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Thread: Mirror image leading

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    Mirror image leading

    Has anyone tried this?

    I have done a few basic moves but my brain instantly tells me to revert back to the normal way?

    Anyone got any tips?

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    Re: Mirror image leading

    I have tried shadow leading it is probably the same thing.

    No contact between partners and the follower still follows the lead but with no contact.

    Could i be more vague?

    XXX XX DTS Dave

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    Re: Mirror image leading

    Quote Originally Posted by dave the scaffolder View Post
    I have tried shadow leading it is probably the same thing.

    No contact between partners and the follower still follows the lead but with no contact.

    Could i be more vague?

    XXX XX DTS Dave

    I know what you mean and do that whenever I accident miss the hand from a spin (well if I lose my bearings after a multi-spin).

    But not quite what I meant. I meant the reverse as in a Right-to-Left mold for a first move sending them to your left hand side and so fourth.

    Strictly any move you do can be done the other way round. It's just convincing the brain to do it, being the hard part.

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    Re: Mirror image leading

    I am with you my lovely, it is very hard to do this i have tried a few times.

    Like trying to throw with your less dominant hand.

    XXX XXX DTS Dave

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    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: Mirror image leading

    Damian's AT classes (which I'm missing even as we type due to a TangoCrisisTM) typically do this - but Tango's usually easier to reverse than MJ is because it's not dependent on a hand lead. In fact, I believe all AT steps are reversible, technically.

    Another AT approach, which we tried last week, is reverse-role leading. The man does the woman's steps, and the woman does the man's - but the man is still leading. Confusing as hell, and very very difficult, not for the faint-hearted and also a bit problematic in MJ...

    DTS is talking about visual-only leading, which is also good practice - as is touch-only leading. When you can do no-vision and no-touch leading, then you're a Dance God.

    All of these are good techniques to get you thinking about how leading and following actually work.

    Quote Originally Posted by dave the scaffolder View Post
    Could i be more vague?
    Let's hope we never have to find out

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    Re: Mirror image leading

    Franck has taught workshops on this. It's incredibly difficult and shows just how much muscle memory in both the leader and follower helps in normal dancing.

    As an exercise though it allows you to concentrate on your lead or follow, as there is nothing else to make sure the move works.

    (Though practice mirror moves too much and it ends up in muscle memory too.)
    Let your mind go and your body will follow. – Steve Martin, LA Story

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    Re: Mirror image leading

    Quote Originally Posted by ducasi View Post
    Franck has taught workshops on this. It's incredibly difficult and shows just how much muscle memory in both the leader and follower helps in normal dancing.
    It's more to do with footwork. Modern Jive followers (with some exceptions) march RLRL unless led otherwise. In mirrored moves there are three options:

    1. Lead LRLR marching footwork. In open position, one-handed. Good luck!
    2. Adapt all the moves to account for the footwork not being mirrored. For example, in the mirrored first move, instead of "twisting out" on count 3, one should "twist in".
    3. Fudge it. "It doesn't matter which foot you go back on".

    I recommend the second option as resulting in the most pleasant experience when mastered.

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    Re: Mirror image leading

    Quote Originally Posted by Steven666 View Post
    Has anyone tried this?

    I have done a few basic moves but my brain instantly tells me to revert back to the normal way?

    Anyone got any tips?
    Yup - didn't have a problem, but then I'm ambidextrous so that might be a factor, also martial arts tend to mirror moves. "Look will you get on my right side so I can hit you!"

    Try treating it as learning a whole new move rather than adapting one you know.

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    Re: Mirror image leading

    Quote Originally Posted by Steven666 View Post
    Has anyone tried this?

    I have done a few basic moves but my brain instantly tells me to revert back to the normal way?

    Anyone got any tips?
    The key is to trick your brain into treating it as any other move, the bonus part is you are just reversing basic moves you already know. As Ghost rightly said treat it like learning a new move - and remember it will take time for it to become part of your reportoir of moves so practice it. You will need to remember to reverse the turns for the lady as well when reversing the move - this is the bit most leads forget and try and turn you clockwise first which feels v bizzare. If you're going to reverse the move guys reverse the turns too - anticlock first please.

    I was a one armed little angel for about 5 months earlier this year I still managed to dance but was following off my left, (it's amazing what lengths I'll go to to still be able to dance). There are a v clever few leads who have managed a whole dance (and more) reversing all the moves and leads can be done but does take practice on both sides.

    There are a number of leads who occasionally throw a reverse move in just to test the ladies following skills - there is always a surprised look when I follow it with out batting an eyelid.

    For the lady it's very confusing you're asking her to go against ingrained patterns and muscle memory but if they are a good follow they will follow whatever you lead. If you have any MJ/WCS'ers in the area try it on them as they are already more used to left hand leads and thus more likely to follow a reverse move.

    Enjoy Angel x

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