Same in all dance forms. Actually, that's the same in pretty much everything, see Sturgeon's Law.
So, in other words, that's not saying much.
What is it, then?
Yep, loads of them.
But like it or not, salon style Tango is closely bound to, and grew out of, the traditional music style, and it works best when done to that type of music.
Same applies to salsa. There's a clear, strong musical tradition which correlates with the dance. As with AT, salsa music is specifically designed to dance to, rather than to listen to.
Whereas there's not a wide range of WCS music which has been written for people to dance WCS to. It's simply music which you can WCS to.
See the difference?
Originally Posted by David Franklin
It pays to have a few people who stand out for inspiration, although from a business perspective I think it'd be best to have people who stand out because they're having so much fun rather than because they're technically a lot better than everyone else. You'd want your "stars" to set a benchmark that's obtainable for most people, but not intimidating.Originally Posted by David Bailey
As a case in point, Twickenhams WCS class has a reputation as being particularly unfriendly to beginners because it's a hub for more experienced dancers. While a single venue might be sucessful with that sort of reputation, if every Ceroc venue tried to go the same way the whole business would fall over.
In the end, the beginners dollar is worth the same as anyone elses, and beginners aren't nearly as scary as awesome dancers. Sure, you need some dancers who are inspirational,.Too many might not be the healthiest thing for your club if you're trying to make a living out of it though.
All in my untested opinion of course.....
LB said he wasn't sure if the top MJ dancers at the moment are what they were 3-4 years ago. I'd have to disagree, for me (based on Camber) Veronika Oliver is currently the best dancer to watch on the floor at the moment in the MJ circuit. If she doesn't go for the furry boots at the Ceroc champs this year , I could see her winning it. She just seems to have stepped it up since I saw her last - reminds me a lot of Anna Lumsden as didnt let a beat go to waste but in a way that didn't distract from her partners lead.
Being in the zone may express itself differently, in different dances.
That doesn't mean the probability of dances in the zone or the number of dances you see in the zone is equivalent.
I believe WCS is just about the hardest mainstream dance to be in the zone with.
Factors I can think of which might make harder to dance in the zone may include:-
- Being harder in a open hold dance, particular with a large distance between partners.
- Needs a reasonably knowledgable follower.
(though essentially doing shines might take her into her zone).
- Even if you have a skilled follower she may be more interested in playing than really partner dancing
- Looser physical connection in conjunction with slowish music.
- Can be more about dancing to an audience.
For the record, I'm not arguing about whether WCS dancers lack variety. I haven't seen what you have, so can't really comment.
I do have an issue with your argument about "respecting the musical genre" though. You still haven't answered my earlier question about what you mean by it.
It seems to me that your preference is for people to dance Blues to blues music, which you consider more appropriate than WCS. It just so happens that the names of your preferred dance matches with the music in this case, but apart from that I can't see any reason, either historically or musically, why you should think that at all.
To take the argument to extremes, whenever a Tango track get's played you should equally expect anyone able to Tango to not dance MJ to it. Likewise if a Hip Hop track came on, everyone who watches MTV should forget about their partner and turn the venue into a nightclub by doing their own thing out on the floor.
Both MJ and WCS are in a similar situation when it comes to music in that they aren't based around a specific style. You can't criticize one style for a lack of genre relevance without catching the other in the cross-fire.
You may choose to see this as proving your point..... but even things which look or sound similar end up feeling very different when taken in the greater context.Ok, well now your showing that actually you do know very little about MJ. The set foot pattern is a step in and a step out - it may not be complicated, but it is a foot pattern. And the timing of the foot pattern is on the bass beat. And the same is true of technique, in fact MJ has many of the same techniques as WCS as much as you may hate to admit it..
Both WCS and MJ employ compression for instance, but so do the cylinders in my cars engine. The speed my engine moves at would break most of my partners forearms though I suspect.
What MJ actually is, is the truest form of freestyle dance that you can dance, which is open to encompassing other forms and styles - and moreover, it's accepting of those styles..
Now who's acting superior?
WCS was originally derived from Lindy Hop, a lot of the top DJ's will state that the best music for WCS to be danced too will have a Swing element.
As WCS has moved on so has the type of music that it is danced too. I would say most musical genres but not all can and are used at WCS events, I think the lowest BPM used would be around 80ish.
Not just DJs: http://www.swingworld.com/articles/c...tion_music.htm
You probably know better than me, but it seems to me there's a bit of an old-school v.s. new-school split going on at the minute in the WCS world.
Interesting.
From that article (which admittedly talks about competitions):
Hmmm.West Coast Swing has the most variety of music that is deemed acceptable for the dance. Unfortunately, in an effort to impose little or no restraints on the dance, we have avoided placing restraints on the MUSIC. New arrivals on the swing dance scene cannot be expected to have the ability to tell the difference between questionable, or unacceptable music for West Coast Swing. Increasingly, our DJ's are studying the music they play and becoming experts in their field. In the meantime, until everyone understands that certain music is unacceptable - our dance is in trouble.
Also:
And finally:It used to be that we bragged about being able to dance West Coast Swing to any music that was played. That is still a wonderful truth today!
So in other words, WCS does not seem to be tightly-bound to any particular form of music.Many new dancers (and a few not so new) tell me they have difficulty with music identification. They ask how to tell a Swing from a Cha-Cha or a Hustle. They wait until someone else dances - and then they get on the floor. This period of learning eventually leads to dance identification - but ONLY if someone (hopefully the DJ) tells them what the music is. If no one ever tells them the difference, the newer dancer assumes that ALL music played at a Swing dance is Swing music.
A bit like, ooh, I dunno, Modern Jive really.
I've posted this before, but you might also like: http://www.usaswingnet.com/what_is_swing.htm
The similarities with MJ competition rules that say "if you're dancing any other recognized form of dance, then you're not dancing MJ" is striking.
Well, he's not a forumite (nor ever likely to become one I suppose) but I think he's qualified to comment and this seems pertinent to the debate
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