New computer - desktop PC, laptop or Mac?

[Lynn]

Still haven't got my upgrade - I've been looking at Mac vs PC options. I've come to a few more conclusions...


I'd like something I can just walk in and buy. Simple and straightforward. I'm happy to spend hours looking at camera/lens specs but when it comes to computers I just want it to do what I need without having to do too much.

I can't buy a decent screen etc from the likes of Currys/PC World. They just don't cater for what I need, I'd have to shop online somewhere like Dell.

I was very impressed by the customer service I got in the local Apple store this weekend. A member of staff took ages (about an hour I think) answering my questions, explaining things, making suggestions.

I know you don't buy a product simply based on customer service, but as someone who has had fairly simple questions and been asking them in a few different computer shops, that was the first time I've actually got answers. (Best one was when I asked a salesman in PC World if the i7 in the laptop he was showing me was 3rd generation and he looked at me and said 'what's that?'...'you know Ivybridge' 'what's that?'... 'the new processer from Intel?' - 'never heard of it'... it was btw.)


Those factors are swinging me back in the direction of Macs. I'm being slightly held back by not wanting to just be buying something because everyone else does - but at the same time maybe there is a reason why so many professional photographers use Macs...

Looking at the 27" iMac (its only £150 more than the 21.5") - and probably an iPad as well - it seems perfect for being able to take a portfolio of edited photos with me.

[Franck]

There's a huge difference between the Apple Stores and other electronics / pc stores. The staff at Apple are told not to try and sell, just to help, share and generally assist you in understanding what you can do with a computer / iPhone / iPad / etc. It is so refreshing!

I can't sing the praises of the 27" iMac enough, it's a gorgeous machine... As for the iPad, well, I love mine, and everyone I know who got one is amazed at how much they use and love it.

The new Retina Display Macbook Pro also looks amazing, but pricier, and I can't say I would need one, an iMac for the office, an iPad for the road / portability should cover all your computing needs.

[philsmove]

One piece of advice

Don't try a mix a PC with an iphone or an ipad
Yes it can be done, but very few IT professions understand both systems
and even fewer know to sync them two together

At the moment, I think, only iphone, ipad and Mac book Pros have Retina Displays
as a photographer this is a very big plus

The big advantage of Apple produces is, they all talk to each other

The disadvantage Apple products or software don't like talking to anything "not invented here"

and dont buy an Appel product, on-line and hope the local apple store will help you, if it goes wrong they dont want to know

(if you buy an ipad it only comes with a 1 year garentee, buy from John Lewis and you get 2)

[cederic]

(if you buy an ipad it only comes with a 1 year garentee, buy from John Lewis and you get 2)

Unless you buy it in the EU, in which case it comes with a 2 year guarantee, whatever Apple tell you: http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/b...ty-EU-law.html

Incidentally, not sure the retina displays are worth the additional price. I was invited by a friend to compare is iPad2 and his (new) iPad and I just couldn't tell which was which. Neither could his mother-in-law. If you're buying an iPad anyway then it's sensible to go for the latest model, but if you're buying a Mac Book Pro then it might be worth checking whether you can even tell a difference before buying.

Note that non-Apple products can offer high pixel density screens too. You can get 10.1" Android tablets with 1920x1200 screens, Android phones with 1280x800 and 15" laptops with 1920x1080, all of which are sufficiently dense that individual pixels wont be bothering you.

But seriously, don't buy a computer based on the knowledge of the low paid staff in a store. Research it yourself, decide on the model that best meets your needs and then buy it either at the cheapest price point you can find or in-store if you want the store support. (I buy my laptops online and only ever need support in the first three days, in which case it's a replacement rather than a repair/fix)

Opting to go Apple based on their staff is a credit to their staff, but may constrain you to their eco-system. If that meets your needs then that's fine, but be sure about that first. On the flipside, if their eco-system works better for you then embrace it wholeheartedly (and whole-walletedly too).

[Lynn]

But seriously, don't buy a computer based on the knowledge of the low paid staff in a store. Research it yourself, decide on the model that best meets your needs and then buy it either at the cheapest price point you can find or in-store if you want the store support. (I buy my laptops online and only ever need support in the first three days, in which case it's a replacement rather than a repair/fix)

That's exactly what is putting me off buying a new PC! I don't want to buy my computer online, I don't want to spend hours researching - though I have, after conflicting advice from different PC users and am none the wiser. I just want to walk into a store and buy a computer with a decent monitor. To do that with PC I need to buy a computer one place and a monitor somewhere else, trawl round lots of websites - to be honest I'm a bit fed up with it! Someone recommends a laptop - then it turns out its not got enough output resolution to run a larger IPS monitor etc.

Sorry, not ranting at you just fed up with the lack of any consistent info available either in person or online about PCs. If you know what you want and you can spec it up yourself that's fine. If you just want a tool to do the job you want (in my case photo editing) that doesn't seem to be possible.

[cederic]

Heh, not taking it personally. I'm also probably not the most empathetic person you could be responding to either - my last car was bought after assessing 61 different car models, I've spent three months researching my next camera without buying one and it took me two hours of research just to buy a new beard trimmer last week.

Found a nice one though, it's got a built in vacuum cleaner and everything.

But PCs are complex, especially if you have specific needs and a tight budget, there is a tremendous amount of choice out there and the margins just don't support knowledgeable shop staff. Unless you're Apple, in which case the margins support a $80bn pile of cash and demonstrate their control over their whole supply chain and eco-system.

I can't even offer to help, as I suspect your photo editing is a step above my own. I don't even know how to calibrate my monitor (and that's the built-in screen in my laptop). I have this awful premonition that I'm going to have to learn before I buy a new laptop some time next year..

[philsmove]

Lynn

Have you tried John Lewis ?


There are specallist companies who how will come and visit your office ,asses your needs, supply what you what , maintain it, and supply on and off site support

but they will not do this for free, expect to pay at least £1000 per year


Also remember, any advice given today, will be completely out of date tomorrow

[Lynn]

Heh, not taking it personally. I'm also probably not the most empathetic person you could be responding to either - my last car was bought after assessing 61 different car models, I've spent three months researching my next camera without buying one and it took me two hours of research just to buy a new beard trimmer last week.

I took months deciding on my first DLSR - Canon vs Nikon, then deciding which model. Though had no problem with my second - I knew exactly what I wanted and why, what I needed it to do and just went and got it.

Believe me, I was quite anti Apple until fairly recently - didn't want to buy into a brand, but going into the Apple shop is such a totally different retail experience its refreshing. Instead of being a big horrible chore that's been stressing me out for months (trying to work out what PC I needed and where to get it) - its turning into something quite enjoyable.

For someone else, that enjoyment might be found in getting all the parts and building/upgrading a machine themselves. I've never done and that have no interest in doing it (apart from the quick job of upgrading ram.)

I can't even offer to help, as I suspect your photo editing is a step above my own. I don't even know how to calibrate my monitor (and that's the built-in screen in my laptop). I have this awful premonition that I'm going to have to learn before I buy a new laptop some time next year..

Calibrating a monitor is easy - you can get a tool like a Spyder and just follow the instructions. Having said that, I'm not totally convinced that having done that, my monitor is calibrated properly - but I think that's because of the monitor, not the Spyder.

Have you tried John Lewis ?


There are specallist companies who how will come and visit your office ,asses your needs, supply what you what , maintain it, and supply on and off site support

but they will not do this for free, expect to pay at least £1000 per year

I don't mind paying a bit more for good customer service, but not that much!

Question for Mac users - alongside my iMac I'd like a more portable device. I'd thought of the iPad but am also now considering a refurb of the baisc model Macbook Air. Thinking that it might be more versatile - eg for onsite back up of raw files at a break in a wedding, or to take for a weekend away - while still being very light.... pros/cons of each?

[philsmove]

Question for Mac users - alongside my iMac I'd like a more portable device. I'd thought of the iPad but am also now considering a refurb of the basic model Macbook Air. Thinking that it might be more versatile - eg for onsite back up of raw files at a break in a wedding, or to take for a weekend away - while still being very light.... pros/cons of each?

the Ipad is an output device ,no use for backing up or editing. Yes it can be done but not at a professional level . you cannot load lightroom on an ipad, but you can on an Air

So you need an Air which will serve as a back up to your Desk top. but as a professional photographer, do you want to rely on second hand equipment? The nice people in the apple store are unlikely to want to know about secondhand equipment you did not buy from them. This is the disadvantage of Macs, not only in your desk top more expensive, so is your laptop and all the other nice Apple products

if you want to show of your work on a laptop you really need a retina display this means the latest air

[cederic]

Calibrating a monitor is easy - you can get a tool like a Spyder and just follow the instructions. Having said that, I'm not totally convinced that having done that, my monitor is calibrated properly - but I think that's because of the monitor, not the Spyder.

Hadn't heard of the Spyder before. £148 is a lot to change the colour settings on my screen I think I'll pass for the moment, and see where I can borrow one for ten minutes when I get a new laptop nextyear

[Lynn]

So you need an Air which will serve as a back up to your Desk top. but as a professional photographer, do you want to rely on second hand equipment? The nice people in the apple store are unlikely to want to know about secondhand equipment you did not buy from them.

I was thinking refrub from the Apple store (which comes with a year's warranty) - not second hand.

This is the disadvantage of Macs, not only in your desk top more expensive, so is your laptop and all the other nice Apple products

Well yes, but I buy Nikon speedlights and lenses even though they're dearer than third party so it wouldn't be strange to do the same with other technology. And you need to compare the Air to the PC version - Ultrabooks? Which seem to be in and around the same sort of price range? Eg the 13" Dell Ultrabook - i5, 4GB RAM, 128GB SSD is £949 and the 13" Macbook Air i5, 4GB RAM 128GB SSD £939 (admittedly with education or card discount - I'm looking at a lower spec Macbook Air though, and I'm only thinking over options, sticking with the destop for now.)

Hadn't heard of the Spyder before. £148 is a lot to change the colour settings on my screen I think I'll pass for the moment, and see where I can borrow one for ten minutes when I get a new laptop nextyear

Yep a bit dear to buy just to use yourself, find someone to borrow one off - we have one in camera club that we share round.

[philsmove]

I Did not know Apple did refurb

you can get refurb Dell work station but not from Dell ( PM me)

Talk to Dell business and tell them you are about to buy a Mac and see what discount you can get ( I got 40% )

[Lynn]

You can buy refurb Dell from Dell as well I think? It just tends to vary what they have available when you look.

But I can't just go in and talk to Dell. I'd have to ring them and I can't actually look at their machines, I have to look at pictures and order on line. I don't want to do that - I want to actually see and try what I'm buying first. I've been looking online and comparing specs and asking people I know and going into shops and taking friends who know a bit about fixing/upgrading their own PCs with me into shops - and I've just ended up even more confused!

[philsmove]

- I want to actually see and try what I'm buying first.!

then a refurb makes sense, PC or Mac, as you can normally play with actual machine you are about to buy

[Franck]

Question for Mac users - alongside my iMac I'd like a more portable device. I'd thought of the iPad but am also now considering a refurb of the baisc model Macbook Air. Thinking that it might be more versatile - eg for onsite back up of raw files at a break in a wedding, or to take for a weekend away - while still being very light.... pros/cons of each?

That's a tough one to answer, and you're the second person to ask me this question this week.

To answer it properly, you need to be realistic and honest about what you intend to do on the road. If you want to be able to do everything you do on your iMac, but away from home, then you'll need the Macbook. However, from experience, very few people need that level of computing away from their desk.
The iPad, does offer a lot of quality apps, for photos, document creation, art, you name it, but the main advantage is how much more portable and easy to use it is. This is why I pretty much exclusively use my iPad away from the office, or simply sitting on the couch, in the kitchen, etc. It is always on, has great battery life, a beautiful screen and a very tactile, personal user interface.
If you want to show photos, or albums, then it makes much more sense to have an iPad to pass around (or to Airplay to a tv if you have a £99 Apple TV as well).
If you're planning on doing all your serious photography work on the iMac, then a Macbook Air would be redundant most of the time. If you need to do real work away from home, then you'll want an Air!

As for where to buy your mac, Apple Stores will service, fix, replace any mac, regardless of where purchased, for free if it's under guarantee, and will take a look and fix things if it's easy, or quote you for replacement of defective parts.

I hope this helps you decide!

[TA Guy]

If I was in your position Lynn, I wouldn't be asking this on a Ceroc forum, I'd be asking it on a (serious ) photography forum.

[Lynn]

That's a tough one to answer, and you're the second person to ask me this question this week.

To answer it properly, you need to be realistic and honest about what you intend to do on the road. If you want to be able to do everything you do on your iMac, but away from home, then you'll need the Macbook. However, from experience, very few people need that level of computing away from their desk.
The iPad, does offer a lot of quality apps, for photos, document creation, art, you name it, but the main advantage is how much more portable and easy to use it is. This is why I pretty much exclusively use my iPad away from the office, or simply sitting on the couch, in the kitchen, etc. It is always on, has great battery life, a beautiful screen and a very tactile, personal user interface.
If you want to show photos, or albums, then it makes much more sense to have an iPad to pass around (or to Airplay to a tv if you have a £99 Apple TV as well).
If you're planning on doing all your serious photography work on the iMac, then a Macbook Air would be redundant most of the time. If you need to do real work away from home, then you'll want an Air!

As for where to buy your mac, Apple Stores will service, fix, replace any mac, regardless of where purchased, for free if it's under guarantee, and will take a look and fix things if it's easy, or quote you for replacement of defective parts.

I hope this helps you decide!

Thanks Franck - I need to decide what I want to do away from home - I might need to download files, do some editing and print etc - in which case I need more than the iPad - but an iPad is a great display tool. I'll just have to have a good think about what I want it to do.

In terms of desktop though, I decided on that and am writing this on my new 27" iMac.

[philsmove]

Congratulation on your iMac

as you say, the iPad is a great display tool

so get an iPad, to get more work and earn more ££££££

In the mean time by some more memory cards for the camera and do your editing at home

when have more £££££ get a nice new Air with a retina display ( and a D800 )

[Lynn]

Thanks! I need to start getting more work next - but at least now I have kit - camera, lens and computer - that I can start to do some proper work on!

So far have LR4 trial - going to buy it as I do like LR. It looks the same as LR3 so far (just had a quick look) - anything extra it can do that I should be trying out?

[cederic]

Highlights, shadows and clarity. But mainly highlights and shadows. Makes a massive difference and helps recover or improve so many photos.

Of course, less useful for you as your photos wont need recovering