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Thread: LEROC Trademark

  1. #61
    Registered User David Franklin's Avatar
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    Re: LEROC Trademark

    Quote Originally Posted by ducasi View Post
    Based on my reading of the trademark website, and this page, I'd say that Billy believes he has registered both his logos based on a capitalised "LEROC", plus the word itself. What I am unsure about is the capitalisation thing...
    Yes indeed. To my mind it's LeRoc, and Billy's captiaised logos just make me think "Ceroc wannabee" to be honest.

    I note on his own website the following, which I find interesting reading given current developments.

    Quote Originally Posted by http://www.leroc-scotland.co.uk/content/view/42/75/1/0/
    I trained in London with my first dance partner Jamielah Leek under the tuition of Roi Forbes from the LEROC Federation in '96', completed a teacher training course with Patrice Calleja, and Chris Chainey of Dance Star International Ltd in London in the summer of 96, I was the first ever Taxi Dancer in Glasgow with the Ceroc company from '95-96'.
    Before I opened a dance club in Glasgow, I looked at buying a dance franchise with Robert Austin of LeJive, and also James Cronin of Ceroc. I opted for LEROC and in '97'. I joined the LEROC Federation, and qualified as a teacher in the same year, Opened the first LEROC classes in Glasgow in September '97'.

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    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: LEROC Trademark

    This capitalisation nonsense gets on my nerves.

    I realise it's done for trademarking reasons (to provide a distinct identity), but it's just yukky from a readability prespective.

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    Re: LEROC Trademark

    Quote Originally Posted by David Franklin View Post
    I note on his own website the following, which I find interesting reading given current developments.
    Quote Originally Posted by [url=http://www.leroc-scotland.co.uk/content/view/42/75/1/0/
    ]LEROC[/url]
    I trained in London with my first dance partner Jamielah Leek under the tuition of Roi Forbes from the LEROC Federation in '96', completed a teacher training course with Patrice Calleja, and Chris Chainey of Dance Star International Ltd in London in the summer of 96, I was the first ever Taxi Dancer in Glasgow with the Ceroc company from '95-96'.
    Before I opened a dance club in Glasgow, I looked at buying a dance franchise with Robert Austin of LeJive, and also James Cronin of Ceroc. I opted for LEROC and in '97'. I joined the LEROC Federation, and qualified as a teacher in the same year, Opened the first LEROC classes in Glasgow in September '97'.

    Registering a Trade Mark in your own name for something that you joined years after it started and which has many established members, appears strange.

    Maybe he has the support of the LeRoc Federation, may be he hasn't. The Leroc Federation would be in a good position to oppose this if it thinks fit.

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    Re: LEROC Trademark

    Quote Originally Posted by Raul View Post

    Registering a Trade Mark in your own name for something that you joined years after it started and which has many established members, appears strange.

    Maybe he has the support of the LeRoc Federation, may be he hasn't. The Leroc Federation would be in a good position to oppose this if it thinks fit.
    This could be a good cause to gather together the users of the name "LeRoc". There is a public interest issue here if people can acquire rights to names on which others depend without even a basic enquiry being made, or any attempt to notify possible interested parties.

    I am thinking letters to the editor of national papers signed by a host of users, perhaps a petition. If LeRoc is a little known name then this is an opportunity to rectify that. It is also an opportunity to get a few more organisers to join the Federation. A common enemy is often good for rallying the people. A just cause and dancing girls is usually a good reason for a TV spot or two.

    A touch of nationalism might also be an asset. Should it be that easy to acquire the name "Scotland" as part of a business name?

  5. #65
    Not a spoon! Lou's Avatar
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    Re: LEROC Trademark

    This discussion has also been taking place on the Bristol forum. From his comments, I would say that John Eastman of The Federation takes a similar viewpoint to me. We're still waiting for Billy to clarify what exactly he's claiming to have Trademarked, particularly in view of Billy's claim on the front page of his site that he has the trademark "LEROC ®" - not just the logo.

    BTW.. I don't think he could claim Leroc Scotland as his own, either. But that's a whole different can of worms (that's probably the root behind this stupid situation )

    Any response yet, Billy?
    Last edited by Lou; 17th-February-2008 at 09:41 PM.

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    Re: LEROC Trademark

    Quote Originally Posted by Lou;453650.
    It's like someone saying that they've trademarked "SALSA" or "TANGO".
    TANGO is if fact a Trade mark

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    Re: LEROC Trademark

    Quote Originally Posted by David Franklin View Post
    Edit: what Lou said, only with less factual info.
    Now that's a first!

    Quote Originally Posted by philsmove View Post
    TANGO is if fact a Trade mark
    Oi! I've already congratulated you on that joke elsewhere!

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    Re: LEROC Trademark

    Quote Originally Posted by bigdjiver View Post
    Some people would have done this as quietly as possible so nobody had a chance to protest. At the very least this would have generated extra bad feeling.

    This way anybody who feels that the originators of the name wanted this to be a public domain name and are willing to act on that principle have a chance to do so.

    I would imagine that Chrisitne Keeble, who, as I recall, publishes a video using that name, and others that run classes under that banner, might at least object, and perhaps even counter-claim.

    This gives the trade-mark office a chance to decide if Leroc is trade-marketable. If it decides not, that should benefit everybody using the name. It will not then be possible for someone to do a sneaky application.

    Credit either way to Billy, market savvy with principles.

    Congrats to Billy for sparking off yet another hot debate guaranteed to raise heckles, eyebrows and blood pressure.
    Any attempt at activating a LeRoc trademark would be pointless and I presume Billy is spoofing. An attempt was once made at a trademark which failed utterly. One of the many reasons why it failed were that prior to the registration I and a bunch of other dance teachers had previously promoted LeRoc to several thousand dance teachers at Danceworld exhibitions at the Barbican, Olympia, Earls Court and Wembly.
    Next month I and a bunch of dance teachers will be promoting modern Jive LeRoc to about 20,000 people at Olympia – bringing new faces into clubs. It is not just my little old How To Jive Leroc Modern jive DVD that will be flying the flag. Over 25 independent clubs and organisations are joining forces to promote the dance.
    I don’t think Billy will be trying to stop us!
    Well done Billy

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    Re: LEROC Trademark

    Quote Originally Posted by Christine Keeble View Post
    Congrats to Billy for sparking off yet another hot debate guaranteed to raise heckles, eyebrows and blood pressure.
    Any attempt at activating a LeRoc trademark would be pointless and I presume Billy is spoofing. An attempt was once made at a trademark which failed utterly. One of the many reasons why it failed were that prior to the registration I and a bunch of other dance teachers had previously promoted LeRoc to several thousand dance teachers at Danceworld exhibitions at the Barbican, Olympia, Earls Court and Wembly.
    Next month I and a bunch of dance teachers will be promoting modern Jive LeRoc to about 20,000 people at Olympia – bringing new faces into clubs. It is not just my little old How To Jive Leroc Modern jive DVD that will be flying the flag. Over 25 independent clubs and organisations are joining forces to promote the dance.
    I don’t think Billy will be trying to stop us!
    Well done Billy
    I failed to scroll down on the link David James posted.

    Trade marks - find by number

    The trademarks are not applied for, they are registered, and I ( a layman)concur with the opinion that it is "only" a series of all capitals logos that are trademark protected.

  10. #70
    Forum Bombshell - Our Queen! Lory's Avatar
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    Re: LEROC Trademark

    So, what does it all mean

    Can someone explain to me, (in idiot speak) the implications of each scenario?

    I'd love to understand but I'm afraid its going over the top of my head
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  11. #71
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    Re: LEROC Trademark

    Quote Originally Posted by Lory View Post
    So, what does it all mean

    Can someone explain to me, (in idiot speak) the implications of each scenario?

    I'd love to understand but I'm afraid its going over the top of my head
    Basically, he hasn't really registered LeRoc, but he has registered LEROC as a logo

    Due to whats known as established prior use he'd have trouble enforcing any infringement on the word leroc - and due to his registering a logo so similar to ceroc's - and catchphrase, any judge is likely to throw it of of court should he ever bother to try and enforce it !
    Last edited by Robin; 18th-February-2008 at 10:35 AM. Reason: added more

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    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: LEROC Trademark

    Quote Originally Posted by Lory View Post
    So, what does it all mean

    Can someone explain to me, (in idiot speak) the implications of each scenario?

    I'd love to understand but I'm afraid its going over the top of my head
    I think it means that the "logos" are trademarked, rather than the word itself.

    So, if someone uses the word combined with the design, then presumably that's an infringement of trademark.

    But if someone uses the word by itself, without the CAPITALISATION or the design, then presumably that's not an infringement.

    Errr.... I think.

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    Re: LEROC Trademark

    Quote Originally Posted by Christine Keeble View Post
    Any attempt at activating a LeRoc trademark would be pointless and I presume Billy is spoofing.
    Ah.. now maybe if Billy had tried to trademark "pointless spoofing" instead, he'd have had better luck?

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    Re: LEROC Trademark

    Quote Originally Posted by Lory View Post
    So, what does it all mean

    Can someone explain to me, (in idiot speak) the implications of each scenario?

    I'd love to understand but I'm afraid its going over the top of my head
    You can display a "Beware of the dog" sign with very little dog, or no dog at all.

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    Re: LEROC Trademark

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    I think it means that the "logos" are trademarked, rather than the word itself.

    So, if someone uses the word combined with the design, then presumably that's an infringement of trademark.

    But if someone uses the word by itself, without the CAPITALISATION or the design, then presumably that's not an infringement.

    Errr.... I think.
    And I disagree – based on Billy's claims and my reading of other trademark entries – I think he has trademarked both the word LEROC (without any particular capitalisation,) and the specific logo designs.
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    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: LEROC Trademark

    Quote Originally Posted by ducasi View Post
    And I disagree – based on Billy's claims and my reading of other trademark entries – I think he has trademarked both the word XXXX (without any particular capitalisation,) and the specific logo designs.
    You realise you owe him 10p now

    Does that mean if anyone uses The L Word from now on, they're breaking copyright?

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    Re: LEROC Trademark

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    You realise you owe him 10p now

    Does that mean if anyone uses The L Word from now on, they're breaking copyright?
    I thought you could always use a copyrighted word as long as a) you use the copyright symbol, b) you attribute ownership to the copyright owner and c) you don't try and pass off any link to the copyright owner - ie use the brand as any form other than a description - ie an IBM© compatible pc does not imply any links to IBM, simply a description of type of computer

    (IBM is a registered trademark of International Business Machines, sublicensed to Lenovo of China!)

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    Re: LEROC Trademark

    Quote Originally Posted by bigdjiver View Post
    You can display a "Beware of the dog" sign with very little dog, or no dog at all.


    or the dog belonging to your neighbours!

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    Re: LEROC Trademark

    Quote Originally Posted by Robin View Post
    Basically, he hasn't really registered LeRoc, but he has registered LEROC as a logo
    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    I think it means that the "logos" are trademarked, rather than the word itself.
    Quote Originally Posted by ducasi View Post
    And I disagree
    So basically, no ones 100% sure about anything?

    I don't feel quite so thick now!

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    You realise you owe him 10p now
    I wonder if he'll sue?

    So. let me get this right..

    If its just the Logo, which is 'leroc' written in capitals, there's nothing to stop anyone using any other combination of lettering in their advertising literature, apart from the ones he's registered?

    And if they did, it would be up to Billy, to first spot it and then pursue legal action against them, which as pointed out in a previous post, would cost in excess of £400?

    If as Ducasi said, he now owns the generic name. Would this now mean that nobody could use the word leroc, in any letter combination on their advertising literature from now on?

    What is he hoping to gain from this?

    What is the optimum out come Billy can achieve from this action?

    And lastly, what are the repercussions of using the name, for existing historic 'user's' in the future?
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    Re: LEROC Trademark

    of course if in doubt, you can use LE ROC as its perfectly acceptable French Unless Billy has trademarked "a space"tm

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