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Thread: Aliens vs a Higher Power!

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    Teacher Paul F's Avatar
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    Aliens vs a Higher Power!

    I was sat watching 'Signs' the other night (the Mel Gibson film).

    The film portrays an disgruntled reverand who has left the faith due to certain circumstances. The film also depicts the existence of alien life forms.

    Well, this got me thinking.

    A while ago a thread asked about people's beliefs in a "higher power", for want of a better term, i.e. God in it's different forms.

    I was wondering if, should the existence of extra terrestrial life be proved, would this completely shatter religion in all it's forms?

    Now Im not talking about finding an Ameoba on Mars. That is too easy for the average person to dismiss as nonsense or not important enough. Im talking about actual visits from alien life forms on a global scale. Typical of any kind of sci-fi film.

    Now Im not particularly religious so I cant comment but I wondered if there were any writings that could stand up to such an occurence or whether that would be it. End of religion?

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    Re: Aliens vs a Higher Power!

    Subject of many s-f stories and a theme in many more.

    One of the best is James Blish's award-winning A case of conscience. IIRC John Varley's Gaea trilogy deals with it. There's also a novel - and I'm struggling to remember what it was - where the arrival of intelligent aliens causes a massive schism between those believers who believe that conventional religion can incorporate them as co-evals with man, and those who believe that they must be demons.

    Of course, Scientologists already believe in aliens...

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    Re: Aliens vs a Higher Power!

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Shnikov View Post
    Of course, Scientologists already believe in aliens...
    Believe in aliens? You make it sound like there is a choice. Are you saying you don't believe.

    Surely it's a case of whether you believe aliens have already visted earth or not. You can't doubt the actual existance of them can you?

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    Re: Aliens vs a Higher Power!

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul F View Post
    I was sat watching 'Signs' the other night (the Mel Gibson film).

    The film portrays an disgruntled reverand who has left the faith due to certain circumstances. The film also depicts the existence of alien life forms.

    Well, this got me thinking.

    A while ago a thread asked about people's beliefs in a "higher power", for want of a better term, i.e. God in it's different forms.

    I was wondering if, should the existence of extra terrestrial life be proved, would this completely shatter religion in all it's forms?

    Now Im not talking about finding an Ameoba on Mars. That is too easy for the average person to dismiss as nonsense or not important enough. Im talking about actual visits from alien life forms on a global scale. Typical of any kind of sci-fi film.

    Now Im not particularly religious so I cant comment but I wondered if there were any writings that could stand up to such an occurence or whether that would be it. End of religion?

    The film was so so but it gave me a new tag line

    I think if the new higher power got the circle line running like a half decent service most would easiliy believe/convert

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    Re: Aliens vs a Higher Power!

    Quote Originally Posted by Double Trouble View Post
    Believe in aliens? You make it sound like there is a choice. Are you saying you don't believe.

    Surely it's a case of whether you believe aliens have already visted earth or not. You can't doubt the actual existance of them can you?
    There are people out there who believe the earth is flat. Not believing in aliens is childs play compared to that...

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    Re: Aliens vs a Higher Power!

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul F View Post
    I was sat watching 'Signs' the other night (the Mel Gibson film).
    poor you

    I was wondering if, should the existence of extra terrestrial life be proved, would this completely shatter religion in all it's forms?
    Why would it ? People with faith have knowledge enough to maintain that faith, it takes a lot for something to supplant it. It happens of course, but as our reality is subject to our own dodgy human perception, some people will maintain their beliefs, and even if the perfect proof came along they would deny it .

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    Re: Aliens vs a Higher Power!

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul F View Post
    ...I was wondering if, should the existence of extra terrestrial life be proved.. ... End of religion?
    No, the start of us adopting theirs.

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    Re: Aliens vs a Higher Power!

    I'm with DS. Watch how quickly the faith-heads would find ancient predictions of aliens within the pages of the Old Testament. The Tower of Babel, of course, was merely the very first multi-stage rocket gantry, which was built by humans to enable the aliens to get back into orbit...

    As for 'believing in aliens', we get into all sorts of time dilation problems.

    Rephrase the question as 'do I believe in the existence of aliens at a similar or more advanced stage of development to ourselves and within a practical distance from earth?' and my answer is definitely 'no'. If there were, we would be drenched with their radio signals by now. Alien versions of Flywheel, Shyster and Flywheel, the Goons, Coronation Street and, god help them, Big Brother.

    Is there a life-form species in a galaxy several million light years away at this moment in time? Possibly. But will we ever interact with them? No.

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    Re: Aliens vs a Higher Power!

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Shnikov View Post
    As for 'believing in aliens', we get into all sorts of time dilation problems.

    Rephrase the question as 'do I believe in the existence of aliens at a similar or more advanced stage of development to ourselves and within a practical distance from earth?' and my answer is definitely 'no'. If there were, we would be drenched with their radio signals by now. Alien versions of Flywheel, Shyster and Flywheel, the Goons, Coronation Street and, god help them, Big Brother.

    Is there a life-form species in a galaxy several million light years away at this moment in time? Possibly. But will we ever interact with them? No.
    Agree here but cant follow the time dilation bit

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    Re: Aliens vs a Higher Power!

    Quote Originally Posted by stewart38 View Post
    Agree here but cant follow the time dilation bit
    Sorry chum.

    What I meant by that is this.

    Take a galaxy a million light years away. In one sense, what happens there 'now' will take a million years to reach us - at the speed of light. There could be 'now' an intelligent race there which is broadcasting electromagnetic radiation just as we are; but we wouldn't know until the radiation reached us.

    In another (perhaps more meaningful) sense, what happened there a million years ago is what we are experiencing now (e.g. the explosion of a supernova) and so that's a different 'now'.

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    Re: Aliens vs a Higher Power!

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul F View Post
    I was wondering if, should the existence of extra terrestrial life be proved, would this completely shatter religion in all it's forms?
    Nope - I'm not aware of any religons that state God only created life here.

    The existence of aliens doesn't mean that God didn't create them.

    StarGate both the film and tv series considered aliens posing as gods a lot.

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    Re: Aliens vs a Higher Power!

    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost View Post
    StarGate both the film and tv series considered aliens posing as gods a lot.
    Perhaps it's time for a story the other way around..

    Mulder-like-scientific-character "Look alien space craft hovering over the sea of Galilee."

    Scully-like-scientific-yet-religious-type-character "No it's Just Jesus walking on water again.. that light's not an alien spacecraft.. that's his divine aura radiating from his halo!"

    Maybe all these mysterious UFO sightings are actually bored god(s) and other heavenly hosts buzzing earth?

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    Re: Aliens vs a Higher Power!

    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost View Post
    Nope - I'm not aware of any religons that state God only created life here.

    The existence of aliens doesn't mean that God didn't create them.

    StarGate both the film and tv series considered aliens posing as gods a lot.
    Go on then, take the challenge.

    Explain how sentient life elsewhere in the universe can be incorporated into christian theology.

    Um - how would they learn about the Ten Commandments and Jesus, for a start off? Would they be bound by the decisions of the Council of Nicaea? If it turns out that they don't have their own Moses, David, Solomon, Jesus, Paul and Augustus, will every alien-jack of them be damned until the first one sets foot on earth?

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    Re: Aliens vs a Higher Power!

    I think this calls for a new cross-over movie – Alien vs Bruce Almighty. Coming to a cinema near you soon!
    Let your mind go and your body will follow. – Steve Martin, LA Story

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    Re: Aliens vs a Higher Power!

    Quote Originally Posted by ducasi View Post
    I think this calls for a new cross-over movie – Alien vs Bruce Almighty. Coming to a cinema near you soon!
    Couldn't rep you! Small slice of brilliance.

    How about - Jesus vs the Predator? (or is that too bad taste?)

    What script conferences that would involve...

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    Re: Aliens vs a Higher Power!

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Shnikov View Post
    Go on then, take the challenge.

    Explain how sentient life elsewhere in the universe can be incorporated into christian theology.
    He's absolutely right !! There are no religions that specifically state that God only created life here.

    There is also nowhere in any scripture that mentions DVDs, Space Flight or The Spice Girls. Which leads me to one obvious conclusion; the rapture has already happened, we weren't taken up, and we are all in hell.

    I find I quite like it though.

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    Re: Aliens vs a Higher Power!

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadful Scathe View Post
    He's absolutely right !! There are no religions that specifically state that God only created life here.

    There is also nowhere in any scripture that mentions DVDs, Space Flight or The Spice Girls. Which leads me to one obvious conclusion; the rapture has already happened, we weren't taken up, and we are all in hell.

    I find I quite like it though.
    ...as long as there is dancing.

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    Re: Aliens vs a Higher Power!

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Shnikov View Post
    Is there a life-form species in a galaxy several million light years away at this moment in time? Possibly. But will we ever interact with them? No.
    Considering the scale of the universe we live in, and what a tiny, insignificant part of it our solar system represents, I honestly find it unlikely in the extreme that the conditions which caused life to appear on this planet would not have occurred many many times elsewhere.

    In other words, I think there's almost certainly a whole lot of other planets out there with intelligent life on them.

    But I do agree with you that there's virtually no chance of us ever actually encountering any of 'em...

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    Re: Aliens vs a Higher Power!

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Shnikov View Post
    Rephrase the question as 'do I believe in the existence of aliens at a similar or more advanced stage of development to ourselves and within a practical distance from earth?' and my answer is definitely 'no'. If there were, we would be drenched with their radio signals by now. Alien versions of Flywheel, Shyster and Flywheel, the Goons, Coronation Street and, god help them, Big Brother.
    The alien civilisation would have to be significantly more advanced than our own to do this: there's an article on Space.com about Listening for ET's Television, which explains the difficulties. Seth also makes a significant point:

    Quote Originally Posted by Seth Shostak
    But there's another point, and one that's possibly of greater significance. The whole idea of television broadcasting may be pass� for the aliens. Consider: how do you pick up your daily dose of boob-tube fodder? With a rooftop antenna strapped to your chimney? Probably not. You most likely get your TV via a cable, fiber optic, or direct broadcast satellite dish. The powerful television transmitters on the hills outside town are going to vanish in the next few decades. They likely vanished long ago on ET's world.
    Also regarding your question: unless there are intelligent aliens within our Solar System, none of them are going to be "a practical distance from Earth". Even our furthest out space probe, Voyager 1, has travelled only 1/2500th of the way to even the nearest star (which it's not aimed at anyway).

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    Re: Aliens vs a Higher Power!

    Quote Originally Posted by Stuart M View Post
    Even our furthest out space probe, Voyager 1, has travelled only 1/2500th of the way to even the nearest star (which it's not aimed at anyway).
    I know... at this rate I'll never be able to thumb a lift home

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