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Thread: Blues Championships - was it Blues?

  1. #81
    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: Blues Championships - was it Blues?

    Quote Originally Posted by MartinHarper View Post
    Hardly controversial: you'd be joining Lory, Fusioneer, Martin and Chicklet so far.
    I know, I'm mortified, I've joined in with the herd - in my defence I hadn't caught up with their comments when I posted. I'll try not to do that again.

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    Forum Bombshell - Our Queen! Lory's Avatar
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    Re: Blues Championships - was it Blues?

    Quote Originally Posted by straycat264 View Post
    Universal Product Code? This dance gets stranger and stranger....
    oops, !

    You know what I meant
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    Re: Blues Championships - was it Blues?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lory View Post
    I know, lets just scrap the word Blues

    .. how about

    The UK's first UPC comp?
    Like what you say but why 'dips and drops'?? Why is that part of UCP? Given they are the most abused, overused and least well applied moves going, why encourage their mall-use?

  4. #84
    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: Blues Championships - was it Blues?

    Quote Originally Posted by straycat264 View Post
    Universal Product Code? This dance gets stranger and stranger....
    I thought UPC was double-glazing - so, the world's first window-dance competition.

    It's a winner.

    Of course, you realize Lory can fix her post at any point, thus making our comments look even sillier. Oh, hold on, so can I - so it's only you looking silly then


    Back, vaguely, on topic, did anyone see both the Beach Boooooooogie Blues comp and the Breeze Blues comp? Were there any significant differences or lessons to learn for either? Or were they so different as to make comparisons pointless?

    (If the latter, does that confirm that it's effectively impossible to run any sort of a meaningful Blues competition? Because that's becoming my view now...)

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    Re: Blues Championships - was it Blues?

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    To me, the only clip that was of interest was this one:

    - that, I'd definitely call AT with hips
    'Eeeeps. Not hips. For the benefit of those who haven't had classes with her, She has 'eeeps. (it's that French accent that does it)

    To me, it doesn't look or feel remotely like AT, but maybe that's just me. On the other hand, Steven & Virginie do share with AT that wonderful elegance that was (for me) missing from many of the other clips.

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    But generally, if that's what Blues Dancing really is, I'm not interested in learning it, it doesn't speak to me. And if that's the criteria for judging an MJ Blues Comp in this country, I can't see many people doing it.
    Sorry
    Why sorry? No shame in not liking something. A whole lot of people do do it, and love it though (for which I'm very grateful)

    Quote Originally Posted by Sugarfoot View Post
    Nice clip David.
    But not a nice clip when I posted it earlier?

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    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: Blues Championships - was it Blues?

    Quote Originally Posted by straycat264 View Post
    But not a nice clip when I posted it earlier?
    Sorry, did someone say something?

    Yes, it's a lovely clip, which Stray originally posted and I repeated.

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    Forum Bombshell - Our Queen! Lory's Avatar
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    Re: Blues Championships - was it Blues?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gus View Post
    Like what you say but why 'dips and drops'?? Why is that part of UCP? Given they are the most abused, overused and least well applied moves going, why encourage their mall-use?
    Well, yes, there's always that danger but I think, if done in the context of a competition, they can enhance the 'performance' side things and a 'well timed' dip or drop, done with passion, can look amazing but only if its in keeping with the music, of course.

    I'm definitely not a fan of drops being stuck in every at every given opportunity, just for the sake of it or to be flash (and points should be deducted for mis/over use) but sometimes they can add to the drama of a dance, especially if the music dictates something dramatic.

    Getting back to my UCP (upc) idea, I've been thinking, it would broaden the choice of music considerably, you could even have different genre's of music for the 2 tracks, the only criteria being the tempo!
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    Re: Blues Championships - was it Blues?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lory View Post
    Getting back to my UCP (upc) idea, I've been thinking, it would broaden the choice of music considerably, you could even have different genre's of music for the 2 tracks, the only criteria being the tempo!
    Mmmmm just wondering. We've already got the Ceroc UK Blues, and the BB UK Blues. Probably get something like the LeRoc UK Blues ... then we can have the UK UCP and possible the UK Open UCP Champs ...... starts to sound like the MJ Champs situation

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    Re: Blues Championships - was it Blues?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gus View Post
    Mmmmm just wondering. We've already got the Ceroc UK Blues, and the BB UK Blues. Probably get something like the LeRoc UK Blues ... then we can have the UK UCP and possible the UK Open UCP Champs ...... starts to sound like the MJ Champs situation
    No but, 'different' people would surely be attracted to enter the different comps..

    all the people above who don't like the look of the 'real blues', in those clips, me for instance, wouldn't bother entering the 'blues' comps, cos we don't aspire to dance/look like those dancers and therefore would never stand a chance of getting very far, if thats the style the judges are looking for!
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    Re: Blues Championships - was it Blues?

    Quote Originally Posted by straycat264 View Post
    Universal Product Code? This dance gets stranger and stranger....
    mind you the black and white stripes would suit ZW
    Quote Originally Posted by Lory View Post
    ...This post started off as 'tongue in cheek' but I quite like the idea now!
    and the dance gets more intimate ...

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    Re: Blues Championships - was it Blues?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lory View Post
    all the people above who don't like the look of the 'real blues', in those clips, me for instance, wouldn't bother entering the 'blues' comps, cos we don't aspire to dance/look like those dancers and therefore would never stand a chance of getting very far, if thats the style the judges are looking for!
    Till the judges emerge from the Dark Mists that shroud Ceroc HQ and tell us what they were actually looking for ... we'll never know! The whole point of this thread was to try to bring some clarity as to what was been looked for. All it seems to have done is proven just how little understanding there is.

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    Re: Blues Championships - was it Blues?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lory View Post
    Getting back to my UCP (upc) idea, I've been thinking, it would broaden the choice of music considerably, you could even have different genre's of music for the 2 tracks, the only criteria being the tempo!
    If it's not Blues dancing and not Blues music, it certainly shouldn't be called Blues, so that's good. I notice that your proposed judging criteria didn't require closeness, so calling it a UCP competition might be misleading. How about calling it simply Modern Jive Championships - Slow Division, or similar? That system works well for other dances, so it should work for us too.

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    Re: Blues Championships - was it Blues?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gus View Post
    Till the judges emerge from the Dark Mists that shroud Ceroc HQ and tell us what they were actually looking for ... we'll never know!
    Well, to be fair to Ceroc - and it pains me, believe me - they've spent a lot of time trying - they've published criteria, they've run classes, and Rocky and Ruby have contributed via various posts and on this very thread.

    Whereas, we haven't heard a peep from anyone official about the criteria for the BB comp - despite repeated requests. But somehow Beach Boogie seems to have a magical "deflect all criticism" shield or something.

    What happens at the BB comp? Does anyone know? Does anyone care?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gus View Post
    The whole point of this thread was to try to bring some clarity as to what was been looked for. All it seems to have done is proven just how little understanding there is.
    Well, I think it's clarified the confusion, if that helps?

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    Re: Blues Championships - was it Blues?

    Quote Originally Posted by MartinHarper View Post
    How about calling it simply Modern Jive Championships - Slow Division, or similar?
    How about the Utopia ChampionshiP?

    The word slow when applied in this context seems unappealing.

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    Re: Blues Championships - was it Blues?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gus View Post
    Till the judges emerge from the Dark Mists that shroud Ceroc HQ and tell us what they were actually looking for ... we'll never know!
    I thought that Rocky and Ruby were both judges?

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    Re: Blues Championships - was it Blues?

    Quote Originally Posted by MartinHarper View Post
    I thought that Rocky and Ruby were both judges?
    Indeed, Gus is being silly. Again.

    I don't think the problem is lack of involvement, or lack of effort, on the part of the organisers / judges. I think it's just a complete lack of consensus - no-one can define what Blues is.

    And yes, you can say the same about MJ, but at least there's some level of consensus at a practical level - in MJ Blues, there doesn't even seem to be that.

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    Re: Blues Championships - was it Blues?

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    We haven't heard a peep from anyone official about the criteria for the BB comp - despite repeated requests. But somehow Beach Boogie seems to have a magical "deflect all criticism" shield or something. What happens at the BB comp? Does anyone know? Does anyone care?
    As I mentioned on the Beach Boogie aftermath thread, the criteria were explained to the competitors shortly before the event, and there was a "Performance Blues" class earlier that day from Nigel and Nina giving a variety of general advice on how to perform well in a Blues competition. "Blues aesthetic" or similar was not one of the criteria given.

    Quote Originally Posted by robd View Post
    The word slow when applied in this context seems unappealing.
    Calling it the "Utopia Division" would work great too. Or you could follow ULHS and call it the "Freedom" division. I like "slow" because it's straight-forward and easy to understand.

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    Re: Blues Championships - was it Blues?

    Quote Originally Posted by MartinHarper View Post
    As I mentioned on the Beach Boogie aftermath thread, the criteria were explained to the competitors shortly before the event, and there was a "Performance Blues" class earlier that day from Nigel and Nina giving a variety of general advice on how to perform well in a Blues competition. "Blues aesthetic" or similar was not one of the criteria given.
    Sure - but unfortunately, none of this is written down (that I can find)

    Call me cynical, but I don't like verbal rules, I like stuff that I can read...

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    Re: Blues Championships - was it Blues?

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    Well, to be fair to Ceroc - and it pains me, believe me - they've spent a lot of time trying - they've published criteria, they've run classes, and Rocky and Ruby have contributed via various posts and on this very thread.
    Hold on. The three places finalists had RADICALLY different dance styles .... I've not read anything from the Judges that reconciles such a wide diversity to 'Blues'. Personally I thought that only one of the three was pure Blues, one was an interesting variation and the third was just competition Ceroc done slowly

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    Re: Blues Championships - was it Blues?

    One of the functions of competitions in any art form is to test boundaries and to help the art form evolve. At the moment it looks to me like we are using the same name for different animals.

    From a class and workshop point of view there should be some sub-division, so people know what they are signing up for. I have been at carefully gender balanced blues classes where ladies left very early. I guess it was too UCP for them.

    The V form Layback blues? Grind?
    The A form Swing Blues? Tango blues?
    The H form MJ Blues?

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