand, which isn't wildly smooth.

I also kept my spare hand available but still found that there was the last minute grabbing for hands !

Of course, the way to avoid all this is for the follower to anticipate things. But we don't want to do that do we ?

The trouble is that because all the followers are watching the teachers demonstration up on the stage, they do know exactly what is going to happen next and can therefore anticipate correctly.

This then has the effect that, because the move has worked, the leaders think that they are doing well.

[David Bailey]

Has anyone tried much leading by holding the follower's left hand instead of her right (leaders using either left or right)? It definitely makes you have to think about moves.

I had to do that for a few weeks recently if I wanted to get a dance with Carol (Finchley / St. Albans teacher), as she had a right shoulder injury. It was still great to dance with her of course, but I wouldn't recommend it unless the follower is very good at following! It's amazing how much you as a follower depend on using your right hand, and how much of the whole way you dance changes if you try leading that hand - e.g. turns are naturally in the opposite direction... Good practice though.

[spindr]

Has anyone tried much leading by holding the follower's left hand instead of her right (leaders using either left or right)?

Yep, regularly
One lady has even asked me whether I was left-handed -- she seemed a bit non-plussed when I pointed out I was holding her left hand in my right hand at the time.

It's a bit wierd why MJ is so asymmetric -- in salsa turns and spins are led from all hand/hand combinations.

It definitely makes you have to think about moves.

Maybe I just have a warped mind You should certainly be able to lead a lot of the basket variations one-handed and some wurlitzer ones.

I had to do that for a few weeks recently if I wanted to get a dance with Carol (Finchley / St. Albans teacher), as she had a right shoulder injury. It was still great to dance with her of course, but I wouldn't recommend it unless the follower is very good at following! It's amazing how much you as a follower depend on using your right hand, and how much of the whole way you dance changes if you try leading that hand - e.g. turns are naturally in the opposite direction... Good practice though.

Well you could always improvise using some other "right part" as a potential replacement, e.g. leading a partner with a bad right hand by using their right arm instead. Probably trickier if it's a shoulder -- but you still might be able to lead on her right hip (provided you're well enough acquainted).

SpinDr.

One "fun" left-to-left MJ variation:

1). Lead a clockwise turn on a left-to-left handhold.
2). Lead an anti-clockwise turn on the left-to-left handhold carefully (!) bring the hands just lower than shoulder height. Lead the turn so that the lady's right shoulder *just* bounces into the handhold -- so that she's slightly wrapped into it.
3). Raising the hands, lead a clockwise turn on the left-to-left handhold.
[Repeat 2/3 until bored] -- quite nice if the whole move "circles".

[Minnie M]

Has anyone tried much leading by holding the follower's left hand instead of her right (leaders using either left or right)? It definitely makes you have to think about moves.......

(as a follower) It's good fun, feels strange though - and it forces you to concentrate that little bit extra - however it does take a good lead to do it well