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Thread: Advice on building a new PC

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    Basically lazy robd's Avatar
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    Advice on building a new PC

    Am thinking of building a new PC (once I can make some choices from the vast range of potential components out there). I realise there's probably less of a financial gain to building my own system now than there was in the past but I want to pick exactly the components that I want and I expect there'll be a certain sense of satisfaction once the thing is up and running.

    I have had no problems when upgrading my current one - adding optical drives, memory, PCI and AGP cards, etc - but I have never built one from scratch before. I presume a well labelled motherboard with a decent manual will help me make the right connections to all the other components but how difficult or otherwise is fitting a processor and cooling to it?

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    Registered User David Franklin's Avatar
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    Re: Advice on building a new PC

    I'm looking at doing this in the near future; I think it's all pretty straightforward these days to be honest.

    You might want to look around on YouTube, it's a good way of getting an idea of what's involved for particular cases/components etc.

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    Re: Advice on building a new PC

    Quote Originally Posted by robd View Post
    Am thinking of building a new PC (once I can make some choices from the vast range of potential components out there). I realise there's probably less of a financial gain to building my own system now than there was in the past but I want to pick exactly the components that I want and I expect there'll be a certain sense of satisfaction once the thing is up and running.

    I have had no problems when upgrading my current one - adding optical drives, memory, PCI and AGP cards, etc - but I have never built one from scratch before. I presume a well labelled motherboard with a decent manual will help me make the right connections to all the other components but how difficult or otherwise is fitting a processor and cooling to it?
    Very easy, but when building your own, plan everything first.

    Case first : big enough for easy access ; consider any external sockets it has, usb,firewire etc... ; will it look good and fit where you intend to place it; does it have good air flow. If it comes with a power supply, will this be good enough (power/connections) for your components ?

    Then the next main thing is the motherboard. You need to get one that will offer all the features you need and support the CPU you have selected. Bog standard fans aren't that great, so consider a better one and consider noise levels.

    All the other stuff is less important and is often a case of "purpose of the computer" and "how much do you want to spend"

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    Registered User martingold's Avatar
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    Re: Advice on building a new PC

    processor and cooling fan fitting is very easy these days with the low insertion force sockets you just open the locking lever drop the chip in and push a the locking lever home then you fit the cooling with a couple of clips making sure you have removed the tape from the heat sink compound on the heat sink (i always add more compound as well)
    I personally like asus motherboards as and go for the best you can get (with the Deluxe version of the range asus you get all the different plugs sockets etc )

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    Re: Advice on building a new PC

    Quote Originally Posted by martingold View Post
    (i always add more compound as well)
    Nooo, don't add MORE Although getting silver thermal paste is worth it.

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    Registered User martingold's Avatar
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    Re: Advice on building a new PC

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadful Scathe View Post
    Very easy, but when building your own, plan everything first. (snip)

    All the other stuff is less important and is often a case of "purpose of the computer" and "how much do you want to spend"
    I agree with the whole post but imho i probably wouldnt build a machine now as there are silly deals (sometimes you can get the whole machine for less than it would cost you to buy the installed operating system) and most machines are configurable

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    Re: Advice on building a new PC

    Good advice from the previous posts.

    Would also add when it comes to the motherboard and installing the CPU and heatsink/fan, do it the foam that the motherboard comes packed in, not once installed in the case. The pressure you need to apply to get the heatsink/fan installed can be enough to break the motherboard once it's in the case, as it's elevated on a few positioning screws. Also don't apply too much thermal grease to the CPU, less is better.

    [edit] Beaten to it twice

    Just noticed I put fan when I meant the heatsink/fan that goes on the cpu
    Last edited by pmjd; 16th-June-2008 at 01:09 PM. Reason: added detail

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    Registered User martingold's Avatar
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    Re: Advice on building a new PC

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadful Scathe View Post
    Nooo, don't add MORE
    dont know about that cos it depends which books you read
    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadful Scathe View Post
    Although getting silver thermal paste is worth it.

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    Re: Advice on building a new PC

    Quote Originally Posted by martingold View Post
    I agree with the whole post but imho i probably wouldnt build a machine now as there are silly deals (sometimes you can get the whole machine for less than it would cost you to buy the installed operating system) and most machines are configurable
    I'd probably agree with that, but what I'd do would be to look for a decent spec machine to build from. So I'd pick the machine that had a case,motherboard,cpu, HD configuration I want and then get the gfx cards, soundcards, extra memory or whatever I want for it.

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    Registered User martingold's Avatar
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    Re: Advice on building a new PC

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadful Scathe View Post
    I'd probably agree with that, but what I'd do would be to look for a decent spec machine to build from. So I'd pick the machine that had a case,motherboard,cpu, HD configuration I want and then get the gfx cards, soundcards, extra memory or whatever I want for it.
    absolutely

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    Registered User David Franklin's Avatar
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    Re: Advice on building a new PC

    Quote Originally Posted by martingold View Post
    I agree with the whole post but imho i probably wouldnt build a machine now as there are silly deals (sometimes you can get the whole machine for less than it would cost you to buy the installed operating system) and most machines are configurable
    I agree, you won't save money. But you can get exactly what you want.

    With the likes of Dell, you can usually configure stuff like RAM and CPU, but choice of motherboard and/or power supply can be more problematic. And with my last Dell machine, they'd used a nonstandard PSU, so unless you were prepared to rewire the cabling, you were stuck with it. Which given it wasn't powerful enough to handle a decent graphics card, meant I had to get a whole new machine.

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    Re: Advice on building a new PC

    I've built several PCs. As you say, the main benefit is getting exactly the components you want. It is not to save money any more.

    Fitting a processor is perhaps the easiest stage. They come with full instructions, and are usually just a case of unclipping a catch, opening a cover, dropping the CPU in, and then closing the cover and clipping the catch back.

    Heat sinks are a lot harder. Some need a backing plate on the reverse of the motherboard, and others just need clipping in. The clips should be easier, but I hate them. The edges of heat sinks are very sharp and catch your fingers. There is usually one clip that you can't get to because something is in the way. Their advantage is that you can take the heat sink off without having to remove the motherboard.

    The standard Intel heatsinks work fine, but there are plenty of alternatives that are better at cooling, or quieter, or both.

    Most cases have holes for several different motherboards, and you need to work out which holes need stand off screws in for actually mounting the board on to. Make sure that you use the right screws with the stand offs, and also make sure that the stand offs have a screw thread drilled into them.

    Unless you need a small case, then go for a reasonably large one. It gives you so much more space to work with. Also some of the better modern power supplies are quite large, and may not fit in a smaller case.

    When plugging everything together, the biggest problem is the cabling. One trick it to route as many cables as possible behind the motherboard. The other is to get a modular power supply. This has detachable cables, so you don't have too many unused cables left inside. Make sure you buy cables that are long enough to route properly, and get plenty of cable ties.

    The last thing to consider is noise. It is very easy to build a fast modern PC that sounds like concorde taking off. Avoid any case that uses 8cm fans. 12cm fans are a lot quieter. Think about getting a fan controller so you can change the speed of the fans from the front panel. Some cheap power supplies make a lot of noise - it is worth paying a bit extra for a better quality and quieter PSU.

    Custom PC magazine had a really good article on building your own PC last year. It is worth trying to get a back issue.

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    Registered User Beowulf's Avatar
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    Re: Advice on building a new PC

    True buying a pre built PC is sometimes cheaper you can’t always dictate what components go into it. It may have sub standard memory, a cheap graphics card, lousy network card etc.

    I always build my PC's from scratch.. It may cost me a bit more but I know where every screw came from and I get the satisfaction of a job well done.

    I also say build your own if performance is your key goal. My last PC (Now woefully underspecced) was bleeding edge when I built it a few years back. It had the fastest memory, graphics, processor, motherboard, HDD I could buy at the time. I arranged things for maximum cooling and efficient airflow (My pet hate is to look inside a PC and see a spaghetti mess of tangled cables.. I like to route my cables efficiently)

    Admittedly it sounds like a small jet aircraft when running (Big fan + overclocked PC = NOISY!!!) but it runs well.

    My next project (if I every have any spare cash) is to build a new powerful machine but much quieter.. Probably water-cooled.

    Building a PC is child’s play.. just ensure the memory and CPU match what the motherboard supports and if you can play with meccano or lego you can build a PC.

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    Re: Advice on building a new PC

    Quote Originally Posted by martingold View Post
    I agree with the whole post but imho i probably wouldnt build a machine now as there are silly deals (sometimes you can get the whole machine for less than it would cost you to buy the installed operating system) and most machines are configurable
    Except those machines will have seriously sub-standard components. If you just want a desktop machine for work, surfing and the occasional game you can usually get away with it. If you want something good for anything other than basic stuff, you will be compromised buying off the shelf.

    The best reasons for building your own machine are quality and specialisation. You need to decide what you want your machine to do and then put in the best components for that purpose. Unfortunately, there are so many choices out there that it's pretty diabolical to make good decisions.

    Some general advice...

    1. Buy near the front in terms of basic technology. At the moment, this means a mobo with built in SATA capability and plenty of PCI (and PCI-E) ports. Be very aware of the other ports - especially USB.

    2. Work out the bottle necks for what you want and overpower the machine in these areas. In general, this means RAM if you're running Vista and the rest will depend on your usage.

    3. Be aware of interactions. For example, if you are using nVidia graphics, you need an nVidia mobo to link dual graphics boards properly (I can't remember what they call that technology...). The PSU is reasonably important if you're running a high-powered machine.

    4. Be prepared to spend on the GPU - many applications are shifting all sorts of processing off to the GPU, so having more power here is well worth the month. That said, if you're not playing high-end games, you don't need a top of the line GPU.

    5. Be very fussy when buying components and make sure you know exactly what you're buying. It's very easy to buy one thing that's not quite what you expected.

    If you know what the machine's for, I can probably dig up some good places to look for recommendations on specific hardware - it does vary, depending on what you want.

    I'd take a look around Tom's Hardware : Hardware News, Tests and Reviews. They do good reviews and will also give you instructions on building a machine as well.

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    Basically lazy robd's Avatar
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    Re: Advice on building a new PC

    Thanks for the advice so far.

    I have been doing a lot of reading up about it to try and future proof my selections as far as possible (and within budget) and I am narrowing down my selections somewhat but there is a lot to consider

    I did buy a factory refurb HP from Cash Converters a couple of months ago but it's not great for games, graphics card upgrade potential is miserable as it's AGP and the PSU is a custom fit. Rather than try to eek more from that I decided to start afresh.

    Just looking at a Q6600 processor on ebuyer and there's a nifty video showing the install of the processor - he didn't apply any thermal paste but I've seen advice to do just that in so many places that I guess it's just an oversight on their part.

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    Re: Advice on building a new PC

    Quote Originally Posted by robd View Post
    I have been doing a lot of reading up about it to try and future proof my selections as far as possible (and within budget) and I am narrowing down my selections somewhat but there is a lot to consider
    Do you have a short list so far?

    Quote Originally Posted by robd View Post
    Just looking at a Q6600 processor on ebuyer and there's a nifty video showing the install of the processor - he didn't apply any thermal paste but I've seen advice to do just that in so many places that I guess it's just an oversight on their part.
    Would be one hell of an oversight the thermal paste transfers the heat from the CPU to the heatsink, without the CPU would cook.

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    Re: Advice on building a new PC

    Quote Originally Posted by pmjd View Post
    Do you have a short list so far?
    No, I have a long(ish) list though some are very similar - e.g ASUS P5K Mobo variants - and I am just jotting them down for now to check online reviews, etc later

    Will put up a list when it's slimmer for comments.

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    Re: Advice on building a new PC

    Quote Originally Posted by pmjd View Post
    Would be one hell of an oversight the thermal paste transfers the heat from the CPU to the heatsink, without the CPU would cook.

    Not really. The thermal paste only makes heat transfer better by filling in imperfections in both surfaces, the CPU won't cook without out. In general putting on too much is worse than none at all. wikipedia link

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    Re: Advice on building a new PC

    Quote Originally Posted by pmjd View Post
    ... the thermal paste transfers the heat from the CPU to the heatsink, without the CPU would cook.
    The optimum heat transfer is metal to metal. Because the metal surfaces are not perfectly flat and smooth there is much less that 100% contact. There should be the minimum amount of heat paste used, just enough to fill the minute gaps, and it should be spread over the whole surface. The big dollop I often find in the middle of the CPU probably separates the surfaces and reduces the heat transfer.

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    Re: Advice on building a new PC

    Thanks DS and bigdjiver, I knew it but am not having a good explaining myself clearly day today. I think it's the trauma of doing a council planning application form that's addling my brain

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadful Scathe View Post
    Not really. The thermal paste only makes heat transfer better by filling in imperfections in both surfaces, the CPU won't cook without out. In general putting on too much is worse than none at all. wikipedia link
    I have come across one case, an integrated AMD CPU, which was passively cooled and kept falling over every 4 mins. Checked the heatsink to find no thermal paste what so ever. Was fine after a light application of thermal grease.

    Quote Originally Posted by bigdjiver View Post
    There should be the minimum amount of heat paste used, just enough to fill the minute gaps, and it should be spread over the whole surface. The big dollop I often find in the middle of the CPU probably separates the surfaces and reduces the heat transfer.
    I know
    Quote Originally Posted by pmjd View Post
    Also don't apply too much thermal grease to the CPU, less is better.

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