Is the Customer Always Right?

[Andy McGregor]

It's quite obvious that the customer is not always right. This is the most trite, incorrect, and personally (I find) most annoying sentence trotted out by people who want to appear that they give a damn, when my suspicions are that they don't really.

When you have 2 different customers with totally different ideas about what is the correct procedure, then obviously, they cannot both be right.

Are you one of my customers? No? Then I have to tell that you are not right. If you were a customer I would tell you that you are right.

I have always taken the view that the phrase "the customer is always right" means "each customer thinks they're always right". I then manage the situation accordingly so that they continue to be a customer.

Very occasionally I deduce that a customer wants me to provide something that I don't offer. This is akin to asking for clothes in an off-licence. That person is shopping in the wrong place. I'm not rude, I politely inform that that they are asking for something I don't provide. One day they might decide they want what I offer, but that day is not today.

Let's use a real example from yesterday's class. We had a elderly guy who is obviously coming along to find a woman. He came for the first time because he'd contacted one of our ladies on dating site. She's made it clear she's not interested in dating the guy. But he still come along and corners her for a long chat each night. This was his 4th lesson. He talks to his partners all the way through the lessons and never gets any of the moves and spends the whole of the freestyle chatting to the ladies at the sides. The last time he came I spoke with him individually to tell him that he's be more likely to get the moves if he listened to my instructions rather than continually talking to his partners. This week he talked even more, got even less and joined in with the intermediate lesson too! I'd actually spoken with him individually to ask him not to join in with the intermediate lesson as he wasn't ready for it! When I spoke with him later he said "I've had a bad day, it was come to your class or stay in and drink a bottle of whisky". I have concluded that he is after something that I don't offer. And I don't offer what he wants. Therefore he is not a genuine customer and has come to me by mistake expecting to get something that I don't provide - therefore he is wrong.

The phrase I've occasionally found myself using is "I'm sorry that what we offer isn't what you want".

But customers? Yes, they're always right ...

.. except for when they shouldn't be customers or you don't want them to be customers.

[TheTramp]

Ayup, we can all find extreme (trite) examples to put up to show that we're right, even if they don't really relate to the actual discussion.

So, to get back to the original proposition (that the customer is not always actually and factually (which is inferred by the sentence, without actually being stated within in until now) right):

Two customers, and lets assume that they're normal (happy, smooth, non jerky, non sleazy, nice, friendly, personable) dancers (who step back on the correct foot, and who pay attention when you're teaching, without talking), who you want as customers.

One comes up to you and pleasantly informs you that you're playing too much swing music, and not enough current (top 40) tracks. You turn around, and the other is there pleasantly informing you that you're playing too many current (top 40) tracks, and not enough swing tracks.

You offer both sorts of music at your venues as a matter of course during the evening (and for swing & current, you can substitute in blues, rock, r&b, whatever other sorts of music that you currently play). So they are not asking particularly for something that you don't offer.

So, as you say, you manage the situation accordingly so that they continue to be a customer. Which is what I said in the original post I made, but which you didn't cut and paste in your selective quoting of my post. I fail really to see the need for a thread on this topic, when you are basically agreeing with me. You can't agree with the line "The customer is always right", and as you say, you don't. You agree with the line "The customer thinks that they are always right". Which is something quite different.

[Gerry]

Andy
It will be really interesting to see you wriggle out of this debate.

me thinks game, set and Match to the Tramp

[straycat]

The customer is very often not right. I see no problem with this.

As a rule of thumb, though, the customer is, IMO, always important, and their opinions are valid and worth paying attention to.

[philsmove]

Yes the customer is always right
Misguide? Maybe
Pig ignorant? Often
A dam fool? frequently
If a customer wants something I don’t normally provide, that's not a problem, provided he is prepared to pay my fees
On one memorable occasion, a well known company wanted to hire a piece of equipment that was under a huge pile of rubbish at the back of the garage and I did not want to get it out, so I quoted ten times the normal hire rate, they immediately accepted the quote and paid me another big fee for getting it to them that night
That said, if an individual wanted something different on a group event, they could not have it, they had to hire the whole team for their own private event

PS the above has nothing to with dance, just my view on customer relations

[TheTramp]

Yes the customer is always right
Misguide? Maybe
Pig ignorant? Often
A dam fool? frequently
If a customer wants something I don’t normally provide, that's not a problem, provided he is prepared to pay my fees
On one memorable occasion, a well known company wanted to hire a piece of equipment that was under a huge pile of rubbish at the back of the garage and I did not want to get it out, so I quoted ten times the normal hire rate, they immediately accepted the quote and paid me another big fee for getting it to them that night

So. The customer is always right....

That said, if an individual wanted something different on a group event, they could not have it, they had to hire the whole team for their own private event

Except when they're not?? Gotta love it when people argue against themselves!

[Andy McGregor]

Andy
It will be really interesting to see you wriggle out of this debate.

me thinks game, set and Match to the Tramp

you are basically agreeing with me. You can't agree with the line "The customer is always right", and as you say, you don't. You agree with the line "The customer thinks that they are always right". Which is something quite different.

I think the Tramp and I are agreeing. Mostly.

I fail really to see the need for a thread on this topic,

Because it's a long way off-topic from the Ceroc Champs thread. I know I've already stretched the topic by talking about the "characters" who are involved in other competitions, but that is still related to the topic in a loose way. But discussion of customer relations is way off-topic.

On the subject of cutomer relations, I must admit that my view has hardened over the years I've been running venues. I carefully consider complainers, moaners, stinkers, people not paying attention in the lesson, pervs, etc, etc. I look at them with a view to how their continued presence will affect our business. If I believe they will put off just one customer I will not hesitate to take decisive action.

[Rocky]

I've written on this topic before so I guess my feedback is not news. I think the statement that the customer is always right to be one of the most erroneous statements ever made. It's just rubbish.

For example, no company has to put up with a customer being rude to their staff or other customers no matter how justified they feel it is. Could their view point be valid, maybe... but if it is expressed in a rude and confrontational manner then it ceases to be a valid point. That's not to say that you wouldn't still assess the opinion and act accordingly if necessary.

If someone constantly complains about things at a venue then you are far better off asking them not to come back. They will be a bad influence and in my experience people like that actually stop other people attending the venue. By giving them the time of day you are reinforcing their belief that it's ok to complain about anything and everything. This is a sweeping statement and of course all cases should be treated on their own merits - and you do that by assessing their tone, their opinion and what you know about them before acting.

If however, an issue is raised in a polite and non confrontational way, then of course you should treat their view with the respect it deserves.

The fact that someone has a view or an opinion doesn't necessarily mean it is valid because they will rarely be in possession of all the facts. It may be valid to them but they are not running the night! An organizers job is to balance the opinion of the majority and not to compromise that to appease a vocal individual.

[philsmove]

So. The customer is always right....



Except when they're not?? Gotta love it when people argue against themselves!

The customer is allways right , but sometimes they are in the wrong place

[Prian]

I have a feeling that the phrase comes from the "catering industry." That as the person paying for the meal that you can have as you want it. Which I think can work in a restaurant, where the food is made to order. Where anything is made or done to an individual order then a customer can expect to have something customised to his or her wishes. If you hire a teacher to come home then to some extent you could ask to be taught in a particular manner. similarly if one hired a DJ then you can ask for the music you like to be played.

But in Ceroc for example where a particular product is being sold for a particular price then there is little or no customer choice.

But like everything in life whether the customer is right or not depends on the situation

Many years ago I worked for JD Wetherspoon's. a customer, one day was ranting to my boss that as the customer he was paying my bosses wages and my boss should behave accordingly. My boss said "what, are you JD Wetherspoon?"

As for Andy's elderly gent, if he made a greater effort at learning or at least pretending to learn then he would have a lot better chance of meeting someone.

[Andy McGregor]

For example, no company has to put up with a customer being rude to their staff or other customers no matter how justified they feel it is. Could their view point be valid, maybe... but if it is expressed in a rude and confrontational manner then it ceases to be a valid point.

I completely agree with Rocky. At some point I make a decision that someone is no longer a customer. From that moment they can be completely wrong. But those people I see as customers are welcome to be "right" - at least until I decide they are no longer a customer.

[Andy McGregor]

As for Andy's elderly gent, if he made a greater effort at learning or at least pretending to learn then he would have a lot better chance of meeting someone.

I'm afraid that MJ classes attract some people who are desperately lonely. And, for the time they are with you, they are slighly less lonely. Unfortunately this means they have a lot to say when they get someone who they think will listen.

I blame the agony aunts who used to advise people to join a club and make new friends - they really do need to join a club where they have a passing intest in the activity of the club.

I'm reminded of fencing clubs, there is usually a small group of people who sit and chat and have no interest in fencing. Occasionally they wave a sword around but you can tell they'd rather not be bothered - eventually you stop asking them for a fight because there's no joy in beating someone who doesn't want to win.

It's the same if someone attends dance class for the sole reason of meeting a new man/woman. They have no interest in learning to dance and cause disruption in the lesson as they see that as an opportunity to get to know people - where is that Tazer when you need it?

[Prian]

As I said, if he actually concentrated more on the dancing the meeting someone becomes easier. I noticed that the girls can sense if someone is there to "pull" and it puts them off. Even the girls who are there to "meet someone."

[Andy McGregor]

As I said, if he actually concentrated more on the dancing the meeting someone becomes easier. I noticed that the girls can sense if someone is there to "pull" and it puts them off. Even the girls who are there to "meet someone."

If this was true I'd be a total babe-magnet. I'm not attending dance class to "pull" in any way whatsoever. And I've never had a "pull" or even a nibble

[djtrev]

What a strange debate.
Customer:I love that track by Alexandra Burke that you just played.
DJ;Sorry you were wrong,it was by Leona Lewis.

[Andy McGregor]

What a strange debate.
Customer:I love that track by Alexandra Burke that you just played.
DJ;Sorry you were wrong,it was by Leona Lewis.

But now the cutomer is right and you made the customer right. So the customer is now right. And it's our job to make sure they are "always right".

[DJ Mike]

If this was true I'd be a total babe-magnet. I'm not attending dance class to "pull" in any way whatsoever. And I've never had a "pull" or even a nibble

Just because girls get put off if they sense you are trying to pull, doesn't mean they aren't put off just because you're not trying to pull.

[Prian]

And I've never had a "pull" or even a nibble

I had 4 and I didn't go to pull or make friends or learn to dance. I went as a chaperon on the condition that I did not have to dance.

But seriously, what I mean is that if you join any club or society and set about learning their ways it becomes much easier to meet and communicate with the people there even just from a platonic perspective.

We might be digressing a bit here though Andy.

[Billi Wiz]

The customer is very often not right. I see no problem with this.

As a rule of thumb, though, the customer is, IMO, always important, and their opinions are valid and worth paying attention to.

Ah bless - a sane man...... Totally agree dude!

[djtrev]

but now the cutomer is right and you made the customer right. So the customer is now right. And it's our job to make sure they are "always right".

what!!!