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Thread: Databases

  1. #1
    Registered User Tessalicious's Avatar
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    Databases

    Hi all,

    A while ago, I wrote an Access database for my new company to use for tracking our content. It has since been upsized into MSSQL (still using an Access front-end) by an external supplier, to increase its speed and reliability.

    Now, we need to do some complex development work on the database structure; add some tables here, change some relationships there, etc. Thing is, I'm only a *bit* of a geek, so I've not worked in MSSQL, and this would be a project that I couldn't spend all my time on, and we only really have a couple of months to get it done.

    So, can anyone suggest either a) a quick and easy way to learn MSSQL or b) a friend or a colleague (or yourself) who might be interested in a few weeks of freelance database design work?

    Thanks in advance,
    Tess x

  2. #2
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    Re: Databases

    Quote Originally Posted by Tessalicious View Post
    ...we need to do some complex development work on the database structure
    ...
    a) a quick and easy way to learn MSSQL
    MS SQL is a real database, so it's a bit trickier to learn than Access (essentially, you need to know and understand SQL). If it's embedded in an application, which is sounds like it is, then it's quite important to get it right. You probably could learn it and do something useful in a few months if you can afford to focus on it, but it's probably not the best use of your time. If you were a lot of a geek, you'd probably do it more quickly.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tessalicious View Post
    b) a friend or a colleague (or yourself) who might be interested in a few weeks of freelance database design work?
    This is a much better option; but I'd make sure you have it reasonably well speced out if you're going with someone you don't know. And make sure you have some clear understabding around testing and support.

    The only SQL developers I know are busy, but I'll keep an eye out.

  3. #3
    Registered User Beowulf's Avatar
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    Re: Databases

    Quote Originally Posted by Tessalicious View Post
    So, can anyone suggest either a) a quick and easy way to learn MSSQL or b) a friend or a colleague (or yourself) who might be interested in a few weeks of freelance database design work?
    You've be better off with (B) although freelance DBA's do not tend to come cheap. SQL in all it's flavours (Think of SQL as English.. then think of Oracle PL/SQL, MSSQL, MySQL etc as regional dialects ) isn't that difficult to learn, but you need time. And there's more to Database design than just making tables. You need to know when to normalise .. and when not to. When to Use triggers and why? and saving common queries as views etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by geoff332 View Post
    The only SQL developers I know are busy, but I'll keep an eye out.
    I know I am or I'd offer to help. But I'm swamped

    Currently Working with Oracle but MSSQL and MySQL (for the webstuff) were my forte previously) If I hear of anyone looking for a little work I'll sound them out about their availability for you.

    I do have one Contractor friend but I have to see if he's working already. However.. he wouldn't be cheap you might be cheaper looking for a recent graduate for a short term contract.

    EDIT

    Transact-SQL (T-SQL) Reference for MS SQL

    Might help if you're doing it yourself.
    Last edited by Beowulf; 17th-July-2009 at 01:13 PM.

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    Re: Databases

    Quote Originally Posted by Tessalicious View Post
    Hi all,

    A while ago, I wrote an Access database for my new company to use for tracking our content. It has since been upsized into MSSQL (still using an Access front-end) by an external supplier, to increase its speed and reliability.

    Now, we need to do some complex development work on the database structure; add some tables here, change some relationships there, etc. ...
    I do not know you or your company, so please do not take this personally.

    Microsoft does not like supporting two database products that are in competition with each other at the low end of the market. The MSAccess team know their stuff, and it is reliable enough and quick enough for the vast majority of database business applications. Microsoft give away the Express Edition to try and wean people away from Access.

    Most developers aim for the big bucks and the high end of the market, so prefer Sequel Server. Dealing with small businesses can be more of a nightmare than dealing with big ones, for poor returns. The purists also dislike Access.

    Usually when I hear "A mate wrote it for me" or "I did it myself" any complaints about reliability and speed are down to poor design and implementation. The fact that you are seeking help now makes me worry about your external supplier. Swapping an F1 for an Escort wchich needed an engine problem fixed may not have been the best solution for your business.

    You need someone that really knows what they are doing to get the design right. If the foundation stone is crooked, the building will be crooked. When the database is doing the mission critical stuff, the "money" bit, then you can think about adding bells and whistles with your own queries. There are plenty of forums to help with problems, and lots of good educational sites on the web. Many of the Microsoft MVP (Most valued Professional) developer sites have load of excellent free resources.

    Good luck

  5. #5
    Registered User Beowulf's Avatar
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    Re: Databases



    there's nothing wrong with Access. If i needed to drive round London, do shopping and occasionally take people to weekenders I wouldn't immediately opt for a Lamborgini.. a Renault Megane would probably be sufficient.

    Access is a very competent database system. it has it's limitations but it's not meant to be an uber database package.. in fact no such thing exists.

    if your database needs to be up 24/7, have many multiple concurrent users (more than a dozen say), be blisteringly fast and have tables with more than 50,000 rows and what not then SQL Server is probably (but not definately) required.

    However if there's no need for SQL server (other than a salesman telling you you need it) then stick with Access.

    SQL Server is VERY powerful. But like a sports car it's not so easy to drive. It's more expensive. Takes more time to look after and it's harder to fix things.

    I am a SQL Server Developer (among other things.. I have many hats) so feel free to pick my brains any time you want. but without knowing the system and what it's doing I can't really say if SQL server is really required.

    of course, if it's a done deal and you've already upgraded.. then I can help you out with basic table generation scripts and tell you how to link tables and perform basic queries (Insert/update and selects). But you'd really need to get someone "on site" for a month or so to make sure it's all working properly.

    You have my personal email don't you? I'll PM you it in case you don't.

    Pete x

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    The Dashing Moderator
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    Re: Databases

    Quote Originally Posted by Beowulf View Post
    However if there's no need for SQL server (other than a salesman telling you you need it) then stick with Access.
    ...but in Tessa's case
    Quote Originally Posted by Tessalicious View Post
    It has since been upsized into MSSQL (still using an Access front-end)
    so it sounds like the back-end database has already been moved out of Access.
    Love dance, will travel

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    Registered User Magic Hans's Avatar
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    Re: Databases

    22 years in DP [data processing]
    10 years relational database [Oracle, Informix and SQL Server]
    Currently doing a Data Warehouse project with Humber Mental Health NHS TT

    CV if you want it!

    Feel free to send me some details. [current situation and required changes]

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    Registered User Beowulf's Avatar
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    Re: Databases

    ooh a game of Geek Top Trumps !!

    I'll concede this match as you're the best geek for the job

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    Registered User Beowulf's Avatar
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    Re: Databases

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidY View Post
    ...but in Tessa's case

    so it sounds like the back-end database has already been moved out of Access.
    Look.. I said I was a Geek.. I DID NOT SAY I could read

  10. #10
    Registered User Magic Hans's Avatar
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    Re: Databases

    Quote Originally Posted by Beowulf View Post
    ooh a game of Geek Top Trumps !!

    I'll concede this match as you're the best geek for the job
    lol ... Sorry, really only trying to blow my trumpet, not outblow anyone else's!!

    I'm sure that anyone with a few years decent DB background would be up to the job!!

    Incidentally, I might be experienced .... I didn't say I was any good!!!

    'specially in the contract world .... 'You're only a good as the last job!'

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    Re: Databases

    Seems like there's a lot of DBA's and developers who Ceroc?!?! LOL.

    I dabble with MySQL but use to work with MSSQL but certainly not on that geek scale.

  12. #12
    Registered User Tessalicious's Avatar
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    Re: Databases

    Thanks for all the responses chaps - sorry to have been a bit awol. I take all your points about how non-DBAs shouldn't dare to write databases, but I don't feel (from working day in day out with this particular database) that my lack of previous experience is what causes us to need to do this additional work. Instead, changing company demands and infrastructural issues justify them, just like any piece of software that needs a version 2.0 (or 3.0 in this case) to be really good.

    Anyway, I'm having a look at whether the work is something I can do myself, because it's a skill I'm interested to learn, but also exploring MH's offer. I might come back for advice if the bytes forum is proving useless (isn't it weird that I can get better information on software development from a dance forum than from a software development forum?), or just to profess my adject failure and beg for help!

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