View Poll Results: To charge or not to charge and how much ?

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  • Reduce event entry price for the day

    2 28.57%
  • Reduce evening entry price

    2 28.57%
  • Reduce the competition entry price

    3 42.86%
  • Reduce the amount of cash prizes

    3 42.86%
  • Only have cash prizes for winners (not placed)

    3 42.86%
  • Have 'other prizes' (like free weekenders)

    3 42.86%
  • Make DWAS free

    2 28.57%
  • Pay the judges

    1 14.29%
  • It's fine as it is at present

    2 28.57%
  • Ban competitions

    0 0%
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Thread: Competition Pricing

  1. #1
    Senior Member Minnie M's Avatar
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    Competition Pricing

    I don't compete, but love going to competitions - but why are they so expensive for spectators

    and........... if you do decide to compete - after the initial shock of the entrance price, you then have to pay for every event you decide to enter

    Most of the people I know enter these contests for the Kudos and the hope that their dancing skills will approve .......... so......... why not only have cups/medals and no contest entry price or reducing the event price and have a small contest entry price

    I have made a poll to see what you think


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    Re: Competition Pricing

    Quote Originally Posted by Minnie M View Post
    I don't compete, but love going to competitions - but why are they so expensive for spectators

    and........... if you do decide to compete - after the initial shock of the entrance price, you then have to pay for every event you decide to enter

    Most of the people I know enter these contests for the Kudos and the hope that their dancing skills will approve .......... so......... why not only have cups/medals and no contest entry price or reducing the event price and have a small contest entry price

    I have made a poll to see what you think
    Talking to the local comps organisers, comps sometimes struggle to break even (and occationally make a loss), require a lot of work, and lots of staff for it to run smoothly.

    The price reflects this.

  3. #3
    Senior Member Minnie M's Avatar
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    Re: Competition Pricing

    Quote Originally Posted by Martin View Post
    Talking to the local comps organisers, comps sometimes struggle to break even (and occationally make a loss), require a lot of work, and lots of staff for it to run smoothly.

    The price reflects this.
    why are they so expensive to run - where are the extra costs

    Most of the staff do it for the love of dance (I helped with the adjudicating at BritRock with Jiver)


    --ooOoo--
    Age is a question of mind over matter, if you don't mind, it doesn't matter
    Leroy (Satchel) Paige (1906-1982)

    Mickey Mouse's girlfriend, Minnie, made her film debut, along with Mickey, in "Steamboat Willie" on November 18, 1928.
    That date is recognized as her official birthday.

  4. #4
    Lovely Moderator ducasi's Avatar
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    Re: Competition Pricing

    The Scottish Ceroc Championship is a charity event – I believe all entry fees, etc., go to the chosen charity, with DJs, judges, and other helpers, giving their time for free. Think the venue is also free. Possibly the only money made is by the caterers and the dance clothes shop.

    For this reason I do not mind paying what I might* otherwise consider as a (relatively) high price to compete.

    And as it's a charity event, if I ever won anything, I wouldn't mind that there are no cash prizes. (Does anyone actually compete for the money?)


    * To be honest, I've never given the costs much thought – while the event costs more than a typical freestyle, I guess it's similar to the cost of a all-day workshops and dances-type event.
    Let your mind go and your body will follow. – Steve Martin, LA Story

  5. #5
    Forum Bombshell - Our Queen! Lory's Avatar
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    Re: Competition Pricing

    Can someone enlighten me to the cost of entering a competition..

    Are there different prices for different catagories, for example, is the 'Open' more expensice than the 'inters'?

    Does one get a discount for entering more than one catagory?

    Are all the comps roughly the same price to enter or are they all different?

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    Re: Competition Pricing

    Everyone pays big time for a comp...

    Ceroc UK as a company had a policy of not running comps, until it became necc to add credibility and defer from another comp.

    The competitors... well for example, my flatmate spent $1200 on the costume, booked a studio 2 times a week for 3 months, spent hours working out stuff... How much in time and cash is that?

    Comp organisers....

    Hall with seating all day and evening (up to $10,000)
    Staff on the day... DJ $500+, door girls - $100 each, Judges - expenses to travel, maybe up to 5,000kms (including flights), video man $100 to $3,000 - (dependant on quality/number of cameras and stuff), overhead projector to show results - $200. Many more staff on the day, some paid, some not paid.
    Time spent in staff hours before event... up to 600 hours staff time @ x per hour (someone does pay for that).
    Table coverings, extras provided, the champs database (that someone programmed)...

    I guess I am talking nationals here, where quality is expected, local ones can be cheap... hence the turn out and the feeling that you "did a local".

  7. #7
    Senior Member Minnie M's Avatar
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    Re: Competition Pricing

    Quote Originally Posted by ducasi View Post
    The Scottish Ceroc Championship is a charity event – I believe all entry fees, etc., go to the chosen charity, with DJs, judges, and other helpers, giving their time for free. Think the venue is also free. Possibly the only money made is by the caterers and the dance clothes shop..........

    (no problem with that all - total respect to Scott and team)

    Quote Originally Posted by Lory View Post
    ......Does one get a discount for entering more than one catagory?

    Are all the comps roughly the same price to enter or are they all different?


    Could we add the above as additional options please :-

    • Discount for entering more than one catagory?
    • Standardise entry for competition sections


    Quote Originally Posted by Martin View Post
    Everyone pays big time for a comp... .
    Is that true in the UK ??? With the exception of Blackpool which I know is very very expensive

    Quote Originally Posted by Martin View Post
    .....Comp organisers....

    Hall with seating all day and evening (up to $10,000)
    Staff on the day... DJ $500+, door girls - $100 each, Judges - expenses to travel, maybe up to 5,000kms (including flights), video man $100 to $3,000 - (dependant on quality/number of cameras and stuff), overhead projector to show results - $200. Many more staff on the day, some paid, some not paid.
    Time spent in staff hours before event... up to 600 hours staff time @ x per hour (someone does pay for that).
    Table coverings, extras provided, the champs database (that someone programmed)....
    once again ........ is this the same in the UK ???


    --ooOoo--
    Age is a question of mind over matter, if you don't mind, it doesn't matter
    Leroy (Satchel) Paige (1906-1982)

    Mickey Mouse's girlfriend, Minnie, made her film debut, along with Mickey, in "Steamboat Willie" on November 18, 1928.
    That date is recognized as her official birthday.

  8. #8
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    Re: Competition Pricing

    I don't think the venue used for the Scottish Champs is free, but rather that they offer a reduced rate, as the money made on the day is going to charity.

    It's an expensive business to hire a venue, of the size needed for competitions, for the whole day (or sometimes two, if there's a pre comp party).
    "If you rebel against high heels, take care to do so in a very smart hat.'' George Bernard Shaw

  9. #9
    Omnipotent Moderator Tiggerbabe's Avatar
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    Re: Competition Pricing

    Quote Originally Posted by Martin View Post
    Time spent in staff hours before event... up to 600 hours staff time @ x per hour (someone does pay for that).
    I think this is the one that people often forget, because you can't see it on the day
    I know that Angela and Scot spend a lot of time, in the weeks prior to the comp, sorting everything out.
    "If you rebel against high heels, take care to do so in a very smart hat.'' George Bernard Shaw

  10. #10
    Registered User David Franklin's Avatar
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    Re: Competition Pricing

    Quote Originally Posted by Minnie M View Post
    Could we add the above as additional options please :-

    • Discount for entering more than one catagory?
    • Standardise entry for competition sections
    The actual cost per category always used to seem relatively small compared with the entry fee, but looking at the Midlands champs I see £25 per category (£5 for lucky dip) which does seem rather steep. Is this the norm for other comps? (can't find pricing for the main Ceroc champs, C2D or Britrock). On the other hand, how many people actually enter more than one category (+lucky dip)?

    And I don't know what you mean by "Standardise entry for competition sections" - can you explain a bit more?

    Is that true in the UK ??? With the exception of Blackpool which I know is very very expensive
    I think the first Ceroc champs got well over a thousand people at £20 pounds entry each. And even so, Mike said they'd lost thousands overall. I don't know how things are now, but I can't think they'll have improved much.

  11. #11
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    Re: Competition Pricing

    Quote Originally Posted by David Franklin View Post
    The actual cost per category always used to seem relatively small compared with the entry fee, but looking at the Midlands champs I see £25 per category (£5 for lucky dip) which does seem rather steep. Is this the norm for other comps? (can't find pricing for the main Ceroc champs, C2D or Britrock). On the other hand, how many people actually enter more than one category (+lucky dip)?
    That's pretty standard across the comps and categories. Except for Blackpool, which charges £50 to do a showcase!

    And, I think that a reasonable number of people enter more than one category between intermediate/open and then either CerocX, Old Gits, Lucky Dip and Showcase.

    I think that CJ and Yliander (for example) managed Open, CerocX, Showcase and Lucky Dip each last weekend, and would have done the aerials too, except for injury!

  12. #12
    Dickie Davies' love-child Cruella's Avatar
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    Re: Competition Pricing

    Is the old gits category cheaper? Pensions don't go very far nowadays.

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    Re: Competition Pricing

    Quote Originally Posted by TheTramp View Post
    I think that CJ and Yliander (for example) managed Open, CerocX, Showcase and Lucky Dip each last weekend, and would have done the aerials too, except for injury!
    indeed we did - and Midlands had good discounts for multiple categories - main category got you into Lucky dip at no cost, do two categories and get entry to a third one free...

    off the top of my head as far as entry fees go Midlands has been on the cheaper end of the scale


    I must admit I do wish there was an option for cheaper spectator tickets - one of the reasons I've never asked my family to watch me compete is due to the cost £25-30 is rather a lot when you don't dance and only know 1 or 2 people in the comp....

  14. #14
    Registered User David Franklin's Avatar
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    Re: Competition Pricing

    Quote Originally Posted by Yliander View Post
    I must admit I do wish there was an option for cheaper spectator tickets - one of the reasons I've never asked my family to watch me compete is due to the cost £25-30 is rather a lot when you don't dance and only know 1 or 2 people in the comp....
    Problem is, a venue's capacity is usually a "raw" number that doesn't take into account spectators v.s. dancers, particularly as you can't enforce that spectators don't dance. So every 'spectator' ticket takes up a space for someone who might have paid full price. The same argument says that a spectator ticket shouldn't be any more than an "evening only" ticket, though.

  15. #15
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    Re: Competition Pricing

    Quote Originally Posted by Yliander View Post
    indeed we did - and Midlands had good discounts for multiple categories - main category got you into Lucky dip at no cost, do two categories and get entry to a third one free...
    I think the Midlands also offered free Licky Dip entry to those who bought their tickets early.

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    Re: Competition Pricing

    Quote Originally Posted by David Franklin View Post
    Problem is, a venue's capacity is usually a "raw" number that doesn't take into account spectators v.s. dancers, particularly as you can't enforce that spectators don't dance.
    make them wear wrist bands and drag them off the floor if they dance

    Quote Originally Posted by David Franklin View Post
    So every 'spectator' ticket takes up a space for someone who might have paid full price. The same argument says that a spectator ticket shouldn't be any more than an "evening only" ticket, though.
    I am indeed aware of these sorts of consideration hence the fact that I said - "I wish"

  17. #17
    Registered User David Franklin's Avatar
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    Re: Competition Pricing

    Quote Originally Posted by Yliander View Post
    I am indeed aware of these sorts of consideration hence the fact that I said - "I wish"
    Sorry, was I winning at Sybil Fawlty's Mastermind subject again?

    Though I think I must be slow, because I did actually need Mike to explain this to me at the first champs. (Not that I was moaning about the price - I went for the full day and had a fabulous time. But I expressed surprise there was so little discount for the evening, and got the fiscal lecture).

  18. #18
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    Re: Competition Pricing

    I believe it was the cost of the Le Jive champs that was largely responsible for wiping out that organisation.

  19. #19
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    Re: Competition Pricing

    Quote Originally Posted by Minnie M View Post

    ....... is this the same in the UK ???
    I was putting it in Aussie dollars, but the same is true, UK, NZ and Aussie.

    Quite often the dance organisers put a champs on, to up the profile of thier company.
    Often it is a big headache in time, effort and the chance to lose thousands.

    I would say, have respect for those who run champs, realise they are taking a financial risk, so accept it is expensive.

    Phone up the venue that Ceroc use for the champs, ask for the cost of the hall, all day and all evening, including staff from the venue, then cost out all the overheads in your own staff, and time spent organising... maybe pay the expenses of some "top" judges to travel by car or fly in, plus accomadation.

    If not factoring in judges expenses, factor in the cost to you to recipricate and attend thier event.

    I do understand where you are coming from Minnie M, thing is, the reality is... top comps cost big bucks to stage

  20. #20
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    Re: Competition Pricing

    The entry prices are very fair compared to the price of theatre tickets or a top class football match.

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