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Thread: 350 Knife assaults every day, what’s the solution ?

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    Registered User stewart38's Avatar
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    350 Knife assaults every day, what’s the solution ?

    It’s back on top of the agenda (if in need its ever been off it in the last year)

    What’s the solution ?

    I see one nice stat for me, people over 40 make up only 13% of all victims of violence so I should be safer in 2yrs time

    I've posted some articles to counter the Daily Mail alarmist comments

    For me carrying a knife (with qualifications) carries a minimum prison sentence


    Thugs committing 350 knife assaults EVERY DAY, as menace spreads to rural areas | Mail Online

    Analysis: Are we really in the grip of a knife crime epidemic? | UK news | guardian.co.uk


    We are all stabbing blindly at knife crime | David Aaronovitch - Times Online

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    Re: 350 Knife assaults every day, what’s the solution ?

    350 Knife assaults every day !

    That can't be right! our government insists violent crime is decreasing and it wouldn't tell the public downright lies, would it?

    I think the only response to knife crime is to legislate for a mandatory jail sentence for carrying a bladed weapon. Just as a firearm, people don't carry knives unless they intend to use them.
    Building companies all over Britain are laying off staff due to the credit crunch, these builders should be kept in business and their staff tasked with building more prisons. Win, win situation: potential murderers kept in jail and builders kept in work.

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    Registered User stewart38's Avatar
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    Re: 350 Knife assaults every day, what’s the solution ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Doolan View Post
    I think the only response to knife crime is to legislate for a mandatory jail sentence for carrying a bladed weapon. Just as a firearm, people don't carry knives unless they intend to use them.
    If I was a entrepreneur Id start selling fishing rods

    So a hoddie could still carry a knife but would have to carry a fishing rod as well

    When caught they could say they were going fishing

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    Re: 350 Knife assaults every day, what’s the solution ?

    Can't help feeling that jail sentences for knifes is pretty typical of our governments response to anything, tackle the symptom, not the cause.

    Not that I'm against it, just I don't see what it will do, except, move the thugs over to some other weapon, maybe worse, and drive supply etc. more underground.

    The real solution is to stop producing thugs. One that countless of our governments have bottled for decades IMO.

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    Registered User Mini Mac's Avatar
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    Re: 350 Knife assaults every day, what’s the solution ?

    Make those killers join the army....if they want to kill people they can do it for their country...

    also

    DEPORTATION!

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    Re: 350 Knife assaults every day, what’s the solution ?

    Although the incidents that are happening involve a minority of people (another example of govt. speak) it has had a worrying effect on me.

    It is causing me to further question whether I want to live in this country

    Now, its very very unlikely that I will ever move away from the UK but it's the feeling that worries me more than than the actual doing.

    I regularly cycle into and away from London from Surrey and I really dont like riding through particular areas. I think we all know what sort of areas I am referring to. They have been heavily covered in the media (although not restricted to these areas of course e.g. oxford st)

    I noticeably feel more apprensive as the atmosphere completely changes when you enter areas that seem to comprise totally of low cost housing and an ethnic population.

    The trouble is I dont know who to blame. Maybe myself for succumbing to the stereotype outlook, to the media, government....no idea.

    Absolutely no idea how to deal with it either.

    Im pretty sure some people on here will probably complain about any initiative without actually suggesting a practical one. And no, posters wont work. Neither will sitting these kids down and explaining that what they are doing is not good

    All I can do is worry about me. Removing myself from 'risk', however minimal, is all I can think that I can do.

    I will be moving to South London soon and will be cycling in from there. I find this even scarier than from Surrey!
    Last edited by Paul F; 18th-July-2008 at 12:44 PM.

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    Re: 350 Knife assaults every day, what’s the solution ?

    Quote Originally Posted by stewart38 View Post
    If I was a entrepreneur Id start selling fishing rods

    So a hoddie could still carry a knife but would have to carry a fishing rod as well

    When caught they could say they were going fishing
    C'mon Stewart, you know what I meant. Correct legislation would allow for the legitimate possession of knives.
    Anyway, why would a hod carrier (hoddie) carry a fishing rod as well as bricks

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    Re: 350 Knife assaults every day, what’s the solution ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mini Mac View Post
    DEPORTATION!
    er...to where - if we don't want them, why would we expect anyone else to ?
    We're not allowed to use Australia for this anymore apparantly, thought I don't see why not - they could be put to work building solar powered civilisation in the outback

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Doolan View Post
    C'mon Stewart, you know what I meant. Correct legislation would allow for the legitimate possession of knives.
    Anyway, why would a hod carrier (hoddie) carry a fishing rod as well as bricks

    Maybe he'll go fishing on his lunch break

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    Re: 350 Knife assaults every day, what’s the solution ?

    OK, some thoughts...

    This is amultiple issue issue.

    Yes, we need to get knives off the street. Yes, we need to educate "thugs" that knives are not an option. We need to crack the gang culture, and the drug cultures, too.

    Step 1. Nobody "accidentally" carries a knife. If they carry a knife, they go to jail. Stop and search powers are there, already.

    Step 2. Education thugs, etc... A bigger, tougher nut to crack but yes we need a carrot as well as a stick... Education can be done in conjunction with jail sentences. If guy X has 2 friends in jail for carrying a blade, is he still going to?
    Touchy feely projects: more places for kids to "hang out": spotrs centres, etc are one way but the inherant risks are thus:
    pit a bunch of kids together in any setting and a gang formation/war is a risk.
    Can we stop this generation?? I think not. But by putting today's offenders away and trying to rehab as opposed to just punish, we can hopefully better mould further generations... it's about today's 5 yr olds... it's about learning parents' moral codes... it's about educating each and every one of us that there is a bigger picture: wee need to sort it or we'll end up destroying our own country.

    BUT... it starts with a deterrant: carry a knife, do time.

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    Re: 350 Knife assaults every day, what’s the solution ?

    Hand out free knives and let them all stab eachother to death.

    Then the problem will be solved through irradication.

    Harsh maybe but that's my thoughts.

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    Re: 350 Knife assaults every day, what’s the solution ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Steven666 View Post
    Hand out free knives and let them all stab eachother to death.
    Whats wrong with the knives they've got ?

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    Re: 350 Knife assaults every day, what’s the solution ?

    I was reading an article the other day about community projects run in deprived areas of London, Manchester and Glasgow that were desperate for funds. The projects divert youths away from gang culture by involving them in activities. The more you have going for your life the less likely you are to want to become involved in violent crimes. As a society we need to invest in young people to prevent them feeling disenfranchised, this coupled with a measured judicial system.

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    Re: 350 Knife assaults every day, what’s the solution ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mini Mac View Post
    Make those killers join the army....if they want to kill people they can do it for their country...
    Thanks for that .
    There are tens of thousands of people who, like me, joined the Army to serve their country and you'd like to turn it into a punishment for pond-life.
    That's just another example of "not in my back yard".

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    Re: 350 Knife assaults every day, what’s the solution ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gav View Post
    There are tens of thousands of people who, like me, joined the Army to serve their country and you'd like to turn it into a punishment for pond-life.
    That's just another example of "not in my back yard".
    Chill babe. I think Mini Mac means that young men generally would benefit from a year or 2's national service. It was the making of my father.

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    Call that a Knife?

    For some reason I'm reminded of a scene from Crocodile Dundee.

    Mr Dundee is accosted by a street thug with a knife. The scene went something like this.

    Thug - "Hand over your money" - brandishing knife.

    Croc - "Call that a knife? Now THIS is a knife" - gets huge knife out!

    Thug - runs away

    I'm worried that a huge proportion of the people carrying knives are carrying them for self-defence. They do not trust the police to ensure that they will be safe from crime. So they carry a knife for protection when they live in areas where the police are failing to protect them.

    At the moment the answer is to carry a very big knife

    This reminds me of an exchange I saw in the Yacht Haven during Cowes week. The racing was over for the day and everyone had tied up their boats and was re-hydrating in the beer tent at about 3pm on a sunny day. There were propably about 500 sailors enjoying the sun and a drink. A gorilla in a security suit noticed that a sailor had a knife clipped to his belt. I was standing near the sailor when this gorilla went over to the sailor and said "I'm afraid I'm going to have to ask you to give me your knife, sir". He was very polite but nothing in his training had prepared him for the answer he recieved "yes, I do have a knife, it's part of a sailor's safety equipment and I can reliably inform you that every sailor in here has got a knife (to which those standing by patted their pockets and nodded). I will not give you my knife, I will finish my drink and I will leave this tent. You will not lay a finger on me!" I think the sailor was probably a barrister judging by his very precise manner.

    The security guard and the rest of the gorillas went into a nervous huddle and waited for this guy to finish his drink and leave the tent to a round of applause!

    I saw the security guy later than night and asked him what the policy was with knives. He said "I've been told to let you all keep your knives "
    Last edited by Andy McGregor; 18th-July-2008 at 02:26 PM.

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    Re: Call that a Knife?

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy McGregor View Post
    For some reason I'm reminded of a scene from Crocodile Dundee.

    Mr Dundee is accosted by a street thug with a knife. The scene went something like this.

    Thug - "Hand over your money" - brandishing knife.

    Croc - "Call that a knife? Now THIS is a knife" - gets huge knife out!

    Thug - runs away

    I'm worried that a huge proportion of the people carrying knives are carrying them for self-defence.
    Indeed, and where does it stop?

    When do they start carrying guns because big knives aren't enough? When do they become bigger and better guns?
    Isn't this how USA got itself into a mess by making it law that everyone has the right to arm themselves in defence?

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    Re: 350 Knife assaults every day, what’s the solution ?

    Quote Originally Posted by CJ View Post
    This is a multiple issue issue.
    Gerzundheit.

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    Re: Call that a Knife?

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy McGregor View Post
    I'm worried that a huge proportion of the people carrying knives are carrying them for self-defence. They do not trust the police to ensure that they will be safe from crime. So they carry a knife for protection when they live in areas where the police are failing to protect them.
    I suspect that you're right. Getting the police back on the street - and on foot or bicycles, not in cars - would make a big difference. Which means freeing them from paperwork and having to deal with ever increasing number of binge drinkers.

    It also needs investment in initiatives such as The From Boyhood to Manhood Foundation so that the kids feel valued, act responsibly and respect their own neighbourhoods.

    Then there are issues of discipline in schools, parental responsibilities, the laissez faire attitude of, well, pretty much everyone, the feeling that anyone who intervenes is likely more likely to end up in court than the hooligans, the tolerance of so-called 'petty crime', graffiti & littering...

    That lot would be a good start.

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    Re: 350 Knife assaults every day, what’s the solution ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Shnikov View Post
    Gerzundheit.
    And they all fell down.

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    Re: Call that a Knife?

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy McGregor View Post

    At the moment the answer is to carry a very big knife

    This reminds me of an exchange I saw in the Yacht Haven during Cowes week. The racing was over for the day and everyone had tied up their boats and was re-hydrating in the beer tent at about 3pm on a sunny day. There were propably about 500 sailors enjoying the sun and a drink. A gorilla in a security suit noticed that a sailor had a knife clipped to his belt. I was standing near the sailor when this gorilla went over to the sailor and said "I'm afraid I'm going to have to ask you to give me your knife, sir". He was very polite but nothing in his training had prepared him for the answer he recieved "yes, I do have a knife, it's part of a sailor's safety equipment and I can reliably inform you that every sailor in here has got a knife (to which those standing by patted their pockets and nodded). I will not give you my knife, I will finish my drink and I will leave this tent. You will not lay a finger on me!" I think the sailor was probably a barrister judging by his very precise manner.

    The security guard and the rest of the gorillas went into a nervous huddle and waited for this guy to finish his drink and leave the tent to a round of applause!

    I saw the security guy later than night and asked him what the policy was with knives. He said "I've been told to let you all keep your knives "

    I thought there was a joke in here ?

    Ie you mentioned a gorilla , who I assume is a security guard just doing his job not a real gorilla ??

    The usual end to this story is , we dont see many gorillas in this tent and the answer is Im not surprised at these prices

    The point of course is the lack of respect for authority is endemic in all areas

    If I was the security guard I'd have said :is your boat in this tent ? , answer no ....then put the fu***ing knife on your boat under lock and key

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