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Thread: Has anyone been to see a medium?

  1. #41
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    Re: Has anyone been to see a medium?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gadget View Post
    Other than that I think it's just a cool parlour trick {no matter the "reality" of what they do}

    I wish I could see it like this because the whole thing actually freaks me out! I don't think I could go to a medium as I'd be too terrified incase they weren't a con artist. Having had a few too many spooky experiences, I'm a bit scared that I'd open some flood gates and end up like the woman from 'Afterlife'.

    What I certainly would not EVER do is contact one of these psychic phonelines and i would urge anyone to avoid them. My brother decided he was a prophet/healer/guru/jesus etc after taking some drugs too many and got a job on one of these things, where the object (as with any premium rate phoneline) is to keep people talking. Obviously, he's not a prophet or medium or healer or, well, anything other than a numpty, but he only had to say he was to get the job.

  2. #42
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    Re: Has anyone been to see a medium?

    Quote Originally Posted by Isis View Post
    This does not make her immune to being conned
    exactly my point - glad you agree.


    Why don't you enlighten us then? What harm is likely to befall Rubyred if she goes ahead with this?
    You're the one saying no harm can come of it - would you bet your house, your children and everything you own on that? No doubts at all in your mind then? The onus is not on me to say "what harm" could come of it; I'm simply not able to say for sure that none is possible. You, apparently, have no problem with that.

    Of course she does. We all do. Your perspective on any subject is to agree with everything and anything Barry posts.
    on some threads it may appear that way if you only notice the similarities. Perhaps i should be more vocal on the rare occasions I do disagree with his points but there are, usually, enough others doing that. But really, why should i care that simply because i agree with someone on some topics (and lets face it is really ONLY religion and spirituality), some simple minded people assume that I automatically "agree with everything and anything" - it's a logical fallacy. It's also a biiiit childish of you to suggest it (and simple minded, in case you missed that bit)

    Why, just the other week we disagreed on the merits of "Bionic Woman"* - I think it's not that bad. Bionic targeting eyes on sexy brunettes are practically a must for my TV programming needs

    * sheepishly i must admit its worn off and i stopped watching it at 4 episodes - so maybe Isis is right, assuming religion, spirituality and the merits of a demented leaping Michelle Ryan in tight clothes is "everything and anything"

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    Re: Has anyone been to see a medium?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadful Scathe View Post
    on some threads it may appear that way if you only notice the similarities. Perhaps i should be more vocal on the rare occasions I do disagree with his points but there are, usually, enough others doing that. But really, why should i care that simply because i agree with someone on some topics (and lets face it is really ONLY religion and spirituality), some simple minded people assume that I automatically "agree with everything and anything" - it's a logical fallacy. It's also a biiiit childish of you to suggest it (and simple minded, in case you missed that bit)
    Wow. Raw nerve?

  4. #44
    purplehyacinth
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    Re: Has anyone been to see a medium?

    If you want my personal view - I would be against consulting a medium.
    I may say it is something I have never done and never would do.
    Messing about with the occult is something I regard as highly inadvisable - always assuming that the person you are consulting is not simply a complete fraud.

    However, if it is something you have decided to do, I would recommend most strongly that you take your most sceptical and critical attitude along with you. Assess whether what is said is something which GENUINELY relates to you, as opposed to generalised statements which YOU then take or interpret as applying to you.

    Something you may wish to consider is the following. Research has shown that "psychics" or "fortune tellers" can use a technique called "cold reading" which can produce around 80% accuracy when reading a person they have never met. A lot of it is based on understanding human nature, also probability and statistics (e.g. how many people go to see a medium/psychic because everything is fine in the world? Answer - virtually none. So the first thing they say when you walk through the door is "I am sensing you have problems in your life"... bingo! a remark which will be correct for most of those consulting them). It is also based to a fair degree on ability to read body language and pick up on the non-verbal signals of those consulting them. It is also bolstered by the fact that people who consult mediums/psychics/fortune tellers etc are going, expecting a positive outcome (ie they go expecting that the person they are consulting will be able to "read" them, and so they are going predisposed to take the general "guesswork" statements of the "psychic" as applying to them.)

    A rather better (and more detailed) explanation of this process, together with an excellent example of a cold reading which studies have shown to be more than 80% accurate for people reading it can be found in "The definitive book of body language" by A. Pease and B Pease, published by Orion, 2004. The relevant extract is at pp 15-17 (page numbers are of the paperback edition).
    Last edited by purplehyacinth; 17th-May-2008 at 12:20 AM.

  5. #45
    purplehyacinth
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    Re: Has anyone been to see a medium?

    Sorry that this is in a second post - I meant to add it as an edit to my last post, but outran the edit time limit.

    I apologise if what I have said above sounds unsympathetic, however there are plenty of people out there who have no qualms in exploiting the vulnerable, and bereaved people who get to the stage of seeking that sort of "help" are generally very vulnerable.

    I accept I don't know the circumstances of your bereavement. However, have you considered other routes, such as bereavement counselling, or speaking to others e.g. family, friends, the minister/priest/pastor/etc of any religion you are a member of? Your local Citizens Advice Bureau, or your GP ought to be able to put you in touch with bereavement counselling services in your area. In addition there is CRUSE - I don't know much about them, but theirs is the name which generally crops up when people mention the subject of bereavement counselling. (I hope the mods won't object to my posting the link to their website) Cruse Bereavement Care

  6. #46
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    Re: Has anyone been to see a medium?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tiger Feet View Post
    Wow. Raw nerve?
    Not at all, just a more complete response. I'll have forgotten what i posted in the next 5 minutes.

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    Re: Has anyone been to see a medium?

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Shnikov View Post
    Defined as...?

    Believing in any new-age (or old-age) gobbledygook.
    University Of Metaphysics, NewThought University Metaphysics Since1959

    Why not take a degree in Metaphysics Barry?

    Meta is Greek for over and beyond.

    Metaphysics is the mother of physics.

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    Re: Has anyone been to see a medium?

    I have never been to a medium, but my mother has several times.

    I remember once the medium was telling her about her deceased father who was "present".

    Then the medium says, "Oh wait, there is a woman trying to interupt him and pushing her way in"

    My mother said, "Oh, that sounds just like my mother, his wife. (also deceased)

    She did fit the description and it's just what she used to do to him when they were both alive.

  9. #49
    Registered User Rhythm King's Avatar
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    Re: Has anyone been to see a medium?

    Quote Originally Posted by Astro View Post
    University Of Metaphysics, NewThought University Metaphysics Since1959

    Why not take a degree in Metaphysics Barry?

    Meta is Greek for over and beyond.

    Metaphysics is the mother of physics.
    Sorry Astro, but Metaphysics has nothing to do with physics, and is certainly not the mother of physics. It is more closely aligned to philosophy, if anything.

    This New Thought University seems exactly the sort of place that is interested in the development of your spiritual self through the physical manifestation of taking away your money. Personally, I haven't heard of Metaphysics as primary degree courses at the likes of UCL or Oxbridge.

    A death can be a traumatic experience for those around it and can leave people vulnerable. Whilst there are many well-meaning people there are also those who are prepared to take advantage of grief and bereavement. Whilst I hope RubyRed is able to overcome her problem and find some comfort, I would also advise her to be wary.

  10. #50
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    Re: Has anyone been to see a medium?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadful Scathe View Post
    You're the one saying no harm can come of it....The onus is not on me to say "what harm" could come of it
    You're the one who attacked my position as naive. The onus is therefore on you to show why it is naive. What harm could come from it that my naive mind has missed?

  11. #51
    Registered User Isis's Avatar
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    Re: Has anyone been to see a medium?

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Shnikov View Post
    This is a fallacy.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadful Scathe View Post
    it's a logical fallacy.
    And which logical fallacies would these be?

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    Re: Has anyone been to see a medium?

    Quote Originally Posted by Isis View Post
    And which logical fallacies would these be?
    hmm i suggest you start at a pre-school reading book and work your way up

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    Re: Has anyone been to see a medium?

    Quote Originally Posted by Isis View Post
    You're the one who attacked my position as naive. The onus is therefore on you to show why it is naive. What harm could come from it that my naive mind has missed?
    Good way to deflect a question, answer it with an irrelevant one. I bet you clear the kitchen at parties.

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    Re: Has anyone been to see a medium?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadful Scathe View Post
    I bet you clear the kitchen at parties.
    My God DS...you should become a medium, you clearly have a talent for reading my mind.

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    Registered User John S's Avatar
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    Re: Has anyone been to see a medium?

    For me, Shakespeare summed up the charlatanry in so-called contact with the "spirit world" in Henry IV Part 1:

    GLENDOWER
    I can call spirits from the vasty deep.

    HOTSPUR
    Why, so can I, or so can any man;
    But will they come when you do call for them?

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    Re: Has anyone been to see a medium?

    Quote Originally Posted by Astro View Post
    University Of Metaphysics, NewThought University Metaphysics Since1959

    Why not take a degree in Metaphysics Barry?

    Meta is Greek for over and beyond.

    Metaphysics is the mother of physics.
    It's a seductive idea, but metaphysics is just baseless assertions being taught to people with no critical thinking skills.

    Ultra is another useful prefix, but ultraphysics is no less meaningful a term than metaphysics.

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    Re: Has anyone been to see a medium?

    Quote Originally Posted by Isis View Post
    And which logical fallacies would these be?
    Sorry, don't remember. But there are a lot of them about in an average forum week.

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    Re: Has anyone been to see a medium?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadful Scathe View Post
    So you have no real experience at all then but are willing paint them all with the same brush.
    Yes I am. It is an end-of-the-pier trick, easily recreated by magicians who at least have the decency to admit that it's a trick.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadful Scathe View Post
    You are willing to recommend people go to their local church for help without knowing if they are religious!
    I am probably the most non-religious non-believer you will come across. All that I was saying is that local churches are one way of contacting bereavement councillors, I also recommended the local PCT in the same sentence but you chose not to quote that. The one that has help my friend came via the local church, there is no religious bent on the counselling service being given.

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    Re: Has anyone been to see a medium?

    Quote Originally Posted by Keefy View Post
    Yes I am. It is an end-of-the-pier trick, easily recreated by magicians who at least have the decency to admit that it's a trick.
    There are thousands who believe otherwise, but you are dismissing it while admiting you know nothing about it.

    I am probably the most non-religious non-believer you will come across. All that I was saying is that local churches are one way of contacting bereavement councillors, I also recommended the local PCT in the same sentence but you chose not to quote that.
    Because I didn't know what it was and assumed it wasn't religious. It was the local church recommendation that stood out. On one hand you dismiss peoples beliefs but on another you push someone elses.

    The one that has help my friend came via the local church, there is no religious bent on the counselling service being given.
    It may be completely altruistic with no underlying message, not all church groups will be like that but some are. But its still a religious sponsored service, belief based - and so are mediums.

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    Registered User Lynn's Avatar
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    Re: Has anyone been to see a medium?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadful Scathe View Post

    It may be completely altruistic with no underlying message, not all church groups will be like that but some are. But its still a religious sponsored service, belief based - and so are mediums.
    What makes a recommendation or referral by a church something 'religious sponsored'? (Especially when Keefy has said they are non religious counselling services.) You think the church gets paid to refer people to counsellors?

    I think your personal prejudices against churches are what is showing up here DS.
    Last edited by Lynn; 19th-May-2008 at 09:28 AM.

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