Bad Taxis ?

[Trouble]

Taxi dancers are more about personality than capability i think.

If your a friendly person and can dance.. your offered Taxi status. I know many taxi dancers who cant do the footwork properly or teach very well but they encourage and make people feel ok so it kind of works.

Backleading is always bad. It should never be done unless its followed by an explanation as to what was just done and the opportunity for them to do it themselves.

I think frustration sometimes leads to backleading, esp with women taxi dancers. I do it myself to Scarface but only at the beginning, now he has to think for himself and i wont help him at all. Alright for me and him as we are partners but imagine if that was how somebody else was taught then all of a sudden they were left to their own devices....

IMHO of course xx

[emmylou25]

I try not to backlead the beginners I dance with unless they are really struggling. Then I help them along - hopefully getting the direction of the moves right, then ease off until they're leading. (this could also apply to some people really struggling in intermediates where they've commented as I've moved to dance with them "ooh a taxi, maybe I'll get it right now").

What we do try and explain when taking the beginner practise class is that the guys should be leading, and to encourage the guys to lead by a) running through the moves with the lady closing her eyes and b) by saying it's ok to pause/hold while dancing and state to a backleader that "I'm leading". One of them tried it on me in freestyle though, and I didn't even realise I was backleading...oops. But hopefully that then tries to prevent the follows from picking up the bad habit. In my experience it tends to be couples where the lady picks up the moves faster where the guy struggles to lead - and it can be hard to get the lady to change.

On taxi training - our franchisee has done training sessions & teambuilding for taxis/crew. It incorporates the role (ie being friendly, hosts, welcoming, during the class/freestyle etc) but also includes everyone having a go at taking a 'beginner practise session' to get feedback. It's a good training session, but unfortunately it's usually the really dedicated taxis/more experienced or brand new ones who turn up, while some of those who are a bit slack don't...they're usually the ones who need to improve.

[Dreadful Scathe]

Then I would assume you have forgotten just how hard MJ can be to new people

Not at all, the worst thing about being a beginner was someone attempting to backlead.

I certainly found it a great help to be led thru a whole beginner lesson routine when I started. I remember I made about six million apologies to the poor taxi whose life I blighted

Well, thats different - if you requested to be lead so you could get used to the movements, thats fair enough. But I still say that ANY unrequested attempt to back lead is bad...so there

[Lee Bartholomew]

A taxi dancers job is not to teach people how to dance, Ceroc trained teachers are there for that.

A taxi dancer's main job is to get people back through the door the following week. They do this in several ways.

By keeping them going during the intermediate lessons

To ensure that beginners get dances throughout the night

and most importantly, to make sure the dancer feels like they have achived something by the time they go home thus bringing them more confidance.

If the above fails, then the dancer is unlikley to come back.

I would not expect anyone to go home on their first night and say "I got all the moves but don't know how to lead"

It is not untill a few months have gone past that most people start to learn technique. Most of us have been dancing years and are still learning.

Also you have to remember that it is harder for us men to learn than for the women.

[Dreadful Scathe]

I would not expect anyone to go home on their first night and say "I got all the moves but don't know how to lead"

Well exactly, they may not even be aware of leading - all the more reason they shouldnt have that taken from them by someone else leading

[Lee Bartholomew]

Well exactly, they may not even be aware of leading - all the more reason they shouldnt have that taken from them by someone else leading

What is going to be more encouraging to them?

Getting a dance with the 3 moves or so they have learnt that night and going through a whole song

or

Getting a dance with a taxi who just stands there and waits whilst the beginner thinks of some more moves or messes up slightly?

[DavidB]

I know of one Ceroc franchise that has their most senior teacher take the beginner review class. Their view is that it is by far the most important class that they teach.

[ant]

What is going to be more encouraging to them?

Getting a dance with the 3 moves or so they have learnt that night and going through a whole song

or

Getting a dance with a taxi who just stands there and waits whilst the beginner thinks of some more moves or messes up slightly?

I would say slightly is an understatement.

I remember the most encouraging night for me when I was learning. A visiting taxi asked if I was making up my own sequences, to which I said no. She then said this is a very popular sequence and led me into a yoyo, followed by a catapult. That was the biggest eye opener I had and I was being led.

I think there are two types of backleading.

Firstly where the taxi is doing it for no apparent reason, maybe thats not good.

Secondly where the taxi has thought about what she is trying to achieve whilst backleading and maybe that is a good thing.

Overall I have only had good experiences with the lady taxis that helped me when I was learning.

[Trouble]

I
I think there are two types of backleading.


.

I think you are right. There is backleading when you are dancing with somebody to help them get a dance (which is fun and gives them a little bit of dancing for the evening) and there is also backleading in the lesson.

If you do the move for the beginner, they learn nothing. If you show them amd then let them do it afterwards, they might learn something. I have seen taxi dancers just do the move for them and then shuffle them along. Complete waste of time for the beginner.

[Lynn]

There is a time and a place for backleading. Most commonly on request, but occasionally a little bit of it is needed to help a beginner get through a dance. I usually do the 'you have to lead me' with a smile bit cos most of all I want to develop dancers who can lead - but sometimes I need to 'help' a bit (which is not the same as back leading through a whole track). Sometimes developing confidence and a feeling of 'I got through that' is the most important thing.

The most important thing is to know when to do that and when to stand there and make them lead. And that's about 'listening' to their dancing and confidence level. Being able to do that is part of what being a good taxi is about.

[Gav]

We had a bad one on Saturday night.
It cost Scarface £8 for a trip of about a mile and a half!

(don't blame me, you know you wanted to).

[Caz]

I agree with Trouble that taxi ing is about personality as well as a good overall dance ability.

I had training (combined with annual staff party of local franchise afterwards ) so most people turned up.. this really helped... we have this yearly now.

I enjoy taxi ing and I wouldn't want to teach.. I personally get that "buzz" helping people as a taxi.. I remember my first night at an independent venue and we were made to feel less than welcome with the "taxis" being less than helpful... I now make sure that my beginners feel welcome, have a fabulous night and if they go home being able to dance then but IMO dancing and taxi ing is about the person being approachable and a party host type person and remembering that dancing is a hobby (for most of us) esp the newbies who walk in the door.. potentially that person could be the next amazing dancer we all want to dance with It makes my night when beginners leave happy and come back week after week and then you see them dancing on say a weekender / at a freestyle and think "yeah I helped em get here and enjoy this as much as they are doing" (maybe I am just mushy tho...)

[MarkW]

I agree with Trouble that taxi ing is about personality as well as a good overall dance ability.

I had training (combined with annual staff party of local franchise afterwards ) so most people turned up.. this really helped... we have this yearly now.

I enjoy taxi ing and I wouldn't want to teach.. I personally get that "buzz" helping people as a taxi.. I remember my first night at an independent venue and we were made to feel less than welcome with the "taxis" being less than helpful... I now make sure that my beginners feel welcome, have a fabulous night and if they go home being able to dance then but IMO dancing and taxi ing is about the person being approachable and a party host type person and remembering that dancing is a hobby (for most of us) esp the newbies who walk in the door.. potentially that person could be the next amazing dancer we all want to dance with It makes my night when beginners leave happy and come back week after week and then you see them dancing on say a weekender / at a freestyle and think "yeah I helped em get here and enjoy this as much as they are doing" (maybe I am just mushy tho...)

That is as good a definition of the perfect taxi dancer as I've seen.

It would not always be possible to live up to that and I'm sure that I fell short of that ideal many times over the years I was taxiing. I always felt that the minimum was to be reliable about turning up and then be enthusiastic about enjoying dancing.

I have never encountered a bad taxi. One or two realised they were unsuited to it (they found it more of a chore to have to dance a lot with beginners than they had anticipated) so they stopped soon after starting.

[martingold]

I agree with Trouble that taxi ing is about personality as well as a good overall dance ability.

I had training (combined with annual staff party of local franchise afterwards ) so most people turned up.. this really helped... we have this yearly now.

I enjoy taxi ing and I wouldn't want to teach.. I personally get that "buzz" helping people as a taxi.. I remember my first night at an independent venue and we were made to feel less than welcome with the "taxis" being less than helpful... I now make sure that my beginners feel welcome, have a fabulous night and if they go home being able to dance then but IMO dancing and taxi ing is about the person being approachable and a party host type person and remembering that dancing is a hobby (for most of us) esp the newbies who walk in the door.. potentially that person could be the next amazing dancer we all want to dance with It makes my night when beginners leave happy and come back week after week and then you see them dancing on say a weekender / at a freestyle and think "yeah I helped em get here and enjoy this as much as they are doing" (maybe I am just mushy tho...)

I agree wholeheartedly thats exactly why i taxi (proper rep on its way)
The only problem with you being a taxi caz is you will probably lick the beginners

[Dreadful Scathe]

What is going to be more encouraging to them?

Getting a dance with the 3 moves or so they have learnt that night and going through a whole song

or

Getting a dance with a taxi who just stands there and waits whilst the beginner thinks of some more moves or messes up slightly?

Not everyone requires encouragement to keep turning up to MJ classes, even with all the encouragement in the world they may still not come back. What we are talking about here is learning to dance, and I think the practice of back leading is entirely negative.

Your 2nd option above will help the leader learn to lead and is FAR better than the follower automatically back leading. While "going through a whole song" is obviously an early goal, getting back lead through it makes it a pointless exercise. Your first "full song" should be an achievement of your ability to lead. So while you seem to be suggesting that your first option is the better one, i totally disagree - thats something the leader needs to lead themselves.

[martingold]

Not everyone requires encouragement to keep turning up to MJ classes,

true however the majority of men do need it

[Dreadful Scathe]

true however the majority of men do need it

at classes I've been a regular at, we have gone through many more women than men. I'd say its actually the opposite of what you suggest.

[bigdjiver]

I agree with Trouble that taxi ing is about personality as well as a good overall dance ability.

I had training (combined with annual staff party of local franchise afterwards ) so most people turned up.. this really helped... we have this yearly now...

These were Phil Roberts policies with Ceroc Central, and they seemed to help create a good team spirit in the crew.

... I enjoy taxi ing and I wouldn't want to teach.. I personally get that "buzz" helping people as a taxi...

There are members in Ceroc that love to help people, but do it without the "Taxi" label. Many of them will have served some time as Taxi Dancers. It is a vocation. I have known Taxi dancers who were also Platinum card holders who gave away the admit ones that they earned. These long time members have given up Taxi-ing but continue to pay particular regard to newcomers, and are of great value to the venue.

... I now make sure that my beginners feel welcome, have a fabulous night and if they go home being able to dance then ...

The first night experience is vital for member retention, and it needs to be reinforced by the second. Once a member has come back for a third time they are well on their way to being "hooked". One of the traps that the less effective Taxi dancers fall into is relating.

After two weeks many newbies will have acquired some confidence and may actually seek out a Taxi dancer. It is quite easy for a Taxi to be more sociable with those that they know from a previous night and neglect the first-timers. We lose some first-timers that have not been brought along by an existing member unecessarily before the refresher class. It needs someone to pay them some attention.

... It makes my night when beginners leave happy and come back week after week and then you see them dancing on say a weekender / at a freestyle and think "yeah I helped em get here and enjoy this as much as they are doing" (maybe I am just mushy tho...)

I enjoy the "mushy please" too.

One of my "moments" was on my first "request only" nights. Every once in a while, when there are an excess of men,I adopt a "request only" policy. It is a very cruel way of trimming my ego down to size.

It came around to near 10 p.m. and I was danceless. I was getting depressed, but was saved by a very atrractive lady. At the end of a very nice dance she said "You don't remember me, do you?" I had to confess not. She said "You gave me my first freestyle dance. I am a teacher now."

I have seen youngsters go from actually trembling on their first night to confidently taking the refresher class in which everybody in it was older than them. Members acquire life skills as well as dance ones.

What goes around ...

[Lee Bartholomew]

{snip}

You are looking at it through the eyes of a dancer not through the commercial interests of a majority of club organisors.

On a personal note, I dont like back leading for beginners. Infact the beginners revision class concentrates on technique rather than just going over the moves again and again.

But then again, I don't have 100 + a night turning up

[killingtime]

I assume they think it will help the lead to remember the moves, but personally I think it delays their progress.

Is that a terrible thing? My progress may have been hampered by women backleading me, teachers not driving in lead and follow connections from day one but... I had fun and came back for more. It was subsequently that I started to learn how to lead correctly (and I'm still learning) and, sure, backleading might have set me back a couple of months but then I might well have stopped dancing if all the women just stood there and stared at me while I made a hash of it.

I'm not saying the taxi made the right call in this case. Maybe she should have stopped backleading, maybe she didn't even realise she was doing it in the first place.