One of my favoruite dances was to 15 mins silence while the DJ tried to figure out why the music wasn't playing
(Oh and if we're straying into Tango, the DJ at one club has taking to putting significant pauses between tracks so I've taken to dancing in the silence )
Yup - I've had women at Ceroc complain they don't like the song that's being played so I've asked them what they'd like to dance to instead
There is this guy at the venue i dance at on a wednesday that sounds pretty much like you have experienced. I dance with him atleast once every week, but he totaly dances off beat! The majority of the dance i feel like i'm being ragged around the dance floor . I would say no to dancing with him again, but i feel really really rude for saying no to a dance haha. It was extreamly off putting at first, especialy when i first joined. I used to try to resist eg... hold my spins out, take a little while longer doing what he wanted me to do, just anything to try and get the dance back on beat, but now i just let him lead me how he wants , Always off beat, but when i dance with him, i have learnt to just block out the music, and as others have said, just concentrate on the beat "he's hearing". After all, the song isn't that long, and before you know it, the song has finished =].
Maybe I am being rude/conceited/whatever, but once I have danced with a yanker guy so totally off beat, I simply will avoid him - why subject yourself to unpleasant experience?
As so many people said before - life's too short. If you started dancing and realised he was off-beat, fine, let him lead. But if you KNOW that he is dancing to whatever music he is hearing, not paying the slightest attention to his partner's moves, style or timing, then find somebody else to dance with!
I have danced with a guy, who was also off-beat, but very considerate of my timing, and it was, actually, quite a pleasant dance. He wasn't trying to yank me to his own beat, let me finish my spins, let me do my styling - totally different attitude and, consequently, experience.
I think I might be contradicting my own earlier post , but it now occurs to me that off-beat on its own isn't the biggest of evils - couple it with a yanker and you've got a lethal combination!
Follow the lead. Learn to dance out of beat if that is what is led.
Otherwise, you will probably learn to dance on the beat despite what is being led.
Or worse, you may learn to force the leader to dance on the beat.
One day you will dance with someone who has a more sophisticated understanding of musicality. You might ignore his lead and dance only on the beat, but you will miss most of the joy of dancing with him.
Everyone, leader and follower, has to learn to dance on time; playing with the timing is not possible until you understand the timing. But followers must follow. No matter how well a leader understands the music, if the follower dances to her own interpretation rather than following the lead, the dance cannot be as good.
Why do female leads rarely have a problem with it then?Originally Posted by Andy McGregor
Why?
Oh... because....
Why is that bad? You'll be dancing to the music. Isn't that A Good Thing?Otherwise, you will probably learn to dance on the beat despite what is being led.
Or worse, you may learn to force the leader to dance on the beat.
I doubt it, if he has no sense of rhythm.One day you will dance with someone who has a more sophisticated understanding of musicality.
Seriously, unless you've experienced dancing with someone with no rhythm, you have no idea how awful it is. As Followers, we already cope with the frustration of Leads who don't have musicality (whether through inexperience, ignorance or through being a move monster). Don't lecture us to always suffer a complete lack of rhythm with good grace.
That is so true, if like some people your timing is &a1 &a2 &a3 &a4 etc the dance will appear smoother less blocky plus the ease of adding of light & shade (fast/slow) that gives dance its mystery, musicality needs to be like the music its self multi layered.
Its shouldnt about the beat but gaps in between!!
No. Following your advice, you will be dancing on the beat. There is more to music than beat.
But if he has no sense of rhythm, then he's hardly a candidate for my statement of "more sophisticated understanding of musicality".I doubt it, if he has no sense of rhythm.
When I started dancing, I could not find the beat. Many patient followers helped me. Now, I do know how awful it is to dance with someone with no rhythm. Even if it is true that men have less sense of rhythm than women, that does not mean all women have rhythm.Seriously, unless you've experienced dancing with someone with no rhythm, you have no idea how awful it is.
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Your earlier comment suggested you see dancing on beat as more important than anything else. Certainly you rejected my comment about "more sophisticated understanding of musicality".
Have you ever thought that if you were a leader, you would be a "move monster"? You certainly display many of the characteristics, especially your refusal to acknowledge there is more to musicality than just dancing on the beat.
I hope he doesn't mind - but I'm going to use a dance I had with Tsh on Staurday as an example, as it perfectly fits what I'm saying.
This was a dance where he extended moves, paused & stopped moving, and fitted the phrasing of the music perfectly - however, within that phrasing and playing, the FRAMEWORK of the music, as marked out by the BEAT was still there.
You can't ignore the beat. If you do, the whole dance falls apart.
If it helps you to understand what I'm saying, think about the dancers being additional instruments within the music. They don't have to play the exact same thing that someone else is playing. But, in order to fit, they have to play in the same key, and to the same beat. If they don't - it sounds loose and disjointed.
This is why I find it hard to dance with someone without rhythm, who cannot hear the beats.
No. As I've said above, you cannot have a "more sophisticated understanding of musicality" without having that basis to work from.Your earlier comment suggested you see dancing on beat as more important than anything else. Certainly you rejected my comment about "more sophisticated understanding of musicality".
If I were a Move Monster, I'd quite fancy being a Move Vampire.Have you ever thought that if you were a leader, you would be a "move monster"?
I do lead, but because I can't remember too many moves, I tend to play with the music more, just to get away with it. People I dance lead with tend to indicate that I dance to the music. I always say it's because I know what I like (as a follower), that I try to do it when I lead.
Ooooh! Handbag! That's a bit of a snotty comment. But I'll rise above it.You certainly display many of the characteristics, especially your refusal to acknowledge there is more to musicality than just dancing on the beat.
All I was saying, is that to me, dancing to the beat is far more important, because the beat is what gives the dance the framwork. Perhaps it's because I'm a musician.
I'd put it slightly differently... You should be aware of the beat, but you can choose to deliberately ignore it for some parts of the dance, as long as you, umm, "acknowledge" the beat. You don't have to - for example - step on every beat / every other beat, just to acknowledge the beat. I can't put it better than that, I'm afraid.
But like all this stuff, you need to know the rules before you can bend them.
I wouldn't use "ignore", as that implies the person is aware of the beat in the first place - lots of people simply don't hear it.
You need to be able to dance to the beat before you can dance not to the beat
Well, duh. I mean, that's what the rest of us do.
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