Weston UK WCS Championships 17 - 19 April 2009

[FoxyFunkster]

lol.. says the one who sulks after a 5th place...

LOL.....People shouldn`t be happy with getting 5th place, if you enter a competition you want to win right??? You obviously were not around me when i didn`t make finals at BBTB, i vowed to give up WCS, a vow which lasted a full 40 minutes!!

[Rhythm King]

I'm looking forward to what is usually a great event. I'm not really bothered about points, but I won't enter the comps this year because of the rules. Whilst I've been dancing WCS for more than 3 years, I've never placed and I don't see myself in the same league as the likes of Cat, Paul, Rachel, Lee et al.

I may possibly be tempted into the JnJ, if there is a real lack of leaders and the followers are going to miss out.

[Sheepman]

I did enter the J & J. Didn't get anywhere but didn't expect to.

Aren't you forgetting the Jive J & J category, I have a distinct memory of you dancing in the final!

Greg

[Mary]

Aren't you forgetting the Jive J & J category, I have a distinct memory of you dancing in the final!

Greg

Ooops. Yes, sorry. And drew a great partner as well.

M

[AussieJ]

I went to the first year of this event, and wasn't competing, but thought it far outstripped any weekender (or UK MJ comp event) that I have attended. But then I am not a huge fan of those big weekenders anyway.

Not sure how WSM has developed since that first year, but I would highly recommend going for the workshops and social dancing. The competition is great to watch and cabarets awesome of course. I think it's a great overall package.

Hope this helps.

M

Hi sorry for the late reply - you sound as if you're a seasoned WCS dancer? Me, I've only just started lessons, definitely a beginner.

Given that, you still say its a good event to go to for beginners like myself? I mean, has WSM attracted a reasonable number of absolute (or just-about) beginners, or not so much over the past few years?

I can't help but think that if I spent a lot of effort to make it to there, and then find myself the only novice guy surrounded by experienced WCS dancers, it'd be an awkward experience methinks

[Mary]

Hi sorry for the late reply - you sound as if you're a seasoned WCS dancer? Me, I've only just started lessons, definitely a beginner.

Given that, you still say its a good event to go to for beginners like myself? I mean, has WSM attracted a reasonable number of absolute (or just-about) beginners, or not so much over the past few years?

I can't help but think that if I spent a lot of effort to make it to there, and then find myself the only novice guy surrounded by experienced WCS dancers, it'd be an awkward experience methinks

I take your point. When I was a novice (although I will always consider myself a novice - it's that kind of dance), I struggled to sustain an hour of pure WCS freestyle and found it quite easy to go back into the comfort zone of MJ, but then we were all pretty much novices then. I now get far more pleasure from a whole evening of WCS freestyle than MJ freestyle, but the 'scene' has developed quite a lot over the last few years.

I would love to say you would feel comfortable but then that would only be dependent upon where you are within yourself. I am, and was, very happy to watch other people dance and get almost as much enjoyment from watching as doing.

Having said that there is the J and J category where only people who have been social dancing WCS less than a year (better check the rules on that one) are allowed to enter.

All in all it's a great event but it is pure WCS - if you don't think you could take a whole weekend of it then you may feel you've gone into overload, as I don't think there is a MJ element any more.

I hope this helps. I would say trust your instincts and see how the mood takes you nearer the time.

M

[AussieJ]

Thanks to Mary and Rhythm King, I've made up my mind - I want to attend the UK WCS Champs @ Weston !

I now need to figure out two things:

a) Transport - Have no idea how I'm going to do this - I'm in Glasgow. Any forumites in Scotland who're attending the WCS champs??

b) Accommodation - I've had a brief foray into this, for one thing Weston isn't listed at hostelworld.com Need more time (can't right now, I'm at work!) to look this up.


(Actually, is a 'Help wanted for AussieJ attending Weston' thread better than replying to this thread? forum moderators, please advise/move post if you wish.)

[Caro]

I noticed something weird the other day... so, for the Open JnJ, we have to pay 5 pounds extra (i.e. 10 pounds), yet there is no cash prize for it ?? Where does the money go then ? and... why compete then, if there is nothing to win ? (not that I really mind, you could make me compete for anything, but I find the principle odd...)

Traditionally the money received for entries of the JnJ is redistributed for the top 3 to 5 places... sometimes more in the higher divisions... I find it very curious that at Weston this is not the case
John, is this a typo on the website ?

[FoxyFunkster]

I noticed something weird the other day... so, for the Open JnJ, we have to pay 5 pounds extra (i.e. 10 pounds), yet there is no cash prize for it ?? Where does the money go then ? and... why compete then, if there is nothing to win ? (not that I really mind, you could make me compete for anything, but I find the principle odd...)

Traditionally the money received for entries of the JnJ is redistributed for the top 3 to 5 places... sometimes more in the higher divisions... I find it very curious that at Weston this is not the case
John, is this a typo on the website ?

I don`t think it`s a typo but that`s Well one category less i have to worry about winning then! LOL also it`s very odd that is no prize money for the JnJ`s yet there is for the Strictly`s, Jack and Jills are the true test of someones skill and recognosed as that in the states, Strictlys are not taken as seriously....

[Mary]

Thanks to Mary and Rhythm King, I've made up my mind - I want to attend the UK WCS Champs @ Weston !

I now need to figure out two things:

a) Transport - Have no idea how I'm going to do this - I'm in Glasgow. Any forumites in Scotland who're attending the WCS champs??

b) Accommodation - I've had a brief foray into this, for one thing Weston isn't listed at hostelworld.com Need more time (can't right now, I'm at work!) to look this up.


(Actually, is a 'Help wanted for AussieJ attending Weston' thread better than replying to this thread? forum moderators, please advise/move post if you wish.)

i am booked into the Premier Inn, at Weston. You have up until the day before to cancel without incurring any charge. It's about 2 1/2 miles from the venue. There is a multi-storey car park next door to the venue but it is expensive. You can find street parking if you don't mind walking a bit.

Sounds like we might see you there.

M

[frodo]

Traditionally the money received for entries of the JnJ is redistributed for the top 3 to 5 places... sometimes more in the higher divisions... I find it very curious that at Weston this is not the case

Just because the Americans do it that way, why does that make it a good thing ?

As Foxy Funkster implies a JnJ is a better approximation to general dance skills. For that and other reasons it is also of more general interest.


Even when organisers have a free JnJ (as in they redistribute all entry fees as prize money), it is just the less good dancers paying the better dancers. Americans may have a bit of a tradition of that sort of thing, but the underlying merit is less clear.

I reckon not having prize money for the JnJ (other than invitationals) sets a good precedent other organisers would do well to copy.

[Caro]

I reckon not having prize money for the JnJ (other than invitationals) sets a good precedent other organisers would do well to copy.

But then, why would you pay an entry fee ? You're already paying for the event !

[FoxyFunkster]

Just because the Americans do it that way, why does that make it a good thing ?

As Foxy Funkster implies a JnJ is a better approximation to general dance skills. For that and other reasons it is also of more general interest.


Even when organisers have a free JnJ (as in they redistribute all entry fees as prize money), it is just the less good dancers paying the better dancers. Americans may have a bit of a tradition of that sort of thing, but the underlying merit is less clear.

I reckon not having prize money for the JnJ (other than invitationals) sets a good precedent other organisers would do well to copy.

The last line here is total nonsense IMHO! it`s the UK WCS champs for gods sake, the ceroc champs offer £500 holidays for winners of their competitions....it`s not only about the money, it`s about Kudos of winning, trophies and the money, Weekender events cost alot of money, If you win a competition then you should at the very least get your entry fee back...

[Mary]

The last line here is total nonsense IMHO! it`s the UK WCS champs for gods sake, the ceroc champs offer £500 holidays for winners of their competitions....it`s not only about the money, it`s about Kudos of winning, trophies and the money, Weekender events cost alot of money, If you win a competition then you should at the very least get your entry fee back...

This still doesn't really answer the question about the different entry fees for the JnJ categories. I feel I should enter the Novice JnJ, but the rules state that I should enter the Open because I've been social dancing a while, but it's twice the price. Don't want to sound whingy but it does seem a bit of penalty.

M

[johnah]

All in all it's a great event but it is pure WCS - if you don't think you could take a whole weekend of it then you may feel you've gone into overload, as I don't think there is a MJ element any more.

There is also a smooth jive/blues room each night, as always.

[Mary]

There is also a smooth jive/blues room each night, as always.

Apologies, I stand corrected.

M

[frodo]

But then, why would you pay an entry fee ? You're already paying for the event !

Ideally you wouldn't pay an entry fee, in that case.

In general I imagine there are certain costs in judging a Jack and Jill. You probably know better than I whether it costs more to judge a open rather than a novice/newcomer JnJ (maybe they have less people per heat, or more dance time, or the judges have to take more care in getting it right/are more likely to be asked for feedback).

This still doesn't really answer the question about the different entry fees for the JnJ categories. I feel I should enter the Novice JnJ, but the rules state that I should enter the Open because I've been social dancing a while, but it's twice the price. Don't want to sound whingy but it does seem a bit of penalty.

It is a bit more to casually spend, especially if you're not likely to get as far (because of the higher level).

It does seem the time based qualifiers favour people who dance WCS intensively for a short period with expensive tuition, and discourages social dancers.


However I notice there is a 'regularly' qualification to the time period specification.

The interpretation of 'regularly' isn't precisely defined. I think there is little doubt that weekly qualifies, but monthly, quarterly, yearly, at weekenders etc., is more open to question.

The 'regularly' clause may allow quite a few people to dance at a more appropriate level for their skills. Are you sure you don't qualify ?

[frodo]

The last line here is total nonsense IMHO! it`s the UK WCS champs for gods sake, the ceroc champs offer £500 holidays for winners of their competitions....

Probably not for the lucky dip/dance with a stranger type categories, which are the categories in question here.

Also it is not only a competition weekend (like Modern Jive competitions tend to be), but the major UK WCS event of the year.

[mikeyr]

Even when organisers have a free JnJ (as in they redistribute all entry fees as prize money), it is just the less good dancers paying the better dancers. Americans may have a bit of a tradition of that sort of thing, but the underlying merit is less clear

Any Dance competition that offers prize money to any depth is payed for in some way by those that enter the comps or pay to get into the event. Whats your Point

On your point about time based qualifiers for the divisions I agree with you they are extraeneous!

[frodo]

Any Dance competition that offers prize money to any depth is payed for in some way by those that enter the comps or pay to get into the event.

Undoubtedly. Prize money IMO is fine and worthwhile for invitational JnJ, showcases etc.

Whats your Point

Consider the situation where competitions happens at most events, they are mainly social, the partner isn't known in advance and it is normal for people to compete widely.

The point is prize money for lower JnJ levels basically makes it more expensive to dance WCS, and discourages people from starting to compete, for little apparent purpose.

...when you go over to US events, it is common practice for pretty much everyone to compete, at least in Jack'n'Jill (random partners)...

....Because they are mainly social (JnJ and strictlys with pretty much a different partner at each comp)...

By the way I'm not talking about Classic / Showcase divisions here (routines),