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Thread: A simple challenge

  1. #21
    Lovely Moderator ducasi's Avatar
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    Re: A simple challenge

    They are pretty much all trick questions.

    I got 80% – I should have done better, but I fell for a few of the tricks.
    Let your mind go and your body will follow. – Steve Martin, LA Story

  2. #22
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    Re: A simple challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by bigdjiver View Post
    85%

    I would dispute their cloud mass answer. It only takes a minute amount of water droplets to be visible and IMO the main mass of most clouds would be represented by vapour.
    But (in my admittedly limited understanding) a cloud is composed of condensed water droplets, not water vapour. So by definition, cloud mass does not consist of water vapour. And as for minute amounts - well the droplets in a cloud are supposedly smaller than individual particles of flour. You need a goodly few of 'em to make a visible cloud...

  3. #23
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    Re: A simple challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by straycat264 View Post
    But (in my admittedly limited understanding) a cloud is composed of condensed water droplets, not water vapour. So by definition, cloud mass does not consist of water vapour. And as for minute amounts - well the droplets in a cloud are supposedly smaller than individual particles of flour. You need a goodly few of 'em to make a visible cloud...
    Water vapour is, I think, invisible. The sky is full of water vapour, but only when it condenses into water droplets does a cloud become visible.

    If you look at a boiling kettle (my junior school teacher told me) the bit immediately outside the spout is invisible - that's steam/water vapour - but then almost immediately there is condensation and then it becomes visible. (Of course in those days, kettles had spouts whereas now the vapour goes through the temperature sensor to trigger the automatic off switch...)

  4. #24
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    Re: A simple challenge

    55% really glad my O level exams are a long way behind me

  5. #25
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    Re: A simple challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by ducasi View Post
    They are pretty much all trick questions.
    really ? some examples ?

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    Re: A simple challenge

    Amazingly 67.5% as I took Physics O Level nearly 30 years ago and failed it.

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    Re: A simple challenge

    A cloud (as in the region of space) is I assume mostly air. (otherwise it would rapidly fall out of the sky)

    I don't think it is reasonable to define a cloud as just the part which makes a region of the sky visible. Equally, a rock is mostly (by volume) vacuum, and a few atoms.

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    Re: A simple challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by tsh View Post
    A cloud (as in the region of space) is I assume mostly air. (otherwise it would rapidly fall out of the sky)

    I don't think it is reasonable to define a cloud as just the part which makes a region of the sky visible. Equally, a rock is mostly (by volume) vacuum, and a few atoms.
    Few problems here, podna.

    A rock isn't a vacuum plus atoms; vacuum is the (relative) absence of atoms. The space occupied by atoms and sub-atomic particles but minus the matter is not 'vacuum' properly so-called. So it's fine to say a rock is mostly empty space but not really to say it's mostly a vacuum.

    As for clouds - it's a bit pointless to say that they are mostly sky, isn't it? After all when we look up we see blue (or grey) and white (or lighter grey) and what is interesting about clouds is what distinguishes them from the rest of the sky. "Very like a whale", as Hamlet might have said.

  9. #29
    Registered User FirstMove's Avatar
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    Re: A simple challenge

    39/40 . Never really thought about how an engine works - it's a bit applied for a mathematician

    As for the cloud, I reasoned that mostly a cloud is just all the usual background gases with a little bit of extra water. So I got the right answer for the wrong reason
    Last edited by FirstMove; 28th-May-2008 at 09:22 PM. Reason: wron (sic) spelling

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    Lovely Moderator ducasi's Avatar
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    Re: A simple challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by tsh View Post
    A cloud (as in the region of space) is I assume mostly air. (otherwise it would rapidly fall out of the sky)

    I don't think it is reasonable to define a cloud as just the part which makes a region of the sky visible. Equally, a rock is mostly (by volume) vacuum, and a few atoms.
    Although a cloud is "mostly" air by volume, its *mass* I'd guess is mostly water. But in the form of droplets or crystals, not vapour.

    DS, this is an example of what I'd call a trick question.
    Let your mind go and your body will follow. – Steve Martin, LA Story

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    Registered User NZ Monkey's Avatar
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    Re: A simple challenge

    92.5% here

    I got the cloud question wrong as well although I can see their point after reading the explanation, I’m a little dubious as to the wording. I misread the friction question with the car (D’oh!) and got the thermal energy vs. mechanical work question just plain wrong…..

  12. #32
    Registered User David Franklin's Avatar
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    Re: A simple challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by FirstMove View Post
    As for the cloud, I reasoned that mostly a cloud is just all the usual background gases with a little bit of extra water. So I got the right answer for the wrong reason
    I thought of that, but then I thought they'd probably consider the air to not be part of the cloud as it would be there even if the cloud wasn't.

    I consider that question one I got legitimately wrong, although I'm not sure knowing the behaviour of water droplets/vapour really counts as physics.

    For the voltage one, I considered they were using "force" colloquially and thought "well, it's a stretch, but the answer is yes, sort of". If they'd asked "is voltage a force?", (which is clearly what they meant by the given answer), I'd have said no. So I feel a bit unlucky on that one.

  13. #33
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    Re: A simple challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by ducasi View Post
    Although a cloud is "mostly" air by volume, its *mass* I'd guess is mostly water. But in the form of droplets or crystals, not vapour.

    DS, this is an example of what I'd call a trick question.
    well that was one I got right immediately... perhaps for all the wrong reasons - i figured a cloud is a very insubstantial thing and its only the water vapour bits that are visible as white fluffyness, the majority of it would not be visible and must therefore not be vapour. I didn't think about it too much

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    Re: A simple challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadful Scathe View Post
    well that was one I got right immediately... perhaps for all the wrong reasons
    Hmm. Could be...

    As a gas, H20 is colourless. But small droplets of H20 will reflect light.

    Think of how ice is transparent but snow is white...

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    Re: A simple challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by ducasi View Post
    They are pretty much all trick questions.
    They weren't what I'd call 'trick' questions - just questions designed to make you think and apply what you know, rather than simply regurgitating facts.

    Which suits me fine - I'm terrible at remembering things, unless I have some practical application for the knowledge.

  16. #36
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    Re: A simple challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by tsh View Post
    A cloud (as in the region of space) is I assume mostly air. (otherwise it would rapidly fall out of the sky)
    Try thinking of it another way: the air supports the cloud.
    No - the cloud couldn't exist without it, for any number of reasons. But the one isn't a part of the other.

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    Re: A simple challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by straycat264 View Post
    They weren't what I'd call 'trick' questions - just questions designed to make you think and apply what you know, rather than simply regurgitating facts.
    I wonder if ducasi would argue that this logic puzzle was a trick question, I wouldn't, but I once had an argument* with someone who insisted it was "wrong"...

    "You have 2 coins. Together they add up to 11 pence. One of them is NOT a 1 pence piece. What are the 2 coins?"



    * well they argued, i laughed

  18. #38
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    Re: A simple challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadful Scathe View Post
    I wonder if ducasi would argue that this logic puzzle was a trick question, I wouldn't, but I once had an argument* with someone who insisted it was "wrong"...

    "You have 2 coins. Together they add up to 11 pence. One of them is NOT a 1 pence piece. What are the 2 coins?"



    * well they argued, i laughed
    one of them is not a one pence piece, the other one is.

  19. #39
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    Re: A simple challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by dep View Post
    one of them is not a one pence piece, the other one is.
    yes, but do you consider it a trick question or not ?

  20. #40
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    Re: A simple challenge

    not a trick question.
    Simply evaluate the facts given.

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