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Thread: Why don't men bring a towel/change of shirt?

  1. #21
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    Re: Why don't men bring a towel/change of shirt?

    Quote Originally Posted by Agente Secreto View Post
    Now we get the message that you've advanced your dancing to such a level that you don't even break sweat.
    He's got a point, actually - I sweat much less than I did a few years back, I noticed that a couple of years ago. It's nothiong to do with fitness, it's being able to do and lead the same moves with much less effort; you're making more efficient use of your muscles. I only sweat now if I'm in a particularly hot venue, or on a particularly hot day.

    It's like Mr Miyaki in the Karate Kid - he doesn't need muscle, he's got the technique.

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    Re: Why don't men bring a towel/change of shirt?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lee Bartholomew View Post
    Men who don't sweat are men who are not putting enough effort in to their dancing. If it was down to technique and skill level, you wouldn't see the likes of Jordan, Amir and Simon R sweat would you?
    And quite often you don't, and sometimes their dancing looks effortless. It sounds like you are simply posting a bitter opposite response to counter Andy

    Quote Originally Posted by Agente Secreto View Post
    My god man how do you manage it, and do you wear your underpants on the outside of your (sweat-free) trousers?
    He has a very good point, the attempted ridicule is making you sound like Lee

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    Re: Why don't men bring a towel/change of shirt?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadful Scathe View Post
    And quite often you don't, and sometimes their dancing looks effortless. It sounds like you are simply posting a bitter opposite response to counter Andy



    He has a very good point, the attempted ridicule is making you sound like Lee

    As much as you would like me to be ridculing Andy so you have something interesting to read, that is not the case.

    I just happen to have seen many a very good dancer sweat. I don't think it has anything to do with how good you are or technique.

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    Re: Why don't men bring a towel/change of shirt?

    Quote Originally Posted by David Bailey View Post
    He's got a point, actually - I sweat much less than I did a few years back, I noticed that a couple of years ago. It's nothiong to do with fitness, it's being able to do and lead the same moves with much less effort; you're making more efficient use of your muscles. I only sweat now if I'm in a particularly hot venue, or on a particularly hot day.

    It's like Mr Miyaki in the Karate Kid - he doesn't need muscle, he's got the technique.
    I can see the point about technique - and agree very much...to a point.

    What I would ask is what about when you let rip, go for it, full tilt at a fast rock 'n roll tune or Candy Man full pelt and move? And you throw the technique book and just go wherever the music takes you and lose yourself and forget about being efficient or using less effort........have you ever done that? Did you break sweat? Was there any noticeable incremental moisture being exuded?

    (That's a question for Andy/David)

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    Re: Why don't men bring a towel/change of shirt?

    From my own experience, I'm with Lee on this one, guys. A very good dancer who is putting the effort in will still sweat. In fact, it would generally follow that a good dancer has been dancing for a reasonable amount of time and in doing so will have improved his level of fitness. As fit people sweat more "efficiently" by sweating at lower internal temperatures, the chances are that they will show signs of sweat earlier in the dance session.

    Now, getting back to technique, there are people who have a very relaxed style of dancing and perhaps Andy is one of them. I've never met him so I don't know. Then again, I've never met Lee, so I don't know what his style is like either, so I guess I should stick to what I know and comment on my own technique!

    I've found that, as my dancing has evolved over the years, I have started to put more energy in and do sweat more. Yes, I have learned how to keep everything smooth and I do expend less energy doing simple moves, but I also do many more complex moves now, which require more effort. For example, a couple of years back I would have been happy doing a standard 8 beat first move, possibly stepping back on just one foot, and then moving into another simple move. However, following some Latin training my style has changed. My dancing has become sharper, I work differently with the music and I think about style more. Instead of dancing a basic first move, I may step using both feet, or I may add a ronde before compressing beats 4 and 5 as I dance across the beat, throwing in a barrier and then double spinning my partner into a seducer, all in the same 8 beats. I now do a minimum of two spins on a man spin. If it's a good floor I might do three or four, all of which requires more effort. So yes, as I have improved I have become smoother, but I also put a lot more effort in because the moves I do are often more complex. Add something like Candyman into the mix and I may as well be dancing in the shower!

    Take this into the Blues room, however, and it's a whole different ball game. If you want to dance slow and sexy, you'll be aiming to keep things as smooth and relaxed as possible, so yes, you will be far less likely to get hot and bothered, unless it's for an entirely different reason

    Right, enough late night rambling from me. I guess what I am trying to say is that how much somebody sweats depends on their dancing style, so there probably is no right or wrong answer here and it's not worth arguing over

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    Re: Why don't men bring a towel/change of shirt?

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy McGregor View Post
    ...Sweat is dispensed in the exact quantity to cool your body to it's proper operating temperature...
    No, it is not. Sweat that has dripped off is in excess of what is required. It is not doing anything useful once it has lost contact. Dripping sweat is a sign of inefficiency. Men tend to sweat more than women because womens sweat glands are more efficient.

    Those who dance to look "cool" will tend to stay cool. The adrenalin junkies, like myself, put a lot more effort into it.

    It helps if the venue has good air replenishment and circulation. The venue needs to lose the warm humid air and replace it with cooler and dryer air. Opening high windows to let the rising warm air escape helps, having doors and windows open to let in new air helps too. Unfortunately those that feel the full effect of new colder air tend to be those not dancing, who least need it. Quite often it is the door staff that veto the doors being open. Few buildings are built with the needs of mass dancers as a consideration.

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    Re: Why don't men bring a towel/change of shirt?

    Quote Originally Posted by Filthy Monkey View Post
    From my own experience, I'm with Lee on this one, guys. A very good dancer who is putting the effort in will still sweat.
    ..................
    Right, enough late night rambling from me. I guess what I am trying to say is that how much somebody sweats depends on their dancing style, so there probably is no right or wrong answer here and it's not worth arguing over

    Quote Originally Posted by David Bailey View Post
    He's got a point, actually - I sweat much less than I did a few years back, I noticed that a couple of years ago. It's nothiong to do with fitness, it's being able to do and lead the same moves with much less effort; you're making more efficient use of your muscles. I only sweat now if I'm in a particularly hot venue, or on a particularly hot day.

    It's like Mr Miyaki in the Karate Kid - he doesn't need muscle, he's got the technique.
    I do understand his point, I just don't believe that it applies to all of us. Some people sweat more than others for all sorts of reasons.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadful Scathe View Post
    He has a very good point, the attempted ridicule is making you sound like Lee
    I've never met Lee, and I'm not part of the internecine warfare going on down in Sussex so nothing about my post is designed to sound like anyone else. I'm big and ugly enough to have my own views.

    The post was written because I happen to believe that Andy's view simply does not apply to the vast bulk of people I see dancing every week. Otherwise we have no option to believe that, apart from a few select individuals, good technique is largely missing from the bulk of venues I've ever been at because there does seem to be a hell of lot of sweat out there. Now I don't believe it, I see people with what looks to me to have good technique and they still sweat. And the fix for that is far more likely to be a good towel and a change of shirt..............

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    Re: Why don't men bring a towel/change of shirt?

    Quote Originally Posted by Brighton Belle View Post
    Now I know this doesn't apply to everyone. Most men are very considerate. But let's face it - dancing is an active sport and people get hot. Especially at this time of year. By 11pm many men (I'm sorry it is mostly men) are... well ...to be blunt.... dripping.

    I was in the ladies at a venue recently and met a poor lady trying to dry off a very large and noticable wet patch on the front of her t-shirt that had just been deposited there by an ardent admirer.

    They could bring a towel / change their shirt / go outside to cool down. And many do. But a fairly high percentage don't. It's not very difficult so they must make a conscious decision not to do so. Is this because:

    a) they don't notice
    b) they think no one else will notice
    c) they think it doesn't matter
    d) they think its sexy
    e) they think women don't mind

    I've seen many men wiping off their face with a handy towel but its not their face we're in contact with!

    Am I being overly fussy?
    As you have said above and others have said - most men are considerate...

    Most men also sweat.

    I take a towel, changes of top and anti-pong stuff... but it does not stop me sweating if the venue is hot, or even hotish.

    There is only so much one can do.

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    Re: Why don't men bring a towel/change of shirt?

    Shirts 11, I took with me last night to Leicster.

    T shirts 4.

    Jeans 2.

    Socks 2 pair and 2 pair of stunningly magnificent black boxer shorts with padded crutch area (extra large padding).

    2 flannels a towel and soap deodrant and spare shoes and a devilishly handsome and magnificent attitude.

    What more can a man do, to keep you girly trouts happy and content.

    I was literally fighting my way off the floor last night, men and women were fighting to dance with a clean, dry and lovely smelling little old me, at one stage a Police dog arrived and Rex and I jived away until the early hours, the puppies are expected in the Autumn.

    DTS xxx xxx

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    Re: Why don't men bring a towel/change of shirt?

    I'm amazed at the response to my post. I made a perfectly reasoned post saying what my experience is. And, we're told it's rubbish by Lee - OK, maybe I shouldn't be surprised.

    I think Agente Secreto is just showing a lack of experience.

    To put it simply. The longer you do something the more efficient you get at it. That is not just dancing, it's probably most things. I often compare learning to dance with learning to drive. When my daughter was learning she used to come home sweating after a two hour lesson. She used to go straight into the shower. Nowadays she'd laugh if I asked her if driving made her sweat.

    I can tell you about my own experience. For the first couple of years of my MJ career I sweated buckets and always took 4 shirts with me. After a while I found that I was not changing into the shirts as my first shirt was not getting soggy. So, I posted on this thread my reasons why I thought this happenned. Mr Secreto said he didn't believe me in a patronising way and Lee said I was wrong.

    My advice remains unchanged. If you are sweating so much that your clothes are wet you need to go somewhere cool and let your sweat evaporate. Or you could stand in a breeze. You can run your hands/wrists under a cold tap, get a cold drink, possibly use a towel - I don't do this as I never reach the point where I'd need to. I think you should take that break before the sweat starts dripping or running in rivers down you back. There are two reasons I give for this. The first is physiological, you're losing the sweat you need to lower you body temperature, secondly, and the reason Brighton Belle started this thread, it's unpleasant for your partners. Our job as leads is to give our partners a pleasurable dance. If we are dripping with sweat we do not offer pleasure we offer the opposite.

    Of course dancers sweat, especially if it's hot. But they really do need to do something about it rather than continue to dance and upset their partners. I used to change my shirts and use a towel, that worked just fine for me. I now find that I don't need to do that and have a nicer solution. I've given advice that works for me and said why I think it's so. I've been dancing for many years and have a huge amount of experience. If two people don't want to take my advice it's their problem, not mine. BUT it is my problem if they post on a public forum that I'm wrong - hence the long reply

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    Re: Why don't men bring a towel/change of shirt?

    Quote Originally Posted by dave the scaffolder View Post
    2 pair of stunningly magnificent black boxer shorts with padded crutch area (extra large padding).
    I've noticed this. But I think you must have them on back to front as your bottom looks very pert

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    Re: Why don't men bring a towel/change of shirt?

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy McGregor View Post
    I've noticed this. But I think you must have them on back to front as your bottom looks very pert
    I have allways had a magnificent arse.

    I can crack walnuts with my crack.

    DTS xxx xxx

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    Re: Why don't men bring a towel/change of shirt?

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy McGregor View Post
    I'm amazed at the response to my post. I made a perfectly reasoned post saying what my experience is. And, we're told it's rubbish by Lee - OK, maybe I shouldn't be surprised.
    I was told at school you can't start a sentance with the word 'and' (though they didn't teach me how to spell). Not that im telling you it's wrong or anything .

    I didn't say I disagree with you. I just disagree with the fact experianced dancers don't sweat due to better technique.

    If it did apply to everything, You wouldn't see boxers sweat or runners or any other pro sportsman.

    Your right in that it might have something to do with it but not everything.

    Maybe age has something to do with it??

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy McGregor View Post
    I think Agente Secreto is just showing a lack of experience.
    Now who is being patronising?? I think his response was due to the fact you refered to your dancing as so evolved technique wise, you no longer need to sweat!!

    Oh, Filthymonkey is also wrong for agreeing with me. Thought I had better give him a mention.

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    Re: Why don't men bring a towel/change of shirt?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lee Bartholomew View Post
    I was told at school you can't start a sentance with the word 'and' (though they didn't teach me how to spell). Not that im telling you it's wrong or anything
    They didn't teach me this rule at school*. However, they did teach me this;

    Our Father, who art in heaven,
    hallowed be thy name.
    Thy Kingdom come,
    thy will be done,
    on earth as it is in heaven
    Give us this day our daily bread.
    And forgive us our trespasses,
    as we forgive those who trespass against us.
    And lead us not into temptation,
    but deliver us from evil.
    For thine is the kingdom, the power and the glory. for ever and ever. Amen

    So :yawn: yet again Lee displays his ignorance. Where will it end? :yawnyyawnyawn:

    *However, I do remember my English teacher telling me that nice isn't in the dictionary. You can imagine my amazement when, in later life, I looked in the dictionary under "n"

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    Re: Why don't men bring a towel/change of shirt?

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy McGregor View Post
    So :yawn: yet again Lee displays his ignorance. Where will it end? :yawnyyawnyawn:
    Are you really now comparing your posts to the Lords prayer?? It was only a matter of time I guess.

    The Lords prayer is a translation from Aaramic (sic) i believe, so it can not be used as an example if English language.

    (Me and my ignorance )


    BTW they added Nice to the dictonary in 1920's which could explain it.
    Last edited by Lee Bartholomew; 20th-July-2008 at 05:20 PM.

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    Re: Why don't men bring a towel/change of shirt?

    Quote Originally Posted by CheesyRobMan View Post
    I don't usually bring a change of shirt to a normal weeknight class but will bring one or two spares to a freestyle. I carry a couple of hankies too to mop my brow if it gets too warm but not a towel, that seems to be a bit excessive unless you're actually washing yourself off in the basins or something. I've never had a huge problem with sweating.
    I think it depends on your dance style. There is one local guy (not you!) who perspires a lot (and does bring a towel). The past couple of times I've danced with him I have asked him, he doesn't do close moves when sweaty - but I noticed my shoes getting grippier on the floor - he must have been dripping onto the floor. It was still a nice dance though and it was my choice to dance with him as I asked him.

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    Re: Why don't men bring a towel/change of shirt?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lee Bartholomew View Post
    Oh, Filthymonkey is also wrong for agreeing with me. Thought I had better give him a mention.
    Don't worry, I promise it won't happen again. Unless, of course, you happen to comment on what a great dancer I am

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    Re: Why don't men bring a towel/change of shirt?

    Quote Originally Posted by Filthy Monkey View Post
    Don't worry, I promise it won't happen again. Unless, of course, you happen to comment on what a great dancer I am
    Anyone with a Jamie and the magic torch avatar has to be a great dancer

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    Re: Why don't men bring a towel/change of shirt?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lee Bartholomew View Post
    Are you really now comparing your posts to the Lords prayer?? It was only a matter of time I guess.

    The Lords prayer is a translation from Aaramic (sic) i believe, so it can not be used as an example if English language.
    I am using the Lords prayer as an example of the correct usage of the English Language. I am not saying that my posts are anything like the Lords Prayer in terms of content.

    Also, I was under the impression that the English translation of the bible was from either Greek or Latin.

    Once something is translated into English it is an example of that language and it's usage. This is especially so for a prayer that his taught to every Christian. Nobody, except an expert in English language, and especially not someone who does not capitalise "I" is in a position to say that a prayer used by the Church of England is not written in proper English. I am even more amazed that Lee thinks he knows more about English than the whole of the Church of England - on second thoughts, I'm never amazed at anything Lee says. I'm just amazed when anybody believes him

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    Re: Why don't men bring a towel/change of shirt?

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy McGregor View Post
    IAlso, I was under the impression that the English translation of the bible was from either Greek or Latin.
    It is a form of Greek.

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy McGregor View Post

    I am even more amazed that Lee thinks he knows more about English than the whole of the Church of England

    Yep. Thats what I think.

    Back on topic????

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