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Thread: Swish 2008 feedback

  1. #21
    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: Swish 2008 feedback

    Quote Originally Posted by SilverFox View Post
    Our bungalow was a little on the small side to have all 650 people round, so here's an idea Lynn. One could have their own party in their own bungalow with their own friends, or are you suggesting that nobody else's friends know the first thing about throwing a good party? ....
    I think the pronouns in that sentence got away from you...

    Quote Originally Posted by SilverFox View Post
    Or maybe it was clear enough to 648 other people, just not Nebula?
    No.

    The differences between weekenders are not as clear as they could be, at a high enough level. This is a combination of meaning-light names (Difficult to remember the differences between "Breeze", "Chill", "Storm", "Swish", "Splash", "Splosh" etc.), plus a lack of description on the main Escape page.

    It's easy to remedy - for example, you could have taglines, something like:
    • Storm: The Big One
    • Chill: The Welsh One
    • Blaze: The Scottish One
    • Viva Las Vegas: The Casino one
    • Breeze: The Blues One
    • Bliss: The Autumn One
    • Splash: The Blackpool One
    • Swish: The Posh One


    OK, the descriptions could do with some work, but I'd imagine a half-decent marketing organisation should be able to knock something up twice as good as that, in a couple of hours at most. How difficult would that be to do?

  2. #22
    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: Swish 2008 feedback

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky View Post
    I'm guessing that you've never been to Beach Boogie then... Now that is also a great w/e in spite of the truly, truly awful accomodation.
    I think Bisley holds the record for Worst Accommodation Ever - I'd rather sleep in a tent.

    But I thought "high-quality accommodation" was one of the selling points for Swish? Looking at the site, I see prices start at £179 even for bungalows - much more than Pontins-weekenders - so presumably they should be better quality?

    Keefy, what exactly was wrong with the bungalow? How'd it compare to chalets at other (Pontins) weekenders?

  3. #23
    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: Swish 2008 feedback

    Quote Originally Posted by David Franklin View Post
    Just having a quick skim through (particularly at the "Who should come" page), I don't see the differences as that obvious.
    Well, "clear" is maybe a bit strong. But I think it's possible to sort-of get a feel for the differences, through reading the different descriptions.

    Which, hmmm, OK, is actually quite a long way from being "clear". In fact, it's not too far off from Rowan Williams levels of unclarity...

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    Re: Swish 2008 feedback

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky View Post
    I'm guessing that you've never been to Beach Boogie then... Now that is also a great w/e in spite of the truly, truly awful accomodation.
    You aint kidding. Count yourself very lucky to have a roof and a bed at Beach Boogie. Still...you're never short of company at Beach Boogie. Plenty of cockroaches to keep you warm at night.

  5. #25
    Dickie Davies' love-child Cruella's Avatar
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    Re: Swish 2008 feedback

    Quote Originally Posted by SilverFox View Post
    EDIT. Blimey, will Rocky & Cruella stop butting in just as I'm typing replies. People will think you both like me.....
    I doubt anyone's that stupid.

  6. #26
    Dickie Davies' love-child Cruella's Avatar
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    Re: Swish 2008 feedback

    Bisley is definately the worst and Beach Boogie comes a close second.
    Pontins' chalets are luxurious in comparison!
    Last edited by Cruella; 21st-February-2008 at 05:11 PM.

  7. #27
    Registered User Twirly's Avatar
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    Re: Swish 2008 feedback

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    The differences between weekenders are not as clear as they could be, at a high enough level.
    Are the differences that huge though? OK, have only been to Bliss due to things beyond my control (rectifying it this year though!). Surely there are more things in common between most weekenders than there are things to differentiate them?

    After all, it's mostly Pontins or their equivalent, a load of dancers, workshops (which could be the key to identity) and assorted DJs, who are likely to overlap if it's a Ceroc weekender I'd have thought.

    How can Ceroc really differentiate between the events, what could be done to make one stand out from the other? And should they? Or should the different Ceroc weekenders be more like regional events?

    Swish is a bit different, being in a supposedly 3/5* hotel complex I guess, but what about the others?

  8. #28
    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: Swish 2008 feedback

    Quote Originally Posted by Twirly View Post
    Are the differences that huge though?
    Accommodation-wise, the Pontins-esque weekenders are all pretty similar - but I think Blaze is different (smaller, caravans), and also Swish - maybe Splash (the Blackpool one) also, isn't that in a hotel?

    Atmosphere-wise, Ceroc are obviously trying to create different distinct identities for each one - and obviously not doing a brilliant job at it so far.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky View Post
    there apparently is a very thin line between love and hate, wouldn't you say Cru...?
    Man, that was a great track (Pretenders cover - anyone know what the original was like?). I bet that'd be fantastic for a Tango... ...

    Err, what were we talking about?

  9. #29
    Registered User Lynn's Avatar
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    Re: Swish 2008 feedback

    Quote Originally Posted by SilverFox View Post
    Interesting that you see them as 'names'. Those 'names' happen to be my friends and were the only people at the after-party party in our bungalow, and I mentioned them as a way of saying thank you to them for helping make my weekend so much fun.

    You have a problem with that?....
    Good grief, I've already said it was just a flippant comment.

    My point was simply that in response to a 'regular punter' saying they didn't have a good weekend, instead of addressing some of the issues those who had links with the event or are friends with people who have links with the event jumped in with replies along the vein of 'well you're wrong as everyone else had the most wonderful time' and 'you must have read the website incorrectly' and in that light your comment on 'well I had a great time cos I was hanging out with the teachers and other DJs' might have sounded a little bit 'them and us' even if you didn't intend it to be.

    Feedback is helpful. Find out what the customer was happy with, and wasn't happy with, and see how communication/product can be better improved next time.

    I agree, a weekender is what you make it. I've stayed in chalets where the condensation was so bad the pillows and duvet were wet (Camber), where food service has been slow (Southport) and dancing has ended early (most Ceroc weekenders) but I still had a great time because I didn't let those things spoil my weekend.

    But I do know if I'd posted a review like the one that started this thread, and got the responses there have been on here, I probably would be rather put off going to another Ceroc weekender cos not only would I feel I'd had a bad weekender experience, I'd also feel my opinion was considered to be irrelevant.

  10. #30
    Dickie Davies' love-child Cruella's Avatar
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    Re: Swish 2008 feedback

    Quote Originally Posted by Lynn View Post
    My point was simply that in response to a 'regular punter' saying they didn't have a good weekend,.....stuff.......But I do know if I'd posted a review like the one that started this thread, and got the responses there have been on here, I probably would be rather put off going to another Ceroc weekender cos not only would I feel I'd had a bad weekender experience, I'd also feel my opinion was considered to be irrelevant.
    I have to agree with you Lynn, people need to be able to give their own opinions of the weekend they experienced. Every bit of feedback is valid even if it is totally opposite from your own experience. Enjoyment is a personal experience and some things that can ruin a weekender for one person could be totally ignored by another. Also maybe reviews from the staff aren't exactly an objective opinion in comparison to the paying punters experience.
    Last edited by Cruella; 21st-February-2008 at 06:05 PM. Reason: Cos I don't know the difference between subjective and objective.

  11. #31
    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: Swish 2008 feedback

    Quote Originally Posted by Lynn View Post
    But I do know if I'd posted a review like the one that started this thread, and got the responses there have been on here, I probably would be rather put off going to another Ceroc weekender cos not only would I feel I'd had a bad weekender experience, I'd also feel my opinion was considered to be irrelevant.
    Which, again, is why it'd be nice to see some more feedback from honest-to-God customers

    So far, we've had a grand total of two customer feedback comments, from nebula and Keefy, and they've both said, basically, "It was awful".

    Which is not a ringing endorsement.

    Did anyone else on the forum go?

  12. #32
    Commercial Operator StokeBloke's Avatar
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    Cool Re: Swish 2008 feedback

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    The differences between weekenders are not as clear as they could be, at a high enough level. This is a combination of meaning-light names (Difficult to remember the differences between "Breeze", "Chill", "Storm", "Swish", "Splash", "Splosh" etc.), plus a lack of description on the main Escape page.

    It's easy to remedy - for example, you could have taglines, something like:
    • Storm: The Big One
    • Chill: The Welsh One
    • Blaze: The Scottish One
    • Viva Las Vegas: The Casino one
    • Breeze: The Blues One
    • Bliss: The Autumn One
    • Splash: The Blackpool One
    • Swish: The Posh One

    OK, the descriptions could do with some work, but I'd imagine a half-decent marketing organisation should be able to knock something up twice as good as that, in a couple of hours at most. How difficult would that be to do?
    Great idea David. I notice some of the independents managed to get around this by using the crazy hair-brained system of naming the event after the location. E.g, Southport, Camber... I know it's a weird idea but it may catch on. The number of people I have spoken with who say things like "When we were at Bliss... no... Splash... no... ummm y'know Brean Sands"

  13. #33
    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: Swish 2008 feedback

    Quote Originally Posted by StokeBloke View Post
    Great idea David. I notice some of the independents managed to get around this by using the crazy hair-brained system of naming the event after the location. E.g, Southport, Camber...
    Weeeellll... officially Southports are called "Jiving you crazy", "Jiving you wild", "Jiving you round the bend" or whatever - but no-one uses those names. Similarly for Franco's Camber things - I believe it had an "official" name, but no-one ever used it.

    It's easier to provide a unique identity if you've got (mainly) one location.

    That all said - location seems to be the main identifying factor so why not use that? I mean, "Viva Las Vegas"? Come on...

    EDIT: I've moved the "I've got cooler friends than you" competition here.
    Last edited by David Bailey; 21st-February-2008 at 08:07 PM.

  14. #34
    Registered User SilverFox's Avatar
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    Re: Swish 2008 feedback

    Quote Originally Posted by Lynn View Post
    But I do know if I'd posted a review like the one that started this thread, and got the responses there have been on here, I probably would be rather put off going to another Ceroc weekender cos not only would I feel I'd had a bad weekender experience, I'd also feel my opinion was considered to be irrelevant.
    Reality check needed me thinks.

    This is not Ceroc HQ.
    This is not Mike Ellard's personal email address.
    My post was not an official response to a customer's complaint sent through the appropriate channels.

    It's quite simply a forum with a load of people with far too much time on their hands, who most of the time discuss things they know very little about, so speculate or waffle on purely for the sake of it.

  15. #35
    Registered User sunnybunny's Avatar
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    Re: Swish 2008 feedback

    My twopenn'th.

    I went to Swish last year, this year and (pause to take phone call from Potters) have booked in for next year.

    As has been said in a previous post, this weekend is quite different from the usual Pontin's weekenders. There were a lot of couples and groups there who were treating it as a nice weekend break away "with good food, nice accommodation, some other stuff to do, a dance workshop if we fancy it and some dancing in the evening". These are the people who would not go within a mile of a Pontins holiday camp who also represent the majority of Ceroc's customer base. There were also some "hard core" dance addicts.

    I have a foot in both camps here - on the one hand (mixed metaphors, I know), it made a nice change to have a bit of luxury - my bungalow was very comfortable - a hop & a skip away from the main hotel and the food was scrummy. On the other, I was a bit frustrated at the lack of daytime dancing and limited choice of workshops. Those that I did attend (Marc & Rachel's, Val & Dave's and Lucky & Ruby's) were great, if in somewhat cramped conditions.

    What I absolutely hated, was the "entertainment" on Friday night. Who ever told that man that he was funny should have a lobotomy. It was marginally better on the Saturday night and not too bad on the Sunday. The singing and dancing was fine - the "comedy" was cringingly dire. If I have one suggestion to improve things for next year it would be to drastically edit the shows down to an hour tops - cutting out the "comedy" altogether. You do need to have a breather - to let your three course dinner go down - but an hour is quite long enough before I am fidgetting to get back dancing.

    The main dancefloor was great and I spent most of the time between 10 - 1ish in there dancing to the mostly pretty upbeat music. The chill out/ blues room had a fantastic atmosphere and I thoroughly enjoyed spending the rest of the time in there. Numbers did dwindle somewhat towards 3 - 4am, but, as was said previously - people were pretty keen not to miss breakfast the following morning - fried bread anyone ?

    One of my highlights was a particularly scrummy sandwich at the bar pretty late on Sunday night / Monday morning !

  16. #36
    Dickie Davies' love-child Cruella's Avatar
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    Re: Swish 2008 feedback

    Quote Originally Posted by SilverFox View Post
    Reality check needed me thinks.

    This is not Ceroc HQ.
    This is not Mike Ellard's personal email address.
    My post was not an official response to a customer's complaint sent through the appropriate channels.

    It's quite simply a forum with a load of people with far too much time on their hands, who most of the time discuss things they know very little about, so speculate or waffle on purely for the sake of it.
    But as 'staff' you will still be seen as a voice from Ceroc, rather than an ordinary punter. So no matter what you actually believe, it will still come across as a Ceroc employee stamping down on any negative feedback about a Ceroc weekend.

  17. #37
    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: Swish 2008 feedback

    Quote Originally Posted by sunnybunny View Post
    As has been said in a previous post, this weekend is quite different from the usual Pontin's weekenders. There were a lot of couples and groups there who were treating it as a nice weekend break away "with good food, nice accommodation, some other stuff to do, a dance workshop if we fancy it and some dancing in the evening". These are the people who would not go within a mile of a Pontins holiday camp who also represent the majority of Ceroc's customer base. There were also some "hard core" dance addicts.
    Very good point - that's probably why it sells out so quickly, and probably also why there's so little forumite / Swishite intersection.

    Possibly Swish-like events would be the way to go, if Ceroc HQ were purely interested in it as a business venture rather than a dance venture.

    Quote Originally Posted by sunnybunny View Post
    One of my highlights was a particularly scrummy sandwich at the bar pretty late on Sunday night / Monday morning !
    You're talking about food, right?
    Last edited by David Bailey; 21st-February-2008 at 08:20 PM.

  18. #38
    Registered User SilverFox's Avatar
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    Re: Swish 2008 feedback

    Quote Originally Posted by Cruella View Post
    But as 'staff' you will still be seen as a voice from Ceroc, rather than an ordinary punter. So no matter what you actually believe, it will still come across as a Ceroc employee stamping down on any negative feedback about a Ceroc weekend.
    So input from TwK or ZW or Dance Demon would come across as the voice of Jive Addiction?

  19. #39
    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: Swish 2008 feedback

    Quote Originally Posted by Cruella View Post
    But as 'staff' you will still be seen as a voice from Ceroc, rather than an ordinary punter. So no matter what you actually believe, it will still come across as a Ceroc employee stamping down on any negative feedback about a Ceroc weekend.
    I don't think SF was stamping down on anyone, bitchiness aside - he was just giving his impression of the event. As was Rocky.

    It's good to read everyone's feedback - I'd be interested in Marc and Rachel's comments - but anyone involved in organising it won't have a punters-eye view of the event, and that's the stuff I'm more interested in.

    Although I like "Voice from Ceroc" as a tagline, it's got a kind of Captain Scarlett "This is the voice of the Mysterons" imagery

  20. #40
    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: Swish 2008 feedback

    Quote Originally Posted by SilverFox View Post
    So input from TwK or ZW or Dance Demon would come across as the voice of Jive Addiction?
    To me, yes it would - as would input from Franck / Sheena about Blaze, or from Drathzel about NI events.

    "Voice of XYZ" is putting it too strongly, I agree - but organisers just don't see events the same way as punters do. That's all. No implication that organisers are deliberately "spinning", just that they have a different viewpoint to customers.

    Why's that a contentious thing to say?

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