Edit ......
"mostly" no way - beginners should NEVER backlead (or whatever you want to call it)
have ever seen Franck freestyle ???
amazing dancers and teachers -but to be fair Scotland has some amazing teachers too, some of my favourite leads have been taught by Franck and his crew (who taught Tigerpants aka Charlie)
--ooOoo--
Age is a question of mind over matter, if you don't mind, it doesn't matter
Leroy (Satchel) Paige (1906-1982)
Mickey Mouse's girlfriend, Minnie, made her film debut, along with Mickey, in "Steamboat Willie" on November 18, 1928.
That date is recognized as her official birthday.
Edit ......
Was that nagging because you were dancing in the wrong zone?
You (or I) will never be up to Kyle's standard - we started dancing too late in life - but I do like your attitude as it seems to be one of being happier with what you CAN do than fretful about what you CAN'T do - whether this is through ignorance (in a literal sense) or acceptance I don't know but it's definitely a good mindset to have if you want to enjoy your dancing
Another useful comparison. I reckon you can do it enjoyably.
Modern Jive and Argentine Tango because they're already being discussed.
Cha Cha because the footwork is comparable to WCS, whereas Modern Jive and Argentine Tango don't have to involve particular footwork.
If you take a range of relatively well known dances, the earlyish enjoyment curve they might rank something like this from easy to hard:-
- Modern Jive
- - -
- Social Foxtrot
- Cha Cha
- Salsa
- Argentine Tango
- - -
- Slow Waltz
- Lindy/ECS
- - -
- Quickstep
- Rumba
- Ballroom Tango.
- - -
X - WCS ?
- Viennese Waltz
- Ballroom Samba
- Slow Foxtrot.
I've yet to make a full list, but there is a lot of characteristics that move WCS to the other end of the scale compared to modern jive.
The biggest issue with WCS is probably the way the leader and follower move in such distinctly different ways.
Combine that with a slow music, large distance between partners and a relatively tenuous physical connection.
Last edited by frodo; 27th-May-2010 at 11:08 PM.
I am one of the few MJ teachers who does teach footwork. I think learning footwork means that you are much less likely to get bad habits. However, the downside is that it takes a little bit longer to get the dance - probably another 10 minutes.
I used to use the "magic" approach and that worked well for the majority of people. However, I have found from experience that a minority of people seem to find MJ much easier if they are told what to do with their feet - a slightly larger minority than the one that is totally confused when you say "guys, put your weight on your right foot and step to the left with your left foot".
However, if you attend a dance weekender and watch a room full of people dancing MJ, 99% of them are doing the same "particular" footwork. And 99% of them attended a class where the teacher says nothing about footwork and just teaches moves.
What you are not seeing on that crowded dance floor is the people who needed to be taught footwork - they gave up MJ and took up line-dancing, ballroom, Latin, or some other dance where they can get clear instructions.
My personal perspective is that MJ is the most simple social partner dance with the most simple footwork. Why simplify the dance even more by not telling them the simple footwork? Or, even worse, saying "there is no footwork"
Last edited by Andy McGregor; 30th-May-2010 at 10:07 AM.
Too defeatist Robd
I may never be like Kyle but I am sure I can get to a standard where people want to dance with me and I'm happy about my dancing. I think I'm pretty much there in that place with Ceroc after 20 months from nothing.
If I aim for where he was in 2007, rather than were he is now. Then I think that's achievable, obviously not tommorrow (unless it turns into a groundhog day) but with enough effort you can get as smooth as that. Then just take it to the next level by having his understanding and you're halfway there. I tell you what, remind me in two years time at Southport May 2012 that I said this and we will see how far I've come from nothing.
Then I've got to fit in Blues, with Rocky, Val and Lucky Skillen being my markers. Probably a year or so for that (hopefully the dance learning accelerates)
Tango with Amir being the standard bearer there. (Probably about 18 months again)
Not really into the Ballroom stuff but could be fun to have a go. I think that will be in 2020.
I don't know about that last one. Doug Stilton seems to get dancers http://www.howtofeelupyourdancepartner.com/
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...to answer the thread I did a few weeks WCS in Bristol last year - the teacher was Paul Warden - he was helpful, entertaining & though one of the best WCS dancers I've seen (watching on weekenders) did not make the dance hard, in fact when I asked if I could try intermediates he said it was up to me if I felt good enough - good teaching in my book. The demonstraters were Susan Minor & Dawn (surname escapes me) - both were helpful, too... the class though? The women there nearly all tried to mystify the dance, probably justifying why they felt they hadnt got the hang of it themsleves after several weeks or maybe they were doing it cos they thought it was hip. Also remember an American couple teaching on a Ceroc weekender, too, top dollar, too.
G
..thought that it might just have been that class, but seems not then and remember a friend doing great impressions of 'mystifying' WCS dancers after a beginners class , having said all this I did have some nice dances with my jive-wcs fudge style with wcs dancers on recent Ceroc weekenders in wcs room,
G
Do you mean that the women were saying they thought the dance was hard? Maybe that's because it is hard. After all, that would explain why they took more than a few weeks to learn it.
Potentially bad teaching in my book, if you then went on to ruin your followers' experience in the intermediate class because you had no idea what you were doing. Maybe he just said that because if he wouldn't let you then he would lose a customer. Good business but not good teaching.when I asked if I could try intermediates he said it was up to me if I felt good enough - good teaching in my book
I don't know - maybe you are a superbly talented natural dancer who can pick up anything in the space of a few weeks. But if not, I think you're probably deceiving yourself when you imply that it's an easy dance and that people who struggle with its complexities are rubbish.
Did you feel good enough, BTW? What did the ladies think?
Last edited by jivecat; 29th-June-2010 at 12:30 PM.
You're right Andy, too little information there. I should have said I'm foolish to have wasted the last couple of years going to West Coast Swing classes thinking it's a great dance style taught by great teachers and that the more effort you put in both learning the dance and getting to know the people the more friendly they become and rewarding the dancing gets.
But know I realise - because you've said so - that the dancers are befuddled at best, snobbish at worst and the teachers are only semi-competent. The music's probably dreadful too, no?
I'm confused too. Can you just remind me how many West Coast classes you have personally done and when the last one was.
Thanks
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