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Thread: Should we raise the age of drinking to 21 ?

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    Registered User stewart38's Avatar
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    Should we raise the age of drinking to 21 ?

    The 'Daily Mail' and no doubt others have raised concern again that given many people under 21 go out cause damage and tend to stab/ kill /attack each other under the influence of drink, the drinking age should be raised to 21. i.e. 'youngsters' cant handle drink

    These are not my words but kind of from the Daily Mail

    I know most states of USA its 21 and enforced , god I was still being asked for ID at 30

    Some societies introduce 'drink' at a much younger age

    I donít know if its a 'British Mentality' re the weekend may hem which starts on a Thursday or if raising it would do any good or be fair on the many who are under 21 but donít moon in town centres on Saturday nights whilst 120ft up a lamp post and dropping bottles on passers below

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    Re: Should we raise the age of drinking to 21 ?

    I dont think we need to raise the age to 21 but we do need to enfoce the 18 rule, which doesnt happen now. The culture in the US is very much - if there is the slightest chance you may not be legal age, you are ID'd. Here its the opposite; unless you look like yo're still in primary School you WON'T get Id'd.

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    Re: Should we raise the age of drinking to 21 ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadful Scathe View Post
    I dont think we need to raise the age to 21 but we do need to enfoce the 18 rule, which doesnt happen now. The culture in the US is very much - if there is the slightest chance you may not be legal age, you are ID'd. Here its the opposite; unless you look like yo're still in primary School you WON'T get Id'd.
    I don't agree with that, I'm 19. I think I look 19, maybe 18. But I get ID'ed in shops and restaurants. Sometimes clubs, but not often. Bear in mind I live in Sunderland, and I see people in a club that are 14-15.

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    Re: Should we raise the age of drinking to 21 ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Freddie_C View Post
    I don't agree with that, I'm 19. I think I look 19, maybe 18. But I get ID'ed in shops and restaurants. Sometimes clubs, but not often. Bear in mind I live in Sunderland, and I see people in a club that are 14-15.
    But Freddie - if you've got young kids in the clubs who are underage, doesn't that rather prove DS's point that IDs do need to be checked and the current age limit enforced?

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    Re: Should we raise the age of drinking to 21 ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Freddie_C View Post
    I don't agree with that, I'm 19. I think I look 19, maybe 18.
    yeah

    Im 42 i look 38 , its a pain looking younger then you are

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    Re: Should we raise the age of drinking to 21 ?

    Some of these kids are being GIVEN booze by there parents...it's not the age of drinkers that needs to go up, but enforced parenting classes for anyone who's children are found drinking, a hefty fine for the parents and for repeat offenders...prison.



    Some people are so ignorant though, nothing will help.

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    Re: Should we raise the age of drinking to 21 ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Double Trouble View Post
    Some of these kids are being GIVEN booze by there parents...it's not the age of drinkers that needs to go up, but enforced parenting classes for anyone who's children are found drinking, a hefty fine for the parents and for repeat offenders...prison.
    I'm not sure I agree with this entirely! If Kids are given booze by there parents and drinking it in the home then it is controlled by the parents.

    It's the parents that buy booze for their kids to take out that we should be concerned about.

    As Stewart says giving children alcohol at a young age is considered the norm in many cultures. The idea is that it makes them respect it!

    My parents allowed me to drink a glass of watered wine with meals from a young age and as I got older that changed and I'll go out on a limb and say that this maybe the case for many. It takes alot of the mystrey away from alcohol. but thats just my POV!

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    Re: Should we raise the age of drinking to 21 ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Freya View Post
    My parents allowed me to drink a glass of watered wine with meals from a young age
    I'm not talking about a glass of wine with dinner...I'm talking about parents giving their kids a 2 litre bottle of cider or lager and letting them roam the streets getting plssed and abusive. They can't be bothered to deal with the unruly brats themselves so they inflict them on the rest of us.

    I've said it before and I'll say it again. You cannot polish a turd.

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    Re: Should we raise the age of drinking to 21 ?

    you are one classy lady

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    Re: Should we raise the age of drinking to 21 ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Twirly View Post
    But Freddie - if you've got young kids in the clubs who are underage, doesn't that rather prove DS's point that IDs do need to be checked and the current age limit enforced?
    I was giving both sides of the coin...

    I'm saying, they're picky on who they ID, I'm not being sexist, but there are more underage girls around the town than there are males, IMO, I've seen it first hand. Plus, if a guy is with a girl, he is less likely to be ID'ed if he looks underage.

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    Re: Should we raise the age of drinking to 21 ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Freddie_C View Post
    I was giving both sides of the coin...

    I'm saying, they're picky on who they ID, I'm not being sexist, but there are more underage girls around the town than there are males, IMO, I've seen it first hand. Plus, if a guy is with a girl, he is less likely to be ID'ed if he looks underage.
    Oh we know - its always been like that. But without any sort of penalty for underage drinking its just about the profit they can make. I would suggest a fine for EACH underage drinker, and if it happens often - a threat of closure. That'll sort em out

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    Re: Should we raise the age of drinking to 21 ?

    What is about our society these days that we can't think of ways of dealing with problems that don't involve intimidating people into complying? I am reminded (as you are probably bored with me saying) of Aesop's fable of the wind and the sun.

    Why not raise the limit to 30? Why not introduce prohibition?

    Whoa! Hold on. That's been tried already and - it made America a criminal society in a way that it had never been before. It gave organised crime a booster rocket of a toe-hold which it took America decades to deal with, and is at least partially responsible for the drug culture which took hold in the black ghettos in the 30s and 40s and is now the world's biggest socio-criminal problem.

    You can't deal with people's misuse of things by forbidding them. Nothing is more seductively attractive than the forbidden - particularly for adolescents. Once again cultural problems are being seen, wrongly, as problems that should be dealt with by law-and-order policy, and it won't work.

    What about an 18 year old who is inclined to mis-use alcohol, binge-drink and make themselves ill is going to magically change when they turn 21?

    The answer is to take the mystique out of alcohol, so it becomes part of enjoying life rather than something that is ineluctably confused with escaping from childhood and becoming an adult.

    It's interesting, though possibly not significant, that the rise and rise of alcohol problems in young adults has coincided with the introduction of alco-pops and completely tasteless lagers served at temperatures at which the taste buds don't work. We should ban them and reintroduce drinks which are an acquired taste. That's what I reckon.

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    Registered User SteveK's Avatar
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    Re: Should we raise the age of drinking to 21 ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Shnikov View Post
    It's interesting, though possibly not significant, that the rise and rise of alcohol problems in young adults has coincided with the introduction of alco-pops and completely tasteless lagers served at temperatures at which the taste buds don't work. We should ban them and reintroduce drinks which are an acquired taste. That's what I reckon.
    I think that alco-pops are unfairly targetted - it's a common misconception made by people with a reasonable disposable income. Put yourself in the point of view of a teenager with a small amount of money - do you buy a 330ml bottle of alco-pop, or do you buy 2 litres of White Lightning (cheap cider with a higher alcohol content). Kids can't afford to drink large quantities of alco-pops if they are buying it as they are too expensive. However poor quality cider is much cheaper; just look at the alcohol/cost ratio for the two. Banning cheap cider would have a far greater effect.

    Similarly lager served at very low temperatures isn't an issue - most kids can't afford to drink in places that serve this, it's the drinking in the park that is the issue, and the drinks are unchilled.

    Apparently the incidence of drug use is much higher at American universities compared with British students. It's much easier to sell drugs (both hard and soft) than alcohol to minors there.

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    Re: Should we raise the age of drinking to 21 ?

    methinks Barry is not entirely serious... "reintroduce drinks which are an acquired taste"

    I agree. Whilst I think the law as it stands should be treated with some respect rather than utter contempt as it is now. Responsible use of alchol with parents is fine by me. When first-footing with my parents from age 10 onwards, my drink of choice was babycham - in later years a tin of Export. Occasionaly at meals every now and again some wine, but this was rare as my parents never drank much. Barry is right - being aware of alcohol as just a fancy drink option, whilst mentioning the side effects, is by far the best way to go. But it should not be so easy to get alcohol yourself as a teenager.

    In latter years I find I have aquired a taste for good whisky, but I've never been a drinker. I had a friend once who said, when asked what he wanted from the bar, (to my increduality), "it doesnt matter does it, you drink to get drunk don't you".

    So from then on I urinated into every one of his pints.

    Not really.

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    Registered User stewart38's Avatar
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    Re: Should we raise the age of drinking to 21 ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Shnikov View Post
    You can't deal with people's misuse of things by forbidding them. Nothing is more seductively attractive than the forbidden - particularly for adolescents. Once again cultural problems are being seen, wrongly, as problems that should be dealt with by law-and-order policy, and it won't work.

    What about an 18 year old who is inclined to mis-use alcohol, binge-drink and make themselves ill is going to magically change when they turn 21?

    The answer is to take the mystique out of alcohol, so it becomes part of enjoying life rather than something that is ineluctably confused with escaping from childhood and becoming an adult.

    It is difficult, dont think there is much mystique re alcohol

    If you band it from people under 21 you would take 75% of offenders of the streets , people tend to grow up a bit hence the idea re increasing it to 21.

    I dont see the street of Saudi Arbia washed with booze so banding it may work

    however think we should cut down on...

    Supermarkets offering it as a loss leader (image if they did that with cigarettes)

    If your drinking at 16 in a pub , pub gets done, 3 strikes type thing

    Im in favour of keeping it at 18 but dont think its a good idea you can buy a pint of cider in the supermarket at 36p

    I dont know if there is a solution to it all ?

    Maybe stop buying the Daily Mail and avoid city centres for 3 days a week or after 8pm ?

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    Re: Should we raise the age of drinking to 21 ?

    Quote Originally Posted by stewart38 View Post
    I dont see the street of Saudi Arbia washed with booze so banding it may work
    I understand that there is alcohol available in Saudi in some of the ex-pat compounds; dodgy home brew is readily available inside the compounds, although apparently it is a bit of an "acquired taste".

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    Re: Should we raise the age of drinking to 21 ?

    Quote Originally Posted by SteveK View Post
    I understand that there is alcohol available in Saudi in some of the ex-pat compounds; dodgy home brew is readily available inside the compounds, although apparently it is a bit of an "acquired taste".
    There is a big market for alcohol in many arab countries, but without guide lines and due to the huge cost of "real" booze, some of the stuff they sell is lethal, literally.

    The main reason the streets are not "awash with booze" is penalties are much harsher; in Saudi "Sentences for alcohol offences range from a few weeks or months imprisonment for consumption to several years for smuggling, manufacturing or distributing alcohol." here

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    Registered User stewart38's Avatar
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    Re: Should we raise the age of drinking to 21 ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadful Scathe View Post
    There is a big market for alcohol in many arab countries, but without guide lines and due to the huge cost of "real" booze, some of the stuff they sell is lethal, literally.

    The main reason the streets are not "awash with booze" is penalties are much harsher; in Saudi "Sentences for alcohol offences range from a few weeks or months imprisonment for consumption to several years for smuggling, manufacturing or distributing alcohol." here
    Well their not going to ban it and clearly if you made it a illegal it would have an impact but that’s not going to happen

    Maybe one answer is to enforce all 15-20yr olds to spend 3 months of the year in Malguf , keep them off UK streets ?

    God im starting to sound like a real oldie ‘in my day’

    But when I hear supermarkets do a £112m cut price booze binge

    Maybe ban drinking away from licence premises ? Only let middle England enjoy their wine in the park (age 35+)

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    Re: Should we raise the age of drinking to 21 ?

    How's about a spot of aversion therapy?

    At age 16, they get let loose in a bar and told to drink anything and everything... the resulting hangover/sickness will hopefully put them off alcohol for life, and if it doesn't then you know in advance that they are likely to develop alcohol problems and enrol them in AA immediately?

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    Registered User stewart38's Avatar
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    Re: Should we raise the age of drinking to 21 ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Twirly View Post
    How's about a spot of aversion therapy?

    At age 16, they get let loose in a bar and told to drink anything and everything... the resulting hangover/sickness will hopefully put them off alcohol for life, and if it doesn't then you know in advance that they are likely to develop alcohol problems and enrol them in AA immediately?
    People can get pissed a 1000 times it doesnt mean they have a problem with drink some can die of it 'without a problem'

    there was a women who wrote she use to drink 2/3 bottles of wine every night. it was affecting her work /kids home life etc

    she didnt have a problem of course as she didnt drink it with her corn flakes or before tea time

    Re raising the age i dont think thats a solution god you can die for this country at 16

    In fact a few yrs ago was talk of lowering it !

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