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Thread: FOR CRYING OUT LOUD! (more religion)

  1. #21
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    Re: FOR CRYING OUT LOUD! (more religion)

    Quote Originally Posted by Isis View Post
    No. Week by week the positive, calm, tolerant attitude of the enlightened, spiritual forumites is having a good influence on you and you are gradually learning to make sensible, logical posts, inviting discussion rather than hysterical rantings about religious cretins.
    I've always made sensible, logical posts. Calling complete donkeys 'cretins' is not hysterical ranting!!

    (Note: I have never called any forumites 'cretins', the word was used to describe a dishonest bunch of american creationist proselytisers. Just in case there are lurkers who might acquire a wrong impression...)

  2. #22
    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: FOR CRYING OUT LOUD! (more religion)

    Quote Originally Posted by stewart38 View Post
    So its ok to make some money out of 'them' but not let 'them' have some say in 'divorce laws'.
    As with the fluoride-in-the-water thing, there's a difference between commercial choice and state-sponsored mandatory legal framework. Comparing one with the other is like comparing oranges and stiletto shoes.

    As for Sharia itself, I'd strongly recommend idiots like Williams read this Judgement from the European Court of Human Rights.

    Specifically, this part:
    .. the Court found that sharia was incompatible with the fundamental principles of democracy as set forth in the Convention. It considered that “sharia, which faithfully reflects the dogmas and divine rules laid down by religion, is stable and invariable. Principles such as pluralism in the political sphere or the constant evolution of public freedoms have no place in it". According to the Court, it was difficult to declare one’s respect for democracy and human rights while at the same time supporting a regime based on sharia, which clearly diverged from Convention values, particularly with regard to its criminal law and criminal procedure, its rules on the legal status of women and the way it intervened in all spheres of private and public life in accordance with religious precepts.
    (Caro will like it, there's a French translation also )

  3. #23
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    Re: FOR CRYING OUT LOUD! (more religion)

    Quote Originally Posted by stewart38 View Post
    So its ok to make some money out of 'them' but not let 'them' have some say in 'divorce laws'.

    Did you read the whole article or just take Barry's rant on it ?

    ps whats wrong in letting people bank how they like ?

    If a million pixies want to deposit turnips and a bank agreed to it and made 'money' whats wrong with that ?? Im sorry its racial intolerance
    I'll pause between the words, so you can follow.

    ISLAM

    IS

    NOT

    A

    RACE

    IT'S

    A

    RELIGION.

    Intolerance of islam might be something offensive, but it isn't racism.

    Islamic banking, in any event, is a racket. Islam does not forbid lending money at interest, it forbids usury, which is excessive profiting by the lending of money at interest.

    If, at any stage, a moslem wishes to bank on sharia terms, providing it does not contravene the banking laws of this country, that's fine. That isn't the issue here, it's the question of whether it is even rational to suggest that we should try to encompass two different legal systems in one country.

    There is, of course, an existing solution for anyone in Britain who would prefer to live under the umbrella of sharia law.

  4. #24
    Commercial Operator Rocky's Avatar
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    Re: FOR CRYING OUT LOUD! (more religion)

    Anyone remember this, posted 7 days ago...

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Shnikov View Post
    Re: More religious problems.... I foreswore creating new threads, I really did......
    Oh, and how could we cope with a Barry thread without him being rude and insulting to someone who disagrees with him..

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Shnikov View Post
    I'll pause between the words, so you can follow.
    Last edited by Rocky; 7th-February-2008 at 05:12 PM.

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    Re: FOR CRYING OUT LOUD! (more religion)

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    As with the fluoride-in-the-water thing, there's a difference between commercial choice and state-sponsored mandatory legal framework. Comparing one with the other is like comparing oranges and stiletto shoes.

    As for Sharia itself, I'd strongly recommend idiots like Williams read this Judgement from the European Court of Human Rights.

    Specifically, this part:


    (Caro will like it, there's a French translation also )
    Thanks for posting that, DS. I was going to look for it later. Saved me the bother.

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    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: FOR CRYING OUT LOUD! (more religion)

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Shnikov View Post
    Thanks for posting that, DS. I was going to look for it later. Saved me the bother.
    Oi, stop confusing me with the Blue One!

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    Commercial Operator Rocky's Avatar
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    Re: FOR CRYING OUT LOUD! (more religion)

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    Oi, stop confusing me with the Blue One!
    Fancy confusing you with his man servant and 1 person fan club.... shocking. (Correction... 2 person fan club, if you include Batnurse..)

  8. #28
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    Re: FOR CRYING OUT LOUD! (more religion)

    Quote Originally Posted by stewart38 View Post
    Did you read the whole article or just take Barry's rant on it ?
    me, reading ? na, I'm just Barry's little puppy. Waf, waf*.

    *For the sake of international canine multiculturalism respect, let me add that an English puppy might say: woof, woof.

    Quote Originally Posted by stewart38 View Post
    1. So its ok to make some money out of 'them' but not let 'them' have some say in 'divorce laws'.

    2. ps whats wrong in letting people bank how they like ?

    3. If a million pixies want to deposit turnips and a bank agreed to it and made 'money' whats wrong with that ?? 4. Im sorry its racial intolerance
    you really don't get it, do you ?

    1. duh, yes, absolutely. As long as business complies with laws of the country it's made in... i.e. I'm not aware of any law that would make the removal of interest rates unlawful, so if that's an obstacle for doing business with certain peeps because of whatever belief they have, then get rid of it and find other ways to make money that suits them.

    2. see 1

    3. see 1

    4. I'm sorry this is non-sensical. Unless pixies are a race I am not aware of ? At best this is mythical intolerance. As for islam, please note it is a religion, not a race.

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    As with the fluoride-in-the-water thing, there's a difference between commercial choice and state-sponsored mandatory legal framework. Comparing one with the other is like comparing oranges and stiletto shoes.
    , thank you

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    Re: FOR CRYING OUT LOUD! (more religion)

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    Oi, stop confusing me with the Blue One!
    Oops! Slip. It's not as if the 's' and 'j' keys are very close, either

  10. #30
    Registered User stewart38's Avatar
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    Re: FOR CRYING OUT LOUD! (more religion)

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Shnikov View Post

    Intolerance of islam might be something offensive, but it isn't racism.
    I forgot about your take on religion

    The Archbishop of Canterbury

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Shnikov View Post

    My comment?

    Shut up.

    Eff off.

    Stick to magic, wine and biscuits and leave important things like this to people who know what they're talking about.
    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Shnikov View Post

    Islamic banking, in any event, is a racket. Islam does not forbid lending money at interest, it forbids usury, which is excessive profiting by the lending of money at interest.



    Northern Rock made far too much money out of me , we have ombudsman for that , they have Islam so what ?


    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Shnikov View Post

    There is, of course, an existing solution for anyone in Britain who would prefer to live under the umbrella of sharia law.
    What fu** off home to where you belong

  11. #31
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    Re: FOR CRYING OUT LOUD! (more religion)

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    As with the fluoride-in-the-water thing, there's a difference between commercial choice and state-sponsored mandatory legal framework. Comparing one with the other is like comparing oranges and stiletto shoes.
    But we CAN compare oranges and stlilettos.. they are both difficult to walk on if you strap them to your feet... they can both be used in sexual acts to heighten orgasm... they can both be used as a receptacle for champagne... they can both be used as weapons.... etc. etc.

  12. #32
    Registered User stewart38's Avatar
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    Re: FOR CRYING OUT LOUD! (more religion)

    Quote Originally Posted by Caro View Post
    me,
    1. duh, yes, absolutely. As long as business complies with laws of the country it's made in... i.e. I'm not aware of any law that would make the removal of interest rates unlawful,
    Let me take a wild guess here, i maybe wrong

    If the UK goverment allowed

    For example, Muslims could choose to have marital disputes or financial matters dealt with in a Sharia court.

    It might just make it 'lawful' in the UK, do you follow ?

    so what are you against is 'them' having different laws

    Not the fact that they wouldn't be lawful

    ps i havent a clue if im in favour of that or not its just point thats been raised

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    Re: FOR CRYING OUT LOUD! (more religion)

    Quote Originally Posted by stewart38 View Post
    so what are you against is 'them' having different laws
    It's simple really. As I've said earlier (did you read it?) there is a fundamental principle in justice:

    ONE COUNTRY: ONE SET OF LAWS THAT APPLIES TO ALL.

    No difference on any grounds: not because of social status, sexual orientation, disability, religious beliefs, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by stewart38 View Post
    do you follow ?
    Occasionally, yes. Hell, I've even followed you.

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    Re: FOR CRYING OUT LOUD! (more religion)

    Quote Originally Posted by stewart38 View Post
    Let me take a wild guess here, i maybe wrong

    If the UK goverment allowed

    For example, Muslims could choose to have marital disputes or financial matters dealt with in a Sharia court.

    It might just make it 'lawful' in the UK, do you follow ?

    so what are you against is 'them' having different laws

    Not the fact that they wouldn't be lawful

    ps i havent a clue if im in favour of that or not its just point thats been raised
    It wouldn't be workable. What happens when a muslim and non-muslim have to take something to court - the muslim may only want to use sharia law, whilst the other person wants standard UK law? And even between muslims, if someone didn't like the answer they got, chances are they would try and challenge it in a traditional UK court. It'd be chaos!

    I suspect that there are plenty of muslims living in this country who wouldn't welcome the introduction of sharia law either. The moderate ones who quite like living here because of the tolerant society we have... which with this sort of thing could become a lot less tolerant.

    btw - if we do wind up with sharia law being "included" on the statute books, what about the legal systems of any jew or hindus. It could go on forever...

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    Re: FOR CRYING OUT LOUD! (more religion)

    Quote Originally Posted by Twirly View Post
    It wouldn't be workable. What happens when a muslim and non-muslim have to take something to court - the muslim may only want to use sharia law, whilst the other person wants standard UK law? And even between muslims, if someone didn't like the answer they got, chances are they would try and challenge it in a traditional UK court. It'd be chaos!

    I suspect that there are plenty of muslims living in this country who wouldn't welcome the introduction of sharia law either. The moderate ones who quite like living here because of the tolerant society we have... which with this sort of thing could become a lot less tolerant.

    btw - if we do wind up with sharia law being "included" on the statute books, what about the legal systems of any jew or hindus. It could go on forever...
    Im not in favour of it , just felt that a open debate should be had rather then the send them all home type (id only send 50% home)



    Quote Originally Posted by Caro View Post
    ONE COUNTRY: ONE SET OF LAWS THAT APPLIES TO ALL.

    No difference on any grounds: not because of social status, sexual orientation, disability, religious beliefs, etc.


    Scotland has a number of different laws to England but we seem to still get on, why not Ealing etc ?

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    Re: FOR CRYING OUT LOUD! (more religion)

    Quote Originally Posted by stewart38 View Post


    Scotland has a number of different laws to England but we seem to still get on, why not Ealing etc ?
    Are you trying to get yourself stoned Stewart? In case you hadn't noticed, Scotland is another country!

    Makes me think of Passport to Pimlico

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    Re: FOR CRYING OUT LOUD! (more religion)

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky View Post
    well, apart from the obviously ridiculous punishments and the religious nature of some of them, the main elements would get my vote (if I voted..)

    Hand amputation for thieves - absolutely.
    Flogging for rape offenders and child abusers - absolutely.

    Might solve the escalating crime rates in this Country.. what do you think?
    And what would your suggestion be if someone had been wrongly convicted? Sewing the hand back on?

  18. #38
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    Re: FOR CRYING OUT LOUD! (more religion)

    Quote Originally Posted by stewart38 View Post
    IScotland has a number of different laws to England but we seem to still get on, why not Ealing etc ?
    They do have different laws in Ealing - they're called bylaws.

    But all UK laws - e.g. Scottish law - are still subordinate to the European Court of Human Rights. Even an independent Scotland would be also.

    Sharia - apart from the obvious issues regarding church and state - as I've demonstrated, is incompatible with that system, so it's a dumb idea.

    From a practical (!) perspective, the UK would need to leave Europe before it could be implemented. And whilst the image of the UK Independence Party forming an alliance with radical islamists is quite amusing, I can't see it happening somehow.

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    Re: FOR CRYING OUT LOUD! (more religion)

    Quote Originally Posted by batnurse View Post
    And what would your suggestion be if someone had been wrongly convicted? Sewing the hand back on?
    I see from your quote of Rocky that not only is he very confused about science and religion but appears to be equally ill-informed about law and order policy and social policy.

    Hey, Rocky. How's it going?

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    Re: FOR CRYING OUT LOUD! (more religion)

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Shnikov View Post

    Hey, Rocky. How's it going?
    can't you see he's just trolling ?

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