Smoking in the real world...

[Pammy]

Following on from Andy M's thread on whether people found smoking acceptable in a venue, I would be interested to know how many dancers are actually smokers (in the real, non-ceroc world; if such a thing exists! )

I am a non smoker and would be really interested to know the percentages of those who partake v. those who don't.

Px

[Aleks]

Where's the option for "social smoker"???

I know it's still smoking.....but does 2 cigarettes a fortnight in the pub when sloshed still count as being a smoker?

[Dance Demon]

Originally posted by Aleks
Where's the option for "social smoker"???

There's no such thing.....smoking is a VERY antisocial habit

[TheTramp]

Originally posted by Dance Demon
There's no such thing.....smoking is a VERY antisocial habit

Quite agree.....

Steve

[Daphne]

Originally posted by Aleks
Where's the option for "social smoker"???

I know it's still smoking.....but does 2 cigarettes a fortnight in the pub when sloshed still count as being a smoker?

A smoker is a smoker. There's no such thing as a social smoker in the medical world.

[Doc Iain]

Originally posted by Scooby Doo
A smoker is a smoker. There's no such thing as a social smoker in the medical world.

quite agree. Having just finished some research involving smokers with chronic bronchitis and emphysema I can second this. EVERYONE of them told me to tell all my patients in the future not to take up smoking. and I have to say when u see the effects on someone's life of having to have 15 hours plus of oxygen a day really does make you think!
On being questined as to whether one of the patients can do much activity he answered "yes of course, I can get all around the house -i have cut myself a long pipe to always be atached to the oxygen cylinder" and without i asked? "well, can't really getout of the chair!"

[Boomer]

Yep, I'm a smoker, sick of it. Will be giving up on Friday, too many beers this week, old enough to be a realist. It waits 'til Friday. Smoking, the only club where 99% of members wish they hadn't joined.....apart from the Notts Co. fan club

[Neil]

Originally posted by Boomer
Smoking, the only club where 99% of members wish they hadn't joined.....apart from the Notts Co. fan club

There's only one thing worse than being a member of the Notts fan club - being a Forest supporter

Neil

[Boomer]

Originally posted by Neil
There's only one thing worse than being a member of the Notts fan club - being a Forest supporter

Neil

We're goin' up ba da daaa! You're goin' down ba da duuu! Catapult - lady-spin to that baby!

Boink said zeebadee, time for bed.

[Graham]

Originally posted by Aleks
Where's the option for "social smoker"???

Isn't interesting that this is a phrase used only by smokers? As has already been demonstrated, non-smokers don't find it in the least social!

Originally posted by Aleks
I know it's still smoking.....but does 2 cigarettes a fortnight in the pub when sloshed still count as being a smoker?

I find it difficult to believe that a packet of ML lasts you more than 4 months (assuming you didn't share any).

[Aleks]

Originally posted by Dance Demon
There's no such thing.....smoking is a VERY antisocial habit

OK, OK - I'm an antisocial smoker.

[Pammy]

Originally posted by Doc Iain
quite agree. Having just finished some research involving smokers with chronic bronchitis and emphysema I can second this.

As a fully paid up member of the "you-know-what-SQUAD", I take it you have yet to study furred up arteries from greasy food?!?

I think Grahams point is interesting about social smokers, and how us non-smokers find that hard to understand. I used to know someone who said he didn't smoke, he only had one or two for stress reasons . Is this complete denial or is there any truth the only considering yourself a smoker if you NEED a cigarette, rather than if you CHOOSE to have one.

No offence to smokers, but personally, I think if a cigarette passes your lips, WHENEVER, you're a smoker.

Bet Greg carries cigarettes in his bag even though he doesn't smoke; he's got everything else in there afterall !

Px

[azande]

Well, after all the threads and posts about (against) smoking I thought of being a bit controversial.
I smoke and I enjoy it.
I'm a bit fed up of hearing how antisocial it is and how bad for my health it is.
Antisocial... I've been smoking for more than half of my life and it never happened to me that someone in a pub sitting at the same table got up and moved just because I was smoking.
I'd like to think I respect people who don't smoke, so much that I was one of the few who went to smoke outside Marcos even before the ban and if I'm at someone's place and they don't smoke I'll go outside to have a cigarette. And as it happened to me last week on holiday, I was in a restaurant near the end of my meal and a family with a pregnant woman came in the restaurant; she asked please to not smoke since she was sitting to the table next to mine and I gladly obliged.
I still have to see proof that breathing other people's smoke is more dangerous than breathing polluted air and I never heard anyone complaining about cars.
If you feel it is so bad for you, does it mean you don't even put your nose in a pub? Surely that is the worst place to be!
Bad for my health... yes I know it is, just as drinking or fried food is bad for your health but I still have to see campaigns for the banning of alcohol or bad food. Furthermore I think drinking is more antisocial than smoking. How many times someone has been punched or worse because of people who get aggressive just because they are ****ed? Or people who have serious injuries because of drink driving?
So, please, let's put things in perspective.

[Aleks]

Originally posted by Pammy
Is .... there any truth the only considering yourself a smoker if you NEED a cigarette, rather than if you CHOOSE to have one.

We're always in choice!

I am aware of a few of the things that trigger my choice to smoke a cigarette and am working to either avoid them or find a way to stop it pushing my "smoker" button.

Smoking is a crutch people use to either cope with or avoid things - working out what these things are is the first step to stopping smoking (so I tell my smoker clients).

One day (SOON!) I will walk my talk and practice what I preach!

[TheTramp]

Sorry. Can't agree with you Azande.....

Not matter how considerate you try to be, it's very unlikely that you'll never inconvienience a non-smoker. Smokers don't realise just how far smoke travels, and, even smoking outside can be just as bad - especially where groups of smokers gather outside a non-smoking place. Every time I go into college, I have to walk through a cloud of haze outside the building, because smokers gather there because the college has a non-smoking policy, and I can't tell you how much I detest this.

The difference between breathing smoke, and breathing in polluted air from car fumes, is that cars are a necessary evil, and everyone benefits from them. Even if you don't own one, I'd consider it very unlikely that you never go in one to get places. Not to mention all the services that motor vehicles in general provide (bringing your groceries to the supermarket etc.). Smoking provides benefits (if you can look at it like that) to one person only. Yourself.

As for going into pubs. I very rarely do that. Totally because of the smoke haze that usually exists therein. Even in an almost empty pub, just one person smoking can affect the whole pub. Again, I really think that even 'considerate' smokers don't realise just how far cigarette smoke can travel - especially indoors. And as for restaurants, there is no question that they MUST have a complete non-smoking policy. Or maybe 2 rooms. With an airlock inbetween. So, people who smoke, adversely affect my choice of things that I can do.

I have never been affected by drunken behaviour. Maybe this is because I don't choose to go to pubs, because of the smoking there But I've never been punched, or worse because of the effects of drink. I cannot tell you how many times that smoking has caused me to have an asthma attack though - because I don't think I can count that high. This is on a personal level of course. I do agree that there are unfortunate incidents that arise because of drunken behaviour, and quite agree that people shouldn't get into that state (of course, I very rarely even have one drink, so it's again easy for me to take the moral high ground here too).

However, I'm not against the banning of smoking. If you want to smoke in the privacy of your own home, then I quite agree that it is well within your personal rights to do so. Of course, you will quite possibly be doing yourself harm, but again, if you want to do that, who am I to stop you? I just wish that you wouldn't!

Steve

[Dreadful Scathe]

Originally posted by azande

Bad for my health... yes I know it is, just as drinking or fried food is bad for your health but I still have to see campaigns for the banning of alcohol or bad food. Furthermore I think drinking is more antisocial than smoking. How many times someone has been punched or worse because of people who get aggressive just because they are ****ed? Or people who have serious injuries because of drink driving?
So, please, let's put things in perspective.

Some good points there Azande. I dont think anyone (generally) has any particular dislike for smokers, its just the smoke. Whereas most people have at least a passing dislike to drunk people, and yes, alcohol is far worse in my opinion too. Personally i do stay away from smoky pubs as i dont like the smoke, but if i was in a pub and someone with me smoked i wouldnt consider it anti-social at all, its their choice - and my choice to be in a pub in the first place .

There are probably more campaigns against alcohol and bad food than smoking if you think about it. By-laws ban alchohol in public places, binge drinking has been criticised in the press a lot, drink driving is a serious social problem still - and theres not a day goes by that there isnt something about food in the press, look at the upsurge in organic produce too. We've not quite got to the American obsession with eradicating smoking (and smokers ) yet .

[Pammy]

Originally posted by azande
[B]Antisocial... I've been smoking for more than half of my life and it never happened to me that someone in a pub sitting at the same table got up and moved just because I was smoking.

Well, I must admit that if I was sitting next to you, and you lit up, I'd get up and leave. Perhaps it wouldn't be obvious why I was leaving, but that's what the reason would be. I'm not the sort of person that would shout out "Bloody Smokers!", but I wouldn't want to sit passively inhaling.

If you feel it is so bad for you, does it mean you don't even put your nose in a pub? Surely that is the worst place to be!

Like Trampy, I won't go in pubs because of the smoke. I hate coming out with sticky hair and hands from cigarette smoke. I'm not a drinker either, but it would be nice to go somewhere socially like a pub to chat with friends in an informal atmosphere, but because of smokers, this isn't possible.

How many times someone has been punched or worse because of people who get aggressive just because they are ****ed? Or people who have serious injuries because of drink driving?

This I do agree with though, people who drink excessively do spoil things for those around them. Luckily if you're careful you don't bump into that many sloshed drinkers. The difference is that you highlight this as obviously you don't drink to excess, whereas if you did, you'd probably say *It's my choice to drink and I don't see how it effects other people*

Some of my best friends are smokers. I just wish they'd stop before they do themselves (and others) harm.

[Dance Demon]

just picking up on the pub theme here. I was a pub manager for a number of years. I am also a non smoker. I didn't have the luxury of choosing whether I stayed or left, I had to be there, day in ,day out, inhaling the smoke of hundreds of smokers. It's not always down to personal choice. Some might say if you don't like inhaling other peoples smoke, you shouldn't work in a pub, but why should other peoples selfishness stop me from earning a living in my chosen profession? I will confess at this point that I used to smoke as a teenager, and I was partial to the odd cigar now and then, but having watched my father, a committed 60 a day man, first have a stroke, then lose both legs above the knee, then eventually die, mainly due to the effects of cigarettes, I am a firmly committed non smoker. It worries me that some of my friends are at risk of suffering the same fate as my father, and inflicting it on others through passive smoking, yet still put up am argument that it is their human right to do so. I agree with Steve, in that if you want to do it in the privacy of your own home, fine, but don't inflict ill health on me without my consent........

[PeterL]

Reading this I have to agree totally.
I am a smoker and wish I wasn't.
I will be quitting soon (though after the stress of my wedding).

having worked as a croupier even being a smoker I felt sick and hada sore throat from having smoke breathed on me all night.
Smokers don't realise that they have killed a lot of the sensitivity to smoke and so don't get the full effect of passive smoke when they have to breathe it in. Being a smoker I realise that smoke has less affect on me, I have desensitised myself to it. The only problem is I am addicted, and have to smoke to be normal (don't flame me for that statement, the first step of quitting something is admitting you have a problem).

As far as smokers having places to go I don't think they should have to just do it in there own homes but there should be areas where they can smoke where they do not affect others, oustside is always a good option but doorways are not as theTramp points out. Smoking is the hardest drug to quit because it is a social drug that is sold on every street corner when you are quitting you turn on the tele and see smoke you walk down the road you see smoke.
I understand why smokers get so annoyed as well, especially smokers older than myself, they were bought up with it as social they have paid extra taxes all there lifes because of it and even when they try to accomadate non-smokers they get demonised, the truth is most smokers wish they weren't whether they admit it to you or not, and believe it or not anti-smoking ads, and complaining at smokers normally just makes us think of fags and makes us want one.

There is no perfect answer, smokers should be considerate, non-smokers should have the same compassion they have for drug addicts, but should ask them not to skmoke round them especially if they have asthma.
I don't fully know what my point is here but please ask me not to smoke near you if I do and also stop demonising people with a problem, believe it or not we already know and feel bad enough already.

:sorry

[Boomer]

Dr Iain, please make amendments as necessary...or anybody elso in the know.
I consider myself to be a fairly well-read layman on health, but no expert. The initial response a lot of smokers give on this subject, namely, ‘I know its bad, but so is drinking’ I consider to be slightly inaccurate. As far as I’m aware, a cigarette has no beneficial properties what so ever 1 or 2 drinks (and I mean 1 or 2) is or is being shown to have to have some positive effects. There is a strong feeling that a glass or two of red-wine is a factor in the ‘French contradiction’ i.e. they eat more cholesterol than the British, but have a lower level of heart disease. This is simplified I know, please refer to my ‘layman’ comments.

Smoking is an addiction, smokers are addicted. I of course include myself in this. Comparing a cigarette to a drink and a smoker to a drinker only works if one is (correctly) comparing smoking to alcoholism. Ok, we don’t ‘duff’ people up, or become dangerous drivers after 10 tubes of heavy (B&H) but we are addicted to a substance.

Yes there are and have been campaigns for the banning of alcohol, not outright but in a certain context or environment. There are plenty of areas where you are forbidden for drinking on the streets. I recently read about one area in Eire where the police began to issues yellow-cars to people drinking on the streets, outside pubs. Drinking in an inappropriate environment will increasingly become ‘legislated’ against. Nasty, smelly food? Public transport has been trying to educate travellers to not eat Mc******* or similar on its vehicles. I have a suspicion that in time you will be refused entry to a bus if you’re carrying a bag of B**-m****.. The point is, no-one (more or less) is trying to ban smoking par-see, but they are trying to define a space that is free of smoke. I can’t blame them, I hate it when the cretin on the next table at dinner lights up half way through someone else’s meal. I used to work in a VERY smoky environment, and breathing smoke in a cashiers face in my little bookies was a one warning event – do it again and you’re barred mate.

Having just woken up, my pints, and my main thrust may be a bit muddy - my apologies.