is it really 'their loss/someone else's gain' when someone is refused?

[ChrisB]

There is only one of me. No matter how well I dance there will always only be one of me.

In the time I have been dancing I have noticed the demand to dance with me increase.
There was one of me when I started to dance and nobody wanted to dance with me; there is one of me now when I rarely get a chance to sit down because of women asking me to dance.

I do not believe I am in demand because of my number.

Although not often turned down, I had no problem leaving the floor or sitting out a song in my first weeks. Since my fourth I've found it nigh on impossible at one venue yet easier at another with a generally higher quality of dancer. I'm sure in another month or two the same will happen there

[straycat]

Guys try to imagine what it is like to be in our sparkly high heels for once before dishing out advice!!

So you're blaming your shoes now?

[DundeeDancer]

My take on refusals is simple (even simpler given that I don't ask very often) - if refused for whatever reason and in whatever manner (polite or otherwise) I will not ask that person again until they have asked me to dance. However I appreciate the scenario is a lot different for leaders than followers.

Don't know Robd, I like to give people more opportunities than just asking them once and never again till they ask back. Thinking about it if I really wanted to dance with someone and they had politely declined my offer then I'd probably ask them later on in the night, if they refused again then leave it to another night. If they refused on another night then I might only ask them once in a blue moon.


I won't see it as their loss but my gain, nothing much worse than dancing with someone who doesn't want to dance with you, 3-4 minutes in a dance like that seems like a lifetime, get me out of there!


If you have this ask once rule do you not feel you might have missed out on dancing with some really good dancers who you could of learned something from? Even if they love themselves and think they are superior to you are you not the one missing out on the opportunities here?

DD

[SuzyQ]

So you're blaming your shoes now?

Whistle all you like ... very bored of this. All I'm asking for is a little empathy!

Clearly, if there are 100 women, and 70 men in the room ... more women are going to have to mill around waiting for a dance than men (which is not always a bad thing - would prefer to talk to my friends than dance with an inconsiderate arm yanker !)

Moreover, it is easier for a man to feel 'superior' enough to refuse a lady because they have this experience of being 'in demand' from fairly early on in their dance career.

Interesting how many men on the forum like to blow their own trumpets ... and how much more sensitive and reserved the women tend to be!

[MartinHarper]

All I'm asking for is a little empathy!

So, to recap:

Suzy shares her feelings, wanting some empathy.
JiveLad offers a solution.
Suzy gets cross because she was offered a solution, when she wanted some empathy.

[straycat]

Whistle all you like ... very bored of this. All I'm asking for is a little empathy!

You're asking for empathy - and I do agree that the world could all use lot more of it, but - Jivelad's suggested solution was pretty empathy laden, whereas your own...

Why not interpret the refusers as being among the more obnoxious people in life ... rather than among the most accomplished dancers!!!

really truly isn't. It's hard to get empathy without showing it.

Clearly, if there are 100 women, and 70 men in the room ... more women are going to have to mill around waiting for a dance than men (which is not always a bad thing - would prefer to talk to my friends than dance with an inconsiderate arm yanker !)

Moreover, it is easier for a man to feel 'superior' enough to refuse a lady because they have this experience of being 'in demand' from fairly early on in their dance career.

Since when did this thread become a men-vs-women debate? It was started by a man (unless Robd has some secret he's keeping hidden) - and last I checked, men hardly have exclusivity on rude refusals.

So. Do I sympathise / empathise with you over the refusals you've had, and over the gender imbalance? Yes. Do I think your approach is a productive one? No.

[DundeeDancer]

Whistle all you like ... very bored of this. All I'm asking for is a little empathy!

I won't refuse you SuzyQ

I'd grab the opportunity to dance with you with both hands, in fact maybe I won't let you go! Then you'd be in real trouble

[JCB]

Guys try to imagine what it is like to be in our sparkly high heels

...umm SuzyQ... I think that "imagining what it is like to be in the other person's shoes" is exactly what JiveLad was advocating:

1. See the refusal from your perspective
2. See the refusal from the perspective of the person who refused you
3. Play it thru as an outsider watching the event

Moreover, (my take on his words) that your own perspective has equal worth, even though it may colour the way you see the refuser's actions. So he recommends trying to be objective. Why? Because, although in some cases there may be a valid excuse, or the rudeness may be unintentional, you may well conclude that the refuser is simply intolerably arrogant and rude, and you don't really care about their opinion of you, but you do care that other dancers who have seen the incident see you deal with it with grace and good humour. And even if you wouldn't be particularly disturbed if a hole opened beneath the refuser, and they dropped in, you wouldn't actually wish it on them, because they are not worth troubling the few neurons required to formulate that thought. You have to reason it through, rather than respond emotionally: it makes the difference between sour grapes (which is telling yourself you don't care) and actually not caring.
My own philosophy is similar: Learn from it if you can, then let it go.
But as JiveLad said, much more easily said than done.
(However, if there was deliberate hurtfulness or ridicule, I might advise the person running the venue.)
- V.
(BTW - I am not fooling myself: the refusals still sting - so I certainly wouldn't refuse an occasional sympathetic hug! )

[fletch]

ALERT

I'v just had a text message from a forum member to say that 'the twat in a hat' has been spotted at West Bridford, she has just asked him for a dance and his reply was ' I WILL HAVE TO ASSES YOUR DANCE ABILITY FIRST'

her reply FCUK OFF

who is the horrid man and should he be allowed to keep doing this.

AR$E

[ducasi]

Moreover, it is easier for a man to feel 'superior' enough to refuse a lady because they have this experience of being 'in demand' from fairly early on in their dance career.

I think I'm quite a good dancer, but I don't think I've felt I've been especially "in demand" at any point in my dance career. In fact, in my life.

I must be doing something wrong.

[Steven666]

I think I'm quite a good dancer, but I don't think I've felt I've been especially "in demand" at any point in my dance career. In fact, in my life.

I must be doing something wrong.

Well can you not ask anybody all night yet never sit a track out?

[Moondancer]

Oh, now I feel truly part of this forum 'cos I got turned down by a certain person in a hat (more of a cap, really) at Burton...are we talking about the same guy? He didn't give me a reason, just said "No" and looked away, and then when I walked back round the floor to my seat and sat down someone said "Oh, he always says no unless he thinks you're special enough to make it worth his while."

[SuzyQ]

Good grief! I DO have a lot of empathy. I perfectly understand if someone is tired/needs a drink/needs to change/doesn't like the track/doesn't want to dance with me. What I object to are serial refusers who are just plain mean and make quite a lot of people feel bad. There are several really nice women on here who are great dancers (not that this should matter) who have been made to feel quite bad about themselves just because of a few tricky characters who are known refusers.
When I get refused ... I do not get the hump, I do not strop around, I do not hold a grudge. But what I really don't like are tales of nice people being upset by nasty people. Oh and they do exist in the dancing world just like they do in the big bad world!!

[Lory]

When I get refused ... I do not get the hump, I do not strop around, I do not hold a grudge.

Blimey, your a saint! I do all of those!

[Fruity Oranges]

ALERT

I'v just had a text message from a forum member to say that 'the twat in a hat' has been spotted at West Bridford, she has just asked him for a dance and his reply was ' I WILL HAVE TO ASSES YOUR DANCE ABILITY FIRST'

her reply FCUK OFF

who is the horrid man and should he be allowed to keep doing this.

AR$E

Reply wasn't exactly that - I'd never be that rude - but I felt like telling him that!!

[fletch]

Reply wasn't exactly that - I'd never be that rude - but I felt like telling him that!!

The net is closing in on 'the twat in a hat'

[fletch]

I asked a guy to dance last night at Kidderminster who has refused me twice at Bromsgrove, his reply was

ho, hum, er, mybe later.


I looked at him and said with a little smile gently, come on


as we walked on the floor he said i'm only a beginer, i'm not good enought to dance with you, i'v watched you at Bromsgrove.

Cut a long story short, we had two in a row, and went on to have two more later in the evening, with him asking me once

Its ok to refuse, but for the right reasons, don't be crule and hurtfull, consider the other pearsons feelings and be genuine

[dep]

I asked a guy to dance last night at Kidderminster who has refused me twice at Bromsgrove, his reply was

ho, hum, er, mybe later.


I looked at him and said with a little smile gently, come on


as we walked on the floor he said i'm only a beginner, i'm not good enough to dance with you, i'v watched you at Bromsgrove.

Cut a long story short, we had two in a row, and went on to have two more later in the evening, with him asking me once

embarrassed little soul.
A touch of Oliver asking for "more"

[Agente Secreto]

............as we walked on the floor he said i'm only a beginer, i'm not good enought to dance with you, i'v watched you at Bromsgrove.

It's a good point. I was that man myself for the first few months. I didn't refuse anyone mind, but had some rubbish dances because I was so worried about how bad I'd be with a good lady dancer that I couldn't dance at all. It took 2 southports to get over that feeling.

The male performance ego sometimes still gets the better of us too i think. I remember being in the southport blues room in my very first visit (i'd been dancing for 3 months at that stage) and dancing with a particularly graceful lady just after she'd been danced off her feet by someone else with a load of flash moves. We danced for 2 tracks and afterwards I plucked up the courage to ask if i'd been OK and she said that it had been one of the most 'connected' dances she'd had all night, hence the 2 tracks in a row. 2 things stick in my mind about what she said..............

I'd not tried to bamboozle her with moves (I only had a dozen anyway - mostly beginners - so there was no chance of that)
You take something different out of every dance and she never left the floor comparing partners just asking herself would she dance with a guy again - it took me another 4 months to believe her

The only time I tend to 'postpone' a dance is when I'm very sweaty and need to freshen up. In this case I always make a point of finding the lady immediately after deodorant and a clean shirt.................

[Easily Led]

...... The only time I tend to 'postpone' a dance is when I'm very sweaty and need to freshen up. In this case I always make a point of finding the lady immediately after deodorant and a clean shirt.................

You were certainly very fresh with me last night