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Thread: Do advanced dancers 'suffer more' than average dancers dancing with beginners

  1. #41
    Registered User killingtime's Avatar
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    Re: Do advanced dancers 'suffer more' than average dancers dancing with beginners

    Quote Originally Posted by Moondancer View Post
    It never occurred to me before that I might get a second dance because the first WASN'T good, or that I might not get a second because the first WAS. Is this way of looking at things usual?
    Probably not. It's probably just me who is weird. Don't worry about getting a second dance because the first wasn't good. If the first dance just didn't feel good I probably wouldn't ask for a second. If I have a dance and though I could do better then I'll ask for another in the hope that I can actually dance the way I know I'm capable of. Other times it might just be that I didn't feel connected and I feel that I want to be able to dance well with that partner so I'll vie for the connection.

  2. #42
    Registered User Twirly's Avatar
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    Re: Do advanced dancers 'suffer more' than average dancers dancing with beginners

    Quote Originally Posted by Astro View Post
    I don't ask because, if you've both just finished a dance, I feel as if the lead might think I'm fishing for compliments - when in fact, I'd want to know how I can improve.

    Do other follows ask for feedback?
    And do you get serious feedback that is useful?
    Yes, I've done it, after reading Chef's comments ages ago that he's also posted above - asking for just one thing which I can do to improve my dancing. (Note - this is different from asking for "feedback" which could be construed as fishing for compliments. You need to be asked to be actively critiqued.)

    I've done it twice, both with forumites whom I've danced with a few times. First one we'd danced several times over a couple of days, second time I already knew the lead a bit - had danced plenty of times over a protracted period at several venues in London.

    First time I got one really useful piece of advice that took me several weeks or even months to crack, but it made a big difference. Second time, I virtually had a mini-lesson from the lead, who was amazingly helpful! Spent a whole track showing me about three different things I could do (had only asked for one though). Again, took some time to get the hang of what I'd been told, but what was fantastic, was that when I danced with him a couple of months later, he actually noticed the improvement - asked if I'd been working on my frame and said I was much easier to lead It made my evening

    I've also asked for help with a particular move I've been struggling with (Manhatten/Columbian style moves). Once from a regular at my venue whom it turned out also wanted to improve his leading of this which caused great mirth as we struggled together, and once from a forumite who showed me how it should be lead so I could feel the difference. Again, both good experiences - and they've paid off as I had more success since (mostly, although I had another impromptu lesson at Storm on another variation of this that I managed to get muddled on )

    I've also been asked once. The person took my advice as well, and it made a big difference to his dancing too I was also very flattered that I'd been asked - and think the leads I'd asked were also.

    So yes, it's worth doing. Just pick your lead well, make sure it's someone sympathetic, whom you like and whose dancing you respect.

  3. #43
    Forum Bombshell - Our Queen! Lory's Avatar
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    Re: Do advanced dancers 'suffer more' than average dancers dancing with beginners

    My analogy...

    When a fabulous piece of music comes on, its like...

    An experienced racing driver, on a perfect day, with perfect 'Track' conditions being given a Lada to drive!
    MODERATOR AT YOUR SERVICE
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  4. #44
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    Re: Do advanced dancers 'suffer more' than average dancers dancing with beginners

    Assuming that the 'beginner' is not doing anything wrong*, then an 'advanced' dancer should be able to dance with them without any problem. You can still use all the technique you have, all your partnering skills, and all your musicality. The only difference is you might have to work a bit harder, as you can't rely on your partner to help as much.

    *I usually find intermediates do more things wrong than beginners.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lory View Post
    An experienced racing driver, on a perfect day, with perfect 'Track' conditions being given a Lada to drive!
    They do this on Top Gear, and the F1 drivers are still way faster than anyone else.

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    Re: Do advanced dancers 'suffer more' than average dancers dancing with beginners

    Quote Originally Posted by Moondancer View Post

    Reading the various posts about how non-beginners feel about dancing with beginners has been really helpful. I haven’t felt confident about giving anyone a good dance yet, but I feel a whole lot better knowing that dancing with a beginner doesn’t automatically make for a bad or boring experience.

    Are there any clues to knowing what your (polite) partner really feels about the dance you just shared? - other than asking you back, which I think would be unreasonable to expect as there would be many other people they would want to dance with.
    To a lot of the sensible replies above.

    When I first started dancing the best dancer in the room kept asking me to dance and I could not work out why. (in fact I felt rather embarised, and thought she must have got bored with my 4 moves and lack of grace)

    When I asked her why she asks me, she said "I enjoy dancing with you , coz you smile, you look at me and include me in the dance, and you seem to be having a lot of fun"

    The same thing now encorages me to dance with beginners:
    The fact that they are enjoying the dance, adds to my enjoyment.

    As a beginner you are not going to be the best dancer in the room, and I am not going to be able to totally switch off and lead whatever - It can however be a good experience, and not boring, if you can see the "happiness" radiating from the partner you are dancing with.

  6. #46
    Forum Bombshell - Our Queen! Lory's Avatar
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    Re: Do advanced dancers 'suffer more' than average dancers dancing with beginners

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidB View Post
    They do this on Top Gear, and the F1 drivers are still way faster than anyone else.
    I know, I was having a little jokeypoo!
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  7. #47
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    Re: Do advanced dancers 'suffer more' than average dancers dancing with beginners

    Quote Originally Posted by Lory View Post
    An experienced racing driver, on a perfect day, with perfect 'Track' conditions being given a Lada to drive!
    Quote Originally Posted by DavidB View Post
    They do this on Top Gear, and the F1 drivers are still way faster than anyone else.
    So perhaps in this case, Lory is the finely tuned state-of-the-art F1 car, it's a perfect day, with perfect track conditions, and Mr Bean gets behind the wheel?

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    Re: Do advanced dancers 'suffer more' than average dancers dancing with beginners

    Quote Originally Posted by straycat264 View Post
    So perhaps in this case, Lory is the finely tuned state-of-the-art F1 car, it's a perfect day, with perfect track conditions, and Mr Bean gets behind the wheel?

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    Re: Do advanced dancers 'suffer more' than average dancers dancing with beginners

    I'm not sure "beginner" is the right term. If I end up dancing with a beginner, sometimes it works well; sometimes it works badly. Some beginners know how to follow (or, at least, know how to follow my leads). Others don't. However, the same is true of intermediate dancers...

    I do find dancing with beginners more limiting: there are a lot of moves I can't do with them because I don't trust they have the technique to follow the lead without making it ugly (or downright dangerous). But, once again, this is true of a number of intermediate dancers as well.

    Sometimes, I'm lucky enough find individuals that I really enjoy dancing with. It's rarely about the moves they know or the standard of their (or my) dancing. It's more about the fact that we connect well on the dance floor. I tend to dance better with them and, I'm sure, me dancing better helps them dance better as well. And, over time, they'll learn all my favourite moves and I'll learn what they enjoy and what they don't.

    Those are the people I always look for when I want to dance. I don't care if they're a beginner or not...

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    Re: Do advanced dancers 'suffer more' than average dancers dancing with beginners

    Quote Originally Posted by straycat264 View Post
    So perhaps in this case, Lory is the finely tuned state-of-the-art F1 car, it's a perfect day, with perfect track conditions, and Mr Bean gets behind the wheel?
    Oops it seems there is a MrBean on the forum. I didn'y know, sorry if I laughed.

    Let's change it to Basil Fawlty in the car episode.

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