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Thread: New Southport suggestions

  1. #41
    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: New Southport suggestions

    Quote Originally Posted by Cruella View Post
    If Ceroc were so concerned about it, why did it take 27 years to do what people were asking for and once the need was already being catered for elsewhere?
    I don't think it's really fair to query the current Ceroc management about historical practices and legacy, all of which were facts before they took over,

    And I do think - and I've said so, many times - that over the past 2-3 years at least, Ceroc have been innovative, and have made efforts to appeal to more experienced dancers.

    We.ve had the Strictly Ballroom attempt, we've had WCS classes, we've had Utopia, we've had weekenders, we've had advanced jive classes, and so on.

    Sure, not all of them worked, and I'd certainly want to see more innovation. But it's not reasonable to paint a picture of 27 years of inactivity. Ceroc has changed, and I think it has got better.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cruella View Post
    Agreed that an increase in interest in WCS is good for the WCS dance scene. As I said earlier though, that can be acheived by using British teachers. Also I think it might be detrimental to Ceroc as many people that start WCS actually stop MJ so they can concentrate on it better. So I'm not sure why they would promote that.
    Yeah. I'm not sure why WCS promotion would be sensible for Ceroc either.

    It may be that WCS could turn out to be JA's speciality, which I think would make more sense for them - certainly, that appears to be the way they're heading.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cruella View Post
    Absolutely, why work to build up a reputation when you can use someone elses!
    Yes, that is a little cheeky, isn't it.

  2. #42
    Commercial Operator Rocky's Avatar
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    Re: New Southport suggestions

    Quote Originally Posted by Cruella View Post
    ...snip..
    DB has already answered most of your points rather eloquently actually so there is little point in me adding more.

    But just as regards the US pros, they obviously won't be doing just beginners classes! There will Master classes, private lessons and of course their showcases. And I think you would be surprised at what they might consider to be a worthwhile allocation of their time.

    As an example, at the first (and only) Lindy event I went on Ryan Francois, who is acknowledged as one of the best lindy dancers in the World (so I'm told) insisted on teaching all the beginners classes. He considered it important, and really enjoys doing them. And I have to say it was a real inspiration to be in his class.... If I sweated less whilst dancing faster, and enjoyed the music more it might have even persuaded me to become a hopping fop! Mind you I do still enjoy the sight of a woman sticking her bum out... (and so does Filthy Monkey, judging by that incriminating photo of the two of you... )

    By the way Cru, I've noticed that when you get your dander up you suddenly develop a strong aversion to paragraphs... strange..
    Last edited by Rocky; 6th-September-2008 at 08:31 PM.

  3. #43
    Commercial Operator Rocky's Avatar
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    Re: New Southport suggestions

    Quote Originally Posted by Achaeco View Post
    OK bring in the Master class and take out what?

    As for the DVD, dancers want an edited DVD, a DVD that they can sit and watch and learn new moves; from what ive heard the Ceroc DVD is not that good compared to others.

    Im not talking Ceroc into the gutter but in my opinion they can not improve the dancing side of SP.
    Don't know enough about the layout of the schedule yet to comment about where, or how the Master classes will be implemented.

    As regards DVD's - where did you get the idea that they weren't edited!? All the teachers video their classes with both demonstrations and talk throughs on the Fri night/Sat morning and they are compiled and edited, along with the Sat showcases, ready for Sunday afternoon. I've not seen a JA SP DVD, but I've seen other weekender DVDs and Ceroc's are head and shoulders above what I've seen before. Just because they're completed quickly doesn't mean they are done badly! Mas spends a significant amount of time and effort to get them right and works right through the night to get them completed - he's also got the right equipment to make the whole process more effecient. Maybe someone who has seen both JA's and Ceroc' DVD's could comment further?

    The 'dancing side' is a very subjective personal thing. Some people do the classes, some don't, some dance all night, some don't.. people have different expectations. The last Ceroc weekender, Viva Las Vegas and Swish, IMO are two of the best weekenders I have been on and yet both didn't feature hoards of advanced dancers - these weekends are what you make them. If you're just referring to the quality of teachers, I don't think Ceroc could possibly improve on what has been offered before as regards International teachers - so will be happy to match the quality. As regards home grown teachers, my belief is that there is now enough talent within what Ceroc have to offer and from certain freelance teachers to again, more than match what has gone before. The 'improvement' will more likely come in incremental terms from some of the other areas I've already highlighted.

    Best thing is to come along and make your own mind up. Third party reviews are pretty pointless..

  4. #44
    Dickie Davies' love-child Cruella's Avatar
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    Re: New Southport suggestions

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky View Post
    DB has already answered most of your points rather eloquently actually so there is little point in me adding more.
    Originally Posted by Cruella
    Agreed that an increase in interest in WCS is good for the WCS dance scene. As I said earlier though, that can be acheived by using British teachers. Also I think it might be detrimental to Ceroc as many people that start WCS actually stop MJ so they can concentrate on it better. So I'm not sure why they would promote that.
    Quote Originally Posted by DavidBailey
    Yeah. I'm not sure why WCS promotion would be sensible for Ceroc either.

    It may be that WCS could turn out to be JA's speciality, which I think would make more sense for them - certainly, that appears to be the way they're heading.
    You agree that it doesn't make sense for Ceroc to promote WCS then?

    Originally Posted by Cruella
    Absolutely, why work to build up a reputation when you can use someone elses!
    Quote Originally Posted by DavidBailey
    Yes, that is a little cheeky, isn't it.
    Also with this bit?

    But just as regards the US pros, they obviously won't be doing just beginners classes! There will Master classes, private lessons and of course their showcases. And I think you would be surprised at what they might consider to be a worthwhile allocation of their time.
    I'm glad to hear it, and I wouldn't be surprised at all, as I have had alot of contact with the pros myself over the last couple of years. My point wasn't that they wouldn't want to teach the beginners and I, like you, know that it is always a good thing for even the experienced WCS dancer to keep going over their basics. However, if they are pitching at the Ceroc weekenders for 'the new dancer', as you mentioned previously, then I feel that all that will happen is the JA weekenders will be pitched at a higher level and you end up with the same scenario as you had originally, the beginners attending the Ceroc weekend and the more experienced attending the JA weekends.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    Mind you I do still enjoy the sight of a woman sticking her bum out... (and so does Filthy Monkey, judging by that incriminating photo of the two of you... )
    I have witnesses to confirm that was as much a shock to me, as it would be to see you dancing with anyone over a size 10 for more than one charity dance. (I must be due one soon)
    By the way Cru, I've noticed that when you get your dander up you suddenly develop a strong aversion to paragraphs... strange..
    Feel free to edit and repost my posts, you normally don't need permission.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    Best thing is to come along and make your own mind up. Third party reviews are pretty pointless..
    Cool, are you coming next weekend then?

  5. #45
    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: New Southport suggestions

    Quote Originally Posted by Cruella View Post
    You agree that it doesn't make sense for Ceroc to promote WCS then?
    Dunno. It totally depends on where Ceroc Enterprises wants to go as a business.

    There are some obvious downsides (less control over the actual dance form, setting up potential competitors, less market size, etc.), but there are also some potential upsides (diversifying, offering a "progression path" to retain experienced dancers, promoting better dancing, and so on).

    Personally, I'd think that Ceroc would be better off developing their own dance, and making it more respectable in itself. But I've no idea as to the business side of things, so I don't know whether it makes sense or not.

    And in the long term, we're all dead.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cruella View Post
    Also with this bit?
    Yes - it's cheeky to try to capitalise so explicitly on a competitor's reputation.

  6. #46
    Dickie Davies' love-child Cruella's Avatar
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    Re: New Southport suggestions

    Quote Originally Posted by David Bailey View Post
    Dunno. It totally depends on where Ceroc Enterprises wants to go as a business...snip..And in the long term, we're all dead.
    I wasn't talking to you. Or have you become Rocky's PR?

    (Thought you'd be too busy looking at Sam's boobs)

  7. #47
    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: New Southport suggestions

    Quote Originally Posted by Cruella View Post
    I wasn't talking to you. Or have you become Rocky's PR?
    Errr, OK. You quoted me then asked a question immediately afterward, how was I supposed to know it wasn't aimed at me?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cruella View Post
    (Thought you'd be too busy looking at Sam's boobs)
    I'm shocked you could think such a thing. I'm a high-and-mighty weight-throwing moderator, with tendencies to invade Poland, didn't you know?

    Anyway, I'm off to Brookfield Farm now, I'm sure I'll see more than enough boobs on display there.
    Last edited by David Bailey; 7th-September-2008 at 12:29 PM.

  8. #48
    Registered User Spiky Steve's Avatar
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    Re: New Southport suggestions

    Different things appeal to different people.

    I like the idea of Master classes, that way those who want them pay for them. At Southport in June I did not attend one class.

    For me, I like the Barbeque. This was fantasic in June although some people felt excluded that it was Forum specific only. I know that this is not the case but I would like to see the barbeque as part of any discussions.

    Another draw for Southport is Dean Maynard Clothing. I have some lovely shirts now and clothing is probably a bigger draw for the girls. Stand out clothing also have some lovely clothes but variety does add to the spice of life.

    Hope this helps.

    Steve

  9. #49
    Commercial Operator Rocky's Avatar
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    Re: New Southport suggestions

    Quote Originally Posted by Cruella View Post
    .............Also with this bit?

    I'm glad to hear it, and I wouldn't be surprised at all, as I have had alot of contact with the pros myself over the last couple of years. My point wasn't that they wouldn't want to teach the beginners and I, like you, know that it is always a good thing for even the experienced WCS dancer to keep going over their basics. However, if they are pitching at the Ceroc weekenders for 'the new dancer', as you mentioned previously, then I feel that all that will happen is the JA weekenders will be pitched at a higher level and you end up with the same scenario as you had originally, the beginners attending the Ceroc weekend and the more experienced attending the JA weekends.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky View Post
    DB has already answered most of your points rather eloquently actually so there is little point in me adding more.

    But just as regards the US pros, they obviously won't be doing just beginners classes! There will Master classes, private lessons and of course their showcases.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cruella View Post
    Cool, are you coming next weekend then?
    I'm afraid I've got prior arrangements, but thanks for the offer - haven't you got any friends that will go with you then..

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    Re: New Southport suggestions

    Quote Originally Posted by Chef View Post
    All the information they could possibly want has been rolled out on their own forum. They can't claim to be ignorant now. So why play dumb?
    I really don't think Rocky or anyone involved in this is playing dumb. Ceroc now having Southport has really shaken things up and I for one am very happy that Mike is actually asking what it is that makes Southport so special to us.

    I really don't think he can win. If he asks us then he is playing dumb and using clever tactics to ensure we all attend their Southport. If he doesn't say anything then he will be accused of not listening to what us dancers want and only caring about his profits.

  11. #51
    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: New Southport suggestions

    Quote Originally Posted by Twirlie Bird View Post
    I really don't think Rocky ... is playing dumb.
    How can you tell?

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    Re: New Southport suggestions

    I think it is important to get the atmosphere And ambiance right
    Howevever the key issue for me is the music.

    Most dancers enjoy dancing to popular classic tracks.
    Give me blues Swing pop soul or R&b but make it a song that makes me want to dance!!!!!
    Too many DJs want to play boring R&B monotone material they have found on the Net. nobody has heard of!!!

    lets face it you can dance MJ WCS Lindy Tango Milonga latin and much more to so many classic tracks

    Play the music lets dance.

    CONTROL DJS EGO'S PLEASE

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    Re: New Southport suggestions

    Keep DJ Blueshoes for some extended slots in the Bluesroom - he's my fave


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    Re: New Southport suggestions

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Cool View Post

    CONTROL DJS EGO'S PLEASE
    Ooops, sorry, bad timing to praise a DJ!!

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    Registered User DianaS's Avatar
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    Re: New Southport suggestions

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky View Post
    . Mike is now monitoring feedback so if you would like to add in this post how you feel your experience could be improved, or what you particularly enjoy, then the most important will get an airing.
    :
    Well theres going to be no surprises from me. i'm nothing if not consistent. Give Southport back to John and Wes
    ..a kind of truce
    have a good dance, play with each others kiddies and if you still feel the urge to take over the dance world,

    get some therapy

  16. #56
    Registered User Nessiemonster's Avatar
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    Re: New Southport suggestions

    For me it would be shifting the emphasis of music in the blues room to a greater emphasis on blues than swing. The first time I attended Southport in Feb 2007 it was fab and bluesy, and sold me on the whole notion of Southport. The two times I've been back since I've been incredibly disappointed. I've still enjoyed the swing music, but it doesn't generally inspire me to dance to it.

    Blues music, of the kind played this weekend at Kirriemuir, however, is a different matter entirely...

    There's a place for swing, but what's come across from the aftermath threads since Feb 2007 is a general disappointment about the lack of bluesy music played.
    Last edited by Nessiemonster; 9th-September-2008 at 10:08 PM. Reason: Didn't read well.

  17. #57
    Senior Member rubyred's Avatar
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    Re: New Southport suggestions

    Quote Originally Posted by Toasti View Post
    Ooops, sorry, bad timing to praise a DJ!!

    Toasti there is never a bad time to praise Blueshoes, he is a star.
    Last edited by rubyred; 9th-September-2008 at 11:02 PM.
    if you love the life you live then you'll get a lot more done

  18. #58
    Commercial Operator Rocky's Avatar
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    Re: New Southport suggestions

    Quote Originally Posted by DianaS View Post
    ...get some therapy
    Very useful and constructive Diana. Thank you. By the way, I think you would benefit enormously from the latter part of your post!

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    Re: New Southport suggestions

    Quote Originally Posted by Nessiemonster View Post
    For me it would be shifting the emphasis of music in the blues room to a greater emphasis on blues than swing. The first time I attended Southport in Feb 2007 it was fab and bluesy, and sold me on the whole notion of Southport. The two times I've been back since I've been incredibly disappointed. I've still enjoyed the swing music, but it doesn't generally inspire me to dance to it.

    Blues music, of the kind played this weekend at Kirriemuir, however, is a different matter entirely...

    There's a place for swing, but what's come across from the aftermath threads since Feb 2007 is a general disappointment about the lack of bluesy music played.
    Hi Nessie
    I agree it would be wonderful to get back to blues in the blues room however I think you are confusing R&B with swing they play almost no Swing in the blues room at southport which I think is sad.
    Swing is much more fun than the same boring R&B Yawn.
    But lets have more blood and guts blues

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    Commercial Operator StokeBloke's Avatar
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    Cool Re: New Southport suggestions

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Cool View Post
    I agree it would be wonderful to get back to blues in the blues room however I think you are confusing R&B with swing they play almost no Swing in the blues room at southport which I think is sad.
    Swing is much more fun than the same boring R&B Yawn.
    But lets have more blood and guts blues
    There's nothing wrong with a little R&B, it's good for the soul y'know. As for hardcore blood and guts blues in the blues room, it's still there Andy... it's played in the wee small hours when all the workshop junkies are getting their Zzzzzzzzz's

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