Rating a class

[DundeeDancer]

What do people think the measurements would be for rating how good an individual Ceroc Class/Session has been?

I think marking it out of 10 would not be precise enough as there are lots of variables to consider and how many points each item should be awarded is quite tricky to.

I'm thinking about this because our Ceroc teacher at my local venue has asked for feedback on the new class style, which I find a big improvement on the last set of classes.

So I would like to give some meaningful feedback and would probably like to do so on a regular bases through the forum. That way hopefully the classes will keep improving or maintain a high standard and not slip back to the frustrating classes they had last year.


A quick stab of the things I value in a class would be :-

Dance floor............................................. .....................20

General environment (Air conditioning/music etc) .................15

Complexity of moves set at right level for class............20

Moves suitable for leading non-partners in freestyle....15

Quality of instruction given.......................................15

How fun the teacher makes the class.....................15

.................................................. ................. Total 100


PS I'm looking at this from a beginners/intermediate perspective and not an advance dancer that doesn't use moves.


One of the biggest frustrations I and a few others have had were the new moves we were learning were very difficult to lead someone who had not done the class that night and who was not your regular partner.



Cheers, DD .

[killingtime]

I'm thinking about this because our Ceroc teacher at my local venue has asked for feedback on the new class style, which I find a big improvement on the last set of classes.

Is this at Edinburgh? Are we leading a new way forward? I didn't attend the class on Thursday (hotshot!) so I might of missed something. How does it differ from last year?

So I would like to give some meaningful feedback and would probably like to do so on a regular bases through the forum.

I'm a bit confused of what you are trying to measure as a metric though:

Dance floor.....................20

Surely if it is the same venue then this (unless they clean/don't clean their floors leading to lots of variation) will be fairly static and doesn't really make as much difference in a class context as it does in freestyle.

General environment (Air conditioning/music etc) .................15

Is this music for the class or for the whole evening, ditto for the environment? If freestyle I'd say the music plays a much larger part than just part of the "environment" (if we aren't just talking volume level). Even in the class tailoring the music can make all the difference.

Complexity of moves set at right level for class............20

I'd say that's more "Right set for me"; it also fails to capture if they are too easy or too difficult for the person answering (if we are trying to apply this for a general case).

Moves suitable for leading non-partners in freestyle....15

This only applies to leads then?

In most cases I'd say having a fixed scale and, if desired, weighting the answers afterward is better than having a variable scale

[Steven666]

Advanced dancers do use moves. They just don't like to think so.

Nice idea though.

[David Bailey]

There's a couple of other relevant threads that may be of use:
http://www.cerocscotland.com/forum/l...ook-venue.html
and
http://www.cerocscotland.com/forum/i...-teaching.html
- from the latter, it looks like "good communication of the moves" is most higly-rated.

[DundeeDancer]

Thanks Mr James for those links, just spent an hour overlooking them and they gave me some useful insight and filled my head with even more questions that it now hurts.

I'm starting to think rating a class isn't a great idea but maybe an anonymous comment box at the venue might be.

Thanks for your input as well KillingTime

I'm having a re-think and maybe I was trying to do to much under one banner.

How to give feedback to teachers on how you enjoyed the class.

(From where I am currently with my dancing it's all about the moves and whether I can use them in freestyle successfully, usually the more simpler the move the more fun I have with them later on in freestyle)

Also thinking ahead how can we give feedback on how we feel about the new venue when it comes along. I've kind of grown attached to Marco's.

On Thursday they mentioned something along the following lines that they are going to trial for the intermediate class:-
1. One variation on a beginners move
2. One of the standard 25 intermediate moves
3. Another move probably an advanced move

Sounds like there is something in there for all levels and I really enjoyed last weeks class so I'm full of optimism for the new year.

[Jamie]

On Thursday they mentioned something along the following lines that they are going to trial for the intermediate class:-
1. One variation on a beginners move
2. One of the standard 25 intermediate moves
3. Another move probably an advanced move

Sounds like there is something in there for all levels and I really enjoyed last weeks class so I'm full of optimism for the new year.

That's been the format for a number of years (so I've been told), it's definately been the standard format for the past 6 months I've been teaching Ceroc!

[David Bailey]

I'm starting to think rating a class isn't a great idea but maybe an anonymous comment box at the venue might be.

There's a whole field of study relating to gaining feedback, as part of customer service - if you want to learn more, maybe have a look at places like the ICS.

A suggestion box - well, generally people simply don't bother using them in my experience. It might work, but you'd need to actively promote it somehow. Hmmm, you could offer incentives / rewards, but then the suggestions wouldn't be anonymous.

The only active promotion of feedback I've seen in Ceroc is a few years back in Ashtons - bobgadget (the DJ then) used to play a couple of new tracks, and then ask people to rate those tracks - he usually asked people to come along and tick the "good / bad" box.

It's very tricky to get feedback anywhere - people just don't want to do it. And especially
from a leisure activity, no-one wants to fill in a form when they could be dancing.

It's probably easier to get verbal feedback, possibly via taxi dancers. On the other hand, organisers generally take written feedback seriously, and ignore verbal feedback. So it's a tricky one...

[killingtime]

How to give feedback to teachers on how you enjoyed the class.

A comment box does seem like a good idea to me and I doubt they'll be so flooded by comments that they'd need to worry. Otherwise it's probably easy enough to give positive feedback to their face (though I get that has no written record then) or maybe negative feedback to the venue manager.

On Thursday they mentioned something along the following lines that they are going to trial for the intermediate class:-
1. One variation on a beginners move
2. One of the standard 25 intermediate moves
3. Another move probably an advanced move

They don't always stick to that format but they've done it in times past (when I was a lad, yada yada). I think it's a really good format. The variation of the beginners move is great for early intermediates. I'm not entirely convinced about the second point and I'd say that having "one of the standard moves or a slight variation there of" is probably better and finally have the "advanced move" for people who have been at the class a while makes sense (though, as has been mentioned before, putting the tough move at the end gives people less time to learn it).

I do think more emphasis should be put on the fact that intermediates should just try and work on what they are comfortable with. If you've just started (and it is a scary jump going from beginners to intermediates with a leap in move complexity and losing taxi dancer support) then maybe just focus on the first move. Not to say that when I moved to intermediate I didn't try and make notes on learning all the moves but it probably meant I was rubbish at lots of moves rather than better at a few.

That's been the format for a number of years (so I've been told), it's definately been the standard format for the past 6 months I've been teaching Ceroc!

We can be a bit slow in Edinburgh .

[tsh]

Maybe a good way to get feedback is to ask specific people - and it's probably better if the person doing the asking isn't the teacher. Not only does this give you some input, it also gives the impression that you are interested in the answers. Rating the class and the freestyle independently would make sense...

Sean

[ducasi]

That's been the format for a number of years (so I've been told), it's definately been the standard format for the past 6 months I've been teaching Ceroc!

Isn't the normal format 4 moves, rather than just three?

[David Bailey]

Maybe a good way to get feedback is to ask specific people - and it's probably better if the person doing the asking isn't the teacher. Not only does this give you some input, it also gives the impression that you are interested in the answers. Rating the class and the freestyle independently would make sense...

Wasn't there some franchise (Surrey?) looking for "mystery shoppers" a while back?

I dimly recall hearing / reading something about that - and that's the only way I can envisage actually getting some real structured feedback.

[killingtime]

We can be a bit slow in Edinburgh .

Isn't the normal format 4 moves, rather than just three?

[jeanie]

Have been bullied into writing something here (yes you know who you are...)

I can't really rate the venues I go to as such as I like them both for different reasons.

The Invercarse is good as the floor is bigger than the Friary but then I quite like the smallness of the Frairy too.
The floor is better/smoother at the Invercarse so I can spin a whole lot better there
The Frairy doesn't need air conditioning as it takes about 2 hours to warm up, cardigans are an essential part of dance kit there!
Music is good at both venues, so no complaints
But because I started at the Friary and went there more than the Invercarse, I do prefer the Friary overall and you don't need binoculers (how do you spell that word!) to see if there are any spare men across the dance floor

Is that enough DD or would you like more

[DundeeDancer]

Is that enough DD or would you like more

Thanks Jeanie, that's an interesting insight into the Dundee venues but I think it would have been better placed on the "Feedback on Club nights" thread.

What I was trying to do with this thread and not being successfully by the looks of things was get an idea on how to Judge how effective a class has been for a dancer that night i.e. Have they learned anything new in the class? Has the teacher made the class fun for them? Has the rotation of the class been well managed? Are the moves useful for he person doing the class?

Then once you decided how the class was for you, what would be the best way to give your feedback to the trainer, who normally likes to know if there class has been a success or not in the eyes of the students.

When I first started the thread I thought it would be a good idea to get a list of things then write on the forum what that nights class was like. But then I read a few other threads on here and it put me more in the shoes of the teachers. Meaning if I was a trainer how would I feel about somebody commenting on a public forum about how my class had went, seeing how I frequently get "Constructive" feedback myself, I thought getting that in public would not be the best.

Then I thought about why not just go chat to the trainer. Well the venue is fairly noisy, the trainer is normally distracted with people asking them questions and generally it's a bit awkward.

Then I thought what about an anonymous comment box but then thats a hassle for someone to lug in every week for the possibility that someone might make a comment once every two months. So thats not a great solution either.

So now I'm thinking if I do ever feel the need to give some of my glorious feedback then I'll put it into a Personal Message or e-mail (don't think my local trainers are on the forum though, maybe they are lurking?) or I'll type it up in a little letter and then ask them very nicely to look over some of my comments and let me know there thoughts in return once they have given it some consideration.

Damn, got so engrossed in writing this thread I've went and burnt my dinner

DD.

[jeanie]

Ah you see I was confused by your scoring system. I didn't know if it was 20/20 or 20/25.

But you're right if they are looking for feedback, it probably best done from your own perspective (i.e not what you have heard people saying) and put it in written form as they may forget a valid point you have made. Also they can then come back to you and discuss further any improvements on your points.

[2leftfeet]

Well DD just returned home from the Tuesday class at Marco's in Edinburgh and what a great night.
Using your scoring system 85 out of 100.
Great instruction, moves complicated but simple if you can work that out. Company was great, only let down by venue, however its closing and will look forward to a new location sometime.
I do hope the new location is central, as using the travel lodge round the corner was great for weekend parties!!
2LF