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Thread: Cricitising your dance partner.

  1. #21
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    Re: Cricitising your dance partner.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twirly View Post
    Absolutely! It's a bit like saying "that was a good effort, not as good as mine, but not bad"
    I can agree with David's observation.
    I cannot agree with your interpretation.
    I think and I say.
    I recognise something as being done well and I say well done.
    I do not think like you have suggested.

  2. #22
    Registered User Twirly's Avatar
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    Re: Cricitising your dance partner.

    Quote Originally Posted by dep View Post
    I can agree with David's observation.
    I cannot agree with your interpretation.
    I think and I say.
    I recognise something as being done well and I say well done.
    I do not think like you have suggested.
    Fair enough, but it's not what you say, it's how it's heard!

    One person might take it in the spirit you intend, another might think "patronising so and so!" So long as you're happy with that

  3. #23
    Registered User David Franklin's Avatar
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    Re: Cricitising your dance partner.

    Quote Originally Posted by dep View Post
    maybe it's the teacher in me leaking out.
    But we teachers even say it to each other when something is well done. We like to be recognised.
    The danger with saying "Well done" is that it's easy for the recipient to think you mean "Well done (for you)". I think you need a fair bit of mutual respect and understanding for it not to be seen like that.

    It appears that the same comment cannot be applied to dancing peers without some kind of put down being interpreted.
    I don't think it's just about dancing - I've certainly said "well done" and regretted it in completely different fields of life.

    One distinction I'll make: I bet that when you say "well done" in a working environment, it's usually attached to an actual piece of work. You might say "Well done on Class 3B getting 12 A*s". By doing that, it's much less likely it will be taken the wrong way.

    But if you just say "well done" at the end of the dance, it comes across as a much more generic thing directed at your partner. So the "(for you)" is more likely to be added.

    Even if you're only the second to state that view, then I will find other compliments to express my satisfaction.
    If you ask around, I think you'll find the majority of dancers don't like it, even if they don't actively make a fuss about it.

  4. #24
    Commercial Operator Gus's Avatar
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    Re: Cricitising your dance partner.

    Quote Originally Posted by dep View Post
    not true.
    It's up to the lead to recognise the level and capability of the follower.
    Throughout it is a partnership and if the lead is doing his job properly BOTH will enjoy the dance.
    So ... just so I understand where you ar coming from, are you an advanced dancer? I can understand your viewpoint ... but it may be that it applies just to you.

    My personal perspective differs somewhat. though I wouldn't put myself in the advanced category anymore, I do enjoy dances that may push outside the standard moves. If I'm in teacher mode then I'm quite happy to dance with anyone and everyone and accept I'll get pulled around, pulled off beat and need to limit my moves.

    However, if I go to a freestyle and all there is is 'begginerish' dancers ... I think I'm entitled to feel a little hacked off (and several local clubs come to mind ). I want to be able to go and DANCE ... not just plod through moves. It may be a limitation in me that I can't lead less able dancers through more adventurous movement ... but its so nice to go to a venue where there are at least a few lasses who can make the music come alive.

    Case in point was Stockport last night. Went for a quick half hour to catch up with friends but ended up staying for an hour if dance. Good DJ helped (nice to Steve Bryant there now)... but usually the place sucks as a its just 'bog standard dancing'. However, last night there were at least three lasses who made dancing a real pleasure.

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    Re: Cricitising your dance partner.

    Quote Originally Posted by Easily Led View Post
    Recently I went to a work-related motivational session where the speaker suggested that any criticism should be prefaced with at least two good points
    I prefer people to tell me if they have a problem with something I lead. I assume that means that they think i am worth dancing with again, AND want to improve that future experience. If they say 'that was nice' and run off, who cares what they actually felt?

    Sean

  6. #26
    Registered User Twirly's Avatar
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    Re: Cricitising your dance partner.

    Quote Originally Posted by tsh View Post
    I prefer people to tell me if they have a problem with something I lead. I assume that means that they think i am worth dancing with again, AND want to improve that future experience. If they say 'that was nice' and run off, who cares what they actually felt?

    Sean
    That's a really intersting point of view - haven't thought of it like that before. If I don't get a lead, am inclined to assume that it's my fault and not say anything, or apologise I have been known to say to leads I dance with quite often "uhm, I'm not quite sure where you want me to be" when it all goes horribly wrong - the answer invariably comes back, "I'm not sure either"!

  7. #27
    The Dashing Moderator
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    Re: Cricitising your dance partner.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twirly View Post
    I know there was a discussion about this a while back, one of our highly experienced forumite follows had it said to her and took exception as well, but I can't find the thread. Anyone remember it
    I think it's this thread.
    Love dance, will travel

  8. #28
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    Re: Cricitising your dance partner.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gus View Post
    Case in point was Stockport last night. Went for a quick half hour to catch up with friends but ended up staying for an hour if dance. Good DJ helped (nice to Steve Bryant there now)... but usually the place sucks as a its just 'bog standard dancing'. However, last night there were at least three lasses who made dancing a real pleasure.
    Stockport does vary quite a bit in the week. Although you could sum up a fair few venues around the NW like that.

  9. #29
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    Re: Cricitising your dance partner.

    Quote Originally Posted by David Franklin View Post
    Honestly? I think saying "well done" is very likely to come across as patronising. I can't really put my finger on why it's different from "brilliant", "fantastic", etc. but I do think it is. I don't see "well done" as something you generally say to equals - it's more something a parent says to a child, or a teacher to a student.


    "Well done" is a recognition of an achievement. Unless dancing with you is particularly difficult, then why say "well done" to someone you've danced with – what have they achieved that they need to be congratulated for?
    Let your mind go and your body will follow. – Steve Martin, LA Story

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    Re: Cricitising your dance partner.

    Quote Originally Posted by David Franklin View Post
    The danger with saying "Well done" is that it's easy for the recipient to think you mean "Well done (for you)". I think you need a fair bit of mutual respect and understanding for it not to be seen like that.

    ...

    If you ask around, I think you'll find the majority of dancers don't like it, even if they don't actively make a fuss about it.
    There are many better ways to express delight/appreciation after a dance than "well done". "I really enjoyed that dance, thank you" seems preferable.

    The thing is IMO, dancing's not a task, you can be good or bad at it, but it's something you just do, like conversation. You can have really good conversations with people, after which you might say something like "thanks for the chat", or "good to talk to you again", but you'd never say "well done", even if it was their sparkling conversation which was so fun.

    Dan

  11. #31
    Registered User martingold's Avatar
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    Re: Cricitising your dance partner.

    Quote Originally Posted by gebandemuishond View Post
    There are many better ways to express delight/appreciation after a dance than "well done". "I really enjoyed that dance, thank you" seems preferable.

    The thing is IMO, dancing's not a task, you can be good or bad at it, but it's something you just do, like conversation. You can have really good conversations with people, after which you might say something like "thanks for the chat", or "good to talk to you again", but you'd never say "well done", even if it was their sparkling conversation which was so fun.

    Dan

    My normal appreciative remark to a beginner who has danced well is "WOW!"

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    Re: Cricitising your dance partner.

    Quote Originally Posted by martingold View Post

    My normal appreciative remark to a beginner who has danced well is "WOW!"
    I sometimes say "Are you REALLY a beginner"...

  13. #33
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    Re: Cricitising your dance partner.

    Originally Posted by dep
    not true.
    It's up to the lead to recognise the level and capability of the follower.
    Throughout it is a partnership and if the lead is doing his job properly BOTH will (have the opportunity to) enjoy the dance.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gus View Post
    So ... just so I understand where you ar coming from, are you an advanced dancer? I can understand your viewpoint ... but it may be that it applies just to you.
    not even close to advanced.
    I have discovered I enjoy dancing and have past the improver stage and into my nearly stagnant intermediate stage. My progress now is very slow. But, I still look for ways to make the experience enjoyable for both of us, otherwise there would be no point.

    Note my edit to my original text. I cannot force my partner to enjoy the dance, but I am certainly capable of making it objectionable.

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    Re: Cricitising your dance partner.

    Quote Originally Posted by Steven666 View Post
    I sometimes say "Are you REALLY a beginner"...
    "no" comes the reply

    Message understood.
    No more "well Done".
    Glad I asked.

  15. #35
    Registered User Twirly's Avatar
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    Re: Cricitising your dance partner.

    Quote Originally Posted by dep View Post
    I cannot force my partner to enjoy the dance, but I am certainly capable of making it objectionable.
    Objectionable?

    *makes a note not to upset dep*

  16. #36
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    Re: Cricitising your dance partner.

    Quote Originally Posted by robd View Post
    THIS IS RUBBISH....

    Dancing is a partnership. If a move does not end up as the leader expected then that is a result of the partnership. Talking of fault presupposes that leader and follower are in competition rather than complementing one another.
    err no its not.

    Yes you are right, dancing is a partnership but its a one sided partnership to a certain extent. I can be a good dancer but if the lead is awful things are going to go wrong and there isn't a lot a follower can do about it. But....I can be a bad follower but a good lead will sort it out. Complimenting each other is when your talking about two relatively equal dancers who are able to read the moves and each other. a newbie is not going to be able to do this yet generally and will rely heavily on the lead to direct them. If the lead is weak, a newbie will flounder. so, i repeat, when you are a follower good or bad, if the lead is weak, your bolloxed.

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    Re: Cricitising your dance partner.

    Quote Originally Posted by Trouble View Post
    I can be a bad follower but a good lead will sort it out.
    Not always the case with a REALLY bad follow.

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    Re: Cricitising your dance partner.

    Quote Originally Posted by Steven666 View Post
    Not always the case with a REALLY bad follow.
    well it is really. ive stated learning lead and do the classes as a lead. I get the beginners and the women that are awful but with a little patience and guidance, i can lead them. Its just a matter of them understanding body positioning and the signs to look for. Newbies are so nervous and are always apologising but i really do think to myself, its my fault your not doing it, im not leading you correctly or guiding you into the right position.

  19. #39
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    Re: Cricitising your dance partner.

    Quote Originally Posted by Trouble View Post
    so, i repeat, when you are a follower good or bad, if the lead is weak, your bolloxed.
    Well, I am not sure that what you are saying above (which I agree with - the standard of the dance tends to be at the level of the leader's ability) is what you were saying here

    Quote Originally Posted by Trouble
    Now i know im a good follow, so trust me, if it went wrong then this is not my fault but theirs. THIS IS ALWAYS THE CASE.... so next time somebody does that, do as i do. Smile sweetly and ignore them.

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    Re: Cricitising your dance partner.

    Quote Originally Posted by robd View Post
    Well, I am not sure that what you are saying above (which I agree with - the standard of the dance tends to be at the level of the leader's ability) is what you were saying here
    I was actually refering to the horrible man who tapped her on the head and said better luck next time or something to that effect when in actual fact the reality was probably C5AP LEAD. (she done it fine all the other times if i remember correctly)

    Anyway, more importantly, who is that in your avatar.?

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