Drops and seducers. Want to learn more.

[SteveP]

I'm new to posting on forums so not entirely sure how it works yet but I hope I can get some advice here. Forgive me if I've posted this in the wrong place.
I find that I can and have bored myself with the moves I know and like to learn new stuff especially moves that are interesting to look at and not too complicated for my brain to remember from week to week. I had a fixed partner I liked to dance with who liked a few drops but she moved away. We used to go upstairs sometimes in Wetherby engine shed where there was a bit of space. I find that the majority of women in freestyle are quite rightly a bit nervous about drops or even leans with those they don't know and freestyle isn't generally a good learning environment anyway. This is a bit of a catch 22 situation. I'm looking for dance partners who are like minded to meet in north yorkshire area to learn and practice moves of this type. Has anyone out there got any advice? Steve

[alinp]

Hi Steve

If you want to learn dips and drops and other seducers, my main advice would be to attend a workshop, whether that be with Ceroc or an independant is entirley your choice, but this way you'll learn the technique and safety elements required.

Most franchises will schedule such on a fairly regular basis

A

Oh... and if u don't know the lady.... ASK HER before attempting any dips etc..

[straycat]

Out of interest - are you asking this chiefly because you really want to learn drops etc, or is your main reason to achieve more of a fun factor in your dancing, and rekindle interest for yourself? In the latter case, it may be that you have quite a few other options as well as learning more drops.

[jivecat]

Out of interest - are you asking this chiefly because you really want to learn drops etc, or is your main reason to achieve more of a fun factor in your dancing, and rekindle interest for yourself? In the latter case, it may be that you have quite a few other options as well as learning more drops.

Drops can be good fun and exhilarating - when in safe hands. They can also be terrifying, dangerous and an unmusical cliche as well. Ladies may not be as impressed by being at the receiving end of them as you might be when you observe them. So they might be "interesting to look at" but just not feel very good.

If you want to show off and look flashy, by all means learn some drops, and I can understand they would be an enjoyable challenge for a man to learn to lead them. But if you want to please a wide range of followers (not just a "schooled" regular partner) then I'd concentrate on dancing moves you already know as musically and creatively as possible. Which is probably a lot harder.

Does anyone think drops are going out of fashion? I'm sure I've had a number of drop-free evenings recently and the end-of-track Musical Statues has abated somewhat.

[SteveP]

I don't tend to put drops in dances unless I've asked and danced with that partner a few times and never unless they agree in advance. Even then it would tend to be simple leans or ginger at the end for example. I do think they are less popular than before. More women tend not to want to do them when asked.

The reason I want to learn more is simply for my own interest and I also enjoy watching dancers that include them. There is also the challenge and banter that goes with learning and dancing them which I enjoyed with a fixed partner. Having a fixed partner takes much of the risk away because balance, weight, timing etc are not left to chance. Trust is a two way thing with drops. Some women say they are ok to do them but don't have the skill to do them. For example, I have on occasion nearly crippled myself trying to stop my partner crashing into the floor because they didn't support their own weight when they should have done for the chosen move.

I dance for my own entertainment and pure fun of it. Being flash or having an ego is of no interest to me. Like many dancers, I could definitely benefit from improving musicality as jivecat suggests but this is something I try to improve all the time as a matter of course.

I will ask about workshops. I've never seen any drops based workshops but probably because I've never thought to look before.
Has anyone been on any they would recommend?

[jivecat]

I don't tend to put drops in dances unless I've asked and danced with that partner a few times and never unless they agree in advance. Even then it would tend to be simple leans or ginger at the end for example. I do think they are less popular than before. More women tend not to want to do them when asked.

I often enjoy them but am much more wary than I used to be having hurt my back in a drop. Also, I just don't cooperate if I think the man is really unstable, I make sure I'm supporting all of my own weight.

The reason I want to learn more is simply for my own interest and I also enjoy watching dancers that include them. There is also the challenge and banter that goes with learning and dancing them which I enjoyed with a fixed partner.

Good reasons.

Having a fixed partner takes much of the risk away because balance, weight, timing etc are not left to chance. Trust is a two way thing with drops. Some women say they are ok to do them but don't have the skill to do them. For example, I have on occasion nearly crippled myself trying to stop my partner crashing into the floor because they didn't support their own weight when they should have done for the chosen move.

Probably some would say you should have let them fall. Is there a protocol in these situations? Although, you probably should assess her capability before launching into anything seriously off balance so you might be partly responsible for having exceeded the follower's ability. Do you think having practised a lot with a fixed partner you tend to assume, wrongly, that other partners will respond in exactly the same way?

I will ask about workshops. I've never seen any drops based workshops but probably because I've never thought to look before.
Has anyone been on any they would recommend?

I attended one years ago run by Peter Philips, (Lounge Lizard on this forum) but I've no idea if he's still active as a teacher.

[SteveP]

I often enjoy them but am much more wary than I used to be having hurt my back in a drop.

I'm not surprised you are wary. It makes me wary when I consider the consequences of doing these kind of moves without both parties having practised first. Its probably why I would probably be over cautious and not do a drop unless I was very sure of my partner. Thinking about it, I often only offer drops with those dancers I have seen doing them with other dance partners before hand. A bit of a cop out I know but at least there is less chanced to luck.

Do you think having practised a lot with a fixed partner you tend to assume, wrongly, that other partners will respond in exactly the same way?

Not really, if anything it makes me more wary. For example, I have Peter Phillips Drops and seducers DVDs which I got at a weekender a couple of years ago. There are moves on those DVDs that are fantastic to watch such as double wave, necktie, shoulder drop, piano etc but you couldn't possibly use them in a dance without serious practice with your partner. (I can't do those moves by the way but would love to learn them safely) However, if you do take the trouble to learn them safely then its very rewarding. Now a Peter Phillips workshop is one I would love to go on.

[Minnie M]

.......I attended one years ago run by Peter Philips, (Lounge Lizard on this forum) but I've no idea if he's still active as a teacher.

running Rock 'n Roll events these days

[Modern Jiv'r]

Might be a bit of a trek but you should try Wendy & Kane from... (Sussex/Kent?). They teach their own workshops, for independants and also JiveTime & Jive Addiction weekenders - drops, seducers and even aerials, all taught with safety as their no.1 priority. A great teaching couple - I'd recommend them to anyone

[Lee Bartholomew]

Might be a bit of a trek but you should try Wendy & Kane from... (Sussex/Kent?). They teach their own workshops, for independants and also JiveTime & Jive Addiction weekenders - drops, seducers and even aerials, all taught with safety as their no.1 priority. A great teaching couple - I'd recommend them to anyone

adrenaline Jive (http://www.adrenalinjive.com/) They Teach in Burgess Hill in West Sussex and East Dean in East Sussex.