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Thread: Question for Lory the Pro..

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    Registered User Chicklet's Avatar
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    Question for Lory the Pro..

    hahaha it's about hair!

    Loverly Lory (or anyone else of course), do you happen to know what is included / excluded to make the different ~kinds~ of shampoo and conditioner and why on earth they bother?

    I recently bought Pantene for layered hair mostly because it was two for one but partly because I was fascinated to see = feel how it might be different to other shampoos, oh and cos I do have a lot of layers these days.

    Bottom line the shamp was fine but the condit was useless, 1/4 of a bottle for 5+ mins to get anywhere near doing anything useful.

    AND is there a cheapo shampoo for BIG HAIR like wot I have to make it in BOUNCY BEYONCE hair?
    Not paying >~£4 for a bottle of what I know fine well to be essentially washing up liquid, what intrigues me is what tiny little bits of other wonderscience do they put in there to try and make them *special*

    etc
    etc
    feel free to talk about all aspects of (HEID!) hair here.

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    Re: Question for Lory the Pro..

    Great idea for a thread!

    On holiday I was reduced to using shower gel/ washing up liquid to wash my hair 'cos I ran out and nothing dreadful seems to have happened.

    I often read the list of ingredients on shampoo bottles and wonder what it all means.

    I always buy moderate price level products for my hair (not the stuff that comes in gallon containers for a pound, stuff like Pantene) and can honestly say I don't notice any diference between them except for the perfume.

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    Forum Bombshell - Our Queen! Lory's Avatar
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    Re: Question for Lory the Pro..

    Well, I'll try to explain to the best of my ability..

    Essentially, the hair is made of a substance protein called “keratin.”

    Hair also contains natural oils (lipids) and water.

    These hair is made up of 3 layers:

    the cuticle - the outside (which is a bit like fish scales);

    the cortex (the inside of the hair consisting of lots of tiny filaments, which give the hair its strength

    the medula (a soft spongy-like core in the center of the cortex, which turns to jelly if you over bleach etc)

    At the base of the hair is the sebaceous gland (or oil gland) which lubricates and keeps the hair healthy and shiny, as well as the arrector pili, a tiny muscle that contracts when your cold (or excited) to pull the hair up straight and give you Goosebumps

    I should also mention that your hair is dead, once it leaves the scalp

    Every persons hair is different and needs to be treated differently to get the best results - yes, washing up liquid will get rid of the grease and dirt but you may well find that you can't get a comb through it and after a few weeks, all the natural oils will the stripped and the cuticles will start to open up and breakage will occur.

    Now to your question, what's the difference between certain shampoos and conditioners

    Well, hair reacts to acid and alkaline in different ways... a low PH (acid) will make the outer cuticle lay flat, making it smoother and shinier - great for course, wavy and dry hair (dry hair, because it allows the 'sebum' natural grease, to travel along the hair shaft)

    But something that's slightly alkaline, makes the hair swell sightly, and raises the cuticle, thus making the hair look thicker and more bouncy, it also encourages the natural curl in the hair. So its great for fine limp and greasy hair (obviously the grease can't travel up the hair shaft as quickly)

    And the same goes for conditioners, except the don't have any cleansing agents and emulsifying agents but instead they have water softening ingredients and serums to coat the hair to make it easier to comb.

    Now, here's the dillema. Do you go for the product that's best for the condition of your hair, or the ne which make your hair 'look' great but only in the 'short term'?

    My advice is.

    Use a shampoo strong enough to get the grease and dirt out, don't over rub your actual hair when its wet, as its at its weakest then! But stimulating (rubbing vigourously) the roots, will make the sebaceous glands work hard and which produces the natural oils and also brings the blood to the roots, which feeds the hair.. all good for dry hair, terrible for greasy hair!

    And now THIS is the important bit...

    If your hair is fine, greasy, straight and lank... ONLY apply the conditioner sparingly to THE ENDS, do not let it touch the roots

    And for the those with course, curly, wavy, dry, permed or coloured, then apply the conditioner liberally and all over!

    I hope that helps?
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    Re: Question for Lory the Pro..

    or do what i do - wash your hair with the nearest thing in the shower basket

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    Re: Question for Lory the Pro..

    Thanks for the info above Lory, - very interesting

    The one thing that horrified me, when I looked into it, is the chemicals that the big companies use to achieve this effect... the most famous of these chemicals is Sodium Lauryl sulphate

    OK wiki isn't the most reliable of resources - but I have seen some of the research projects that this info is based on.

    I switched to a brand that doesn't have any of this in the recipe last September or so, and now my skin is miles better, I must be one of the sensitive skins mentioned in the article (I still get the occasional break out, but not half as bad)

    Now I'm on a mission, to slowly switch all my regular use products away from this chemical..

    Might be a bit more expensive, but I'd rather have my health than my money.

    WT

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    Re: Question for Lory the Pro..

    Ooooh, so using the shampoo and conditioners for fine hair makes my hair a bit fatter but also brings out the wave?

    What can I do to make my hair look fatter but NOT bring out the wave? Have tried blow drying it but I'm kack-handed and after a couple if hours the ends flick out anyway and I just might not have bothered.

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    Re: Question for Lory the Pro..

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadful Scathe View Post
    or do what i do - wash your hair with the nearest thing in the shower basket


    But why was I reading this thread anyway

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    Re: Question for Lory the Pro..

    Quote Originally Posted by whitetiger1518 View Post
    Thanks for the info above Lory, - very interesting

    The one thing that horrified me, when I looked into it, is the chemicals that the big companies use to achieve this effect... the most famous of these chemicals is Sodium Lauryl sulphate
    ...


    SLS!! Horrible stuff .... and it's absolutely everywhere!!! All common and major brand soap or cleaning agents have this foaming and degreasing agent. Maybe 'Killer in the Bathroom' is really overly dramatic and sensational.

    It really is everywhere. And, ok, washing liquid, and surface cleaners are one thing, but toothpastes, mouth washes, soaps, shampoos, bubble baths, and even some conditioners .... I think (but could well be very wrong) ... is completely different. It's been around for a long time, so clearly can't be hugely bad

    It seems to have been invented in Sheffield for toothpaste, then used in the textile industry. However, changing from standard toothpastes to non-SLS toothpastes has severly reduced my propensity to mouth ulcers [which I historically get, every time I bite my lip or tongue]. I don't trust it .... at all!! At least not for personal use.

    I seem to remember something about SLS having a positive effect on the nastier types of blue-green algae .... but that might be a mirage!!

    However, I really do think that we have to be careful about what we pour down the sink. All these anti-bacterial liquid soaps can't be having a wonderful effect on the delicate balance of the ecology of our waterways.


    As for conditioners; I am really no more then a half-hearted amateur, but was hearing from a hair dresser that the cheaper ones simply coat each follicle with silicon! Perhaps someone can verify.
    Last edited by Magic Hans; 29th-September-2009 at 03:43 PM.

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    Re: Question for Lory the Pro..

    Quote Originally Posted by whitetiger1518 View Post
    Sodium Lauryl sulphate

    I switched to a brand that doesn't have any of this in the recipe last September or so, and now my skin is miles better, I must be one of the sensitive skins mentioned in the article (I still get the occasional break out, but not half as bad)
    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Hans View Post
    SLS!! Horrible stuff .... -snips-

    However, changing from standard toothpastes to non-SLS toothpastes has severly reduced my propensity to mouth ulcers [which I historically get, every time I bite my lip or tongue]. I don't trust it .... at all!! At least not for personal use.
    Actually you've hit on a very important point here. looking after your scalp, is just as important as looking after your hair!

    I know from bitter experience about SLS, as my daughter developed quite a serious allergy to it, when she was about 10 and like MH, had terrible mouth ulcers. She was sent for all sorts of tests as mouth ulcers can be a sign of something more sinister

    Then, someone totally un-health trained (can't think of a better term lol) said in passing about avoiding SLS in toothpastes and hey presto, within a week she was fine! (BTW Waitrose do one, other wise its the health food shop)

    Anyway, since then, I've looked into it a little bit as I wasn't sure what other products it might be in and as you said, its in LOT'S!!!

    The good news is, it would appear that SLS is safe, for those not allergic but most people don't know they're allergic, they just think they have bad skin psoriasis and dandruff and itchy and irritable skin can all be caused by allergies.
    MODERATOR AT YOUR SERVICE
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    Re: Question for Lory the Pro..

    Before she died, a relative of mine used to sometimes gave me shampoo and conditioner which is used in hair salons.

    It has to be diluted.

    It was fantastic, not the same as what we buy.


    I usually buy Pantene, but there are about 10 variations now.

    Also I usually buy "volume and body", but this sells out quickly - must be the most popular.

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    Re: Question for Lory the Pro..

    Quote Originally Posted by Icey View Post

    What can I do to make my hair look fatter
    You've have to use something like mouse or or another pre blo-drying product, I'm afraid. One that keeps the moisture out once dryed.

    Do you want it full but straight?

    If so, I have a tip..

    Put the product on your hair, making sure its down to the roots. comb it though to evenly distribute it.

    The turn your head upside down and aim the dryer just at the roots, massaging in gentle circular motions. Then tip your head up the right way finish drying and use straighteners if required but only on the ends and the tops section to the parting.
    For an even more full look (a secret tip of the trade) use crimping irons, right next to the roots, only on the first inch of hair and only on the hair thats underneath, make sure your parting is sleek!

    right any more and your gonna have to pay!
    MODERATOR AT YOUR SERVICE
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    Re: Question for Lory the Pro..

    Quote Originally Posted by Astro View Post

    Also I usually buy "volume and body", but this sells out quickly - must be the most popular.
    But what's fantastic for YOU, might be rubbish for somebody else.

    I have a friend who swears by Vosene.... I can't even get a comb though my hair after using it!

    Gosh, I've just horrific memories of my Mum washing my VERY long hair, and the tears!
    MODERATOR AT YOUR SERVICE
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    Re: Question for Lory the Pro..

    Quote Originally Posted by Lory View Post
    Gosh, I've just horrific memories of my Mum washing my VERY long hair, and the tears!
    My mum had no stick with looking after our hair when we were young - it was washed with Johnsons Baby shampoo and then a comb was hacked through from scalp to ends

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    Re: Question for Lory the Pro..

    Quote Originally Posted by Lory View Post
    You've have to use something like mouse
    Times have changed since I was a stylist!

    Quote Originally Posted by Lory View Post
    I have a friend who swears by Vosene.... I can't even get a comb though my hair after using it!

    Gosh, I've just horrific memories of my Mum washing my VERY long hair, and the tears!
    I love the smell of Vosene it reminds me of my childhood. (Although I can never use it on my hair either) I buy it for Ian to use

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    Re: Question for Lory the Pro..

    Quote Originally Posted by Cruella View Post
    Times have changed since I was a stylist!
    it only works on people who have a fear of them!
    MODERATOR AT YOUR SERVICE
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    Re: Question for Lory the Pro..

    Quote Originally Posted by Lory View Post
    I know from bitter experience about SLS, as my daughter developed quite a serious allergy to it, when she was about 10 and like MH, had terrible mouth ulcers.
    I have read that SLS in toothpaste can cause mouth ulcers. Rather more annoying is that I also read that SLS is only put in toothpaste to make it froth. You could take SLS out of toothpaste and the toothpaste would still work just fine.........BUT, as we are all conditioned to think that toothpaste *should* froth the manufacturers leave it in to keep us all happy

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    Re: Question for Lory the Pro..

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadful Scathe View Post
    or do what i do - wash your hair with the nearest thing in the shower basket
    And hope your other half hasn't left the nair in the wrong place again

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    Re: Question for Lory the Pro..

    Quote Originally Posted by Icey View Post
    Ooooh, so using the shampoo and conditioners for fine hair makes my hair a bit fatter but also brings out the wave?

    What can I do to make my hair look fatter but NOT bring out the wave? Have tried blow drying it but I'm kack-handed and after a couple if hours the ends flick out anyway and I just might not have bothered.
    Liberation from the tyranny of blowdrying, that's what I'm after. What shampoo should I use to make my hair fat, wavy, but not fluffy?

    Maybe that Nair is a good idea after all.

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    Re: Question for Lory the Pro..

    Quote Originally Posted by Lory View Post
    Gosh, I've just horrific memories of my Mum washing my VERY long hair, and the tears!
    I too had long hair and my mother invented the Croydon facelift.

    I was in agony - plaits, bunches, sleeping in rags for ringlets - she even bought a doughnut thingy and put my hair in a bun.

    All the time muttering, "I can't do anything with this hair, it's as straight as a yard of pump water - just like your Grandma's."

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    Re: Question for Lory the Pro..

    Quote Originally Posted by jivecat View Post
    Liberation from the tyranny of blowdrying, that's what I'm after. What shampoo should I use to make my hair fat, wavy, but not fluffy?
    I don't think the shampoo is going to have a major effect here.. the first thing is, you don't want to 'over' condition your hair, especially if its fine and has a tendency to go fluffy.

    First of all a question, has your hair got its own natural wave/curl in it to start with, if not, your kind of flogging a dead horse

    But if is has, here's my best advice..

    After washing, wrap your hair in a towel and leave till all the excess moisture has gone, without rubbing, as this will make your hair fluffy.

    Next apply a mousse (not a mouse, as previously suggested )comb though thoroughly but now tip you head upside down and comb it that way and gently squeeze hand fulls of hair, to encourage the curl...

    Then, and this is the important bit, dry it upside down, using a hairdryer with a 'diffuser' (this allows the heat but stops the hair from being blown around..thus creating 'fluffiness') touch the hair as little as possible at this stage... (BTW this is an extremely quick way of drying your hair)

    Next and equally important, use a VERY VERY wide toothed comb (like an affro comb or wider) and just tease the hair about.

    Now your hair should be full (or fat as you call it ) and wavy but hoefully have NO fluffyness!

    I hope this helps, Good luck!
    Last edited by Lory; 30th-September-2009 at 02:44 PM.
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