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Thread: Spinning videos thread

  1. #61
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    Re: You Tube Dance videos

    Quote Originally Posted by woodface View Post
    I know what you are saying but don't see why there can't be connection whilst one partner or another is doing multiple spins.
    Because only a truly godlike dancer can maintain connection whilst spinning. And as you've (several times) admitted you don't spot, there's even less likelihood of you being able to establish a connection during your 2,553 spins or whatever.

    So, you're not looking at your partner at all, and you're obviously not touching her - how do you propose to establish connection?

    Put it another way, can you lead your partner whilst spinning? Or is she left to her own devices?

    Spinning is a good test of balance - and a good way of developing that balance. It looks good, and so is great for visual areas (competitons / showcases) and for classes specialising in that sort of style (e.g. Jive nation, and Aussie "fast and furious" style generally).

    But I don't see that it helps in an intensively lead-and-follow, connection-based, social dance.

    Quote Originally Posted by woodface View Post
    Do you feel different if it is the follow doing it?
    Nope - follower-multi-spinning has the same problems, for the same reasons.

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    Re: Spinning videos thread

    I think you're all getting a bit too "let's diss woodface cause we can"...

    In the video's of Woodface spinning, the music is quite upbeat, energetic and bouncy, this is the best type of music to spin to in my opinion, you can really let yourself go and throw yourself around, well I do anyway.

    It's what I'd do, in bouncy bouncy ceroc type dancing, I'd definately throw loads of multi spins in because quite frankly, theres no musicality going off in the dance because it's just thump thump, so it's move move move, hence the ways for a follow, or indeed a lead to express themselves are limited, why not spin? It's different and it's definately a skill.

    However, in a blue dance/environment I rarely do more than a double spin, I base my spins on the speed of the music and length of breaks etc.. During my dances with woodface, I've noticed he indeed does the same which shows to me, he has musicality. It might not be to the level as some other forumites who are jumping down his throat, but the guy's having a go and for that I say

    Keep on spinning Lee.

    Jamie

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    Re: You Tube Dance videos

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    Because only a truly godlike dancer can maintain connection whilst spinning. And as you've (several times) admitted you don't spot, there's even less likelihood of you being able to establish a connection during your 2,553 spins or whatever.
    But a few post ago, you were saying Amir leads without sight or touch.

    Is Amir God like?

    Not being argumentative just interested.

    Of course, if you lead your partner forward or she does multi spins at the same time, then the connection is still there. What if you lead your partner in to multi spins? Say you walk around her whilst she is spinning?

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    Re: You Tube Dance videos

    Quote Originally Posted by woodface View Post
    I know what you are saying but don't see why there can't be connection whilst one partner or another is doing multiple spins.

    Do you feel different if it is the follow doing it?
    Your last quote made me think about something that occurred to me afte watching your video of you and Coni spinning.

    There were a few occasions where it looked as if you were falling off of your spin and Conni was backing away. There was one occasion where you travelled away and conni went after you. I am not saying any of this as a critism but my partner has told me not to move because she tells me that she uses me as a referance point during free spins and if I move then she has no idea where the target will be for her to stop. I have sometimes played with this by sending her into a free spin and moving and finding that she tends to topple in the direction that I move.

    I am wondering if Conni moved because you fell off of the spin or if you fell off of the spin because Conni moved.

    When you are spinning what is it that gives you your referance point so that you can stop you spin facing your partner? What is it that tells you that you are still vertical while you are spinning? Can you trust your balance organs in your ears to tell you the truth while you are spinning and do you back this up with information like seeing the distance to your partner - so if your partner moves it creates conflict between the two sources of information.

    When Conni spins you, you bring your left leg out in an arc and back in in order to generate the rotational momentum for the spin. How does Conni know how much energy to give you from her lead to you? After all she doesn't know how much energy your are going to put into the spin so she won't know how much she needs to give you. Unless you allow her to learn how much lead corresponds to how much spin then she will never learn the relationship between the two. Still, since it was just a bit of fun between a couple it won't matter.

    As I say just some things that I got into thinking about and not a critism in any way.

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    Re: Spinning videos thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jamie View Post
    I think you're all getting a bit too "let's diss woodface cause we can"...

    In the video's of Woodface spinning, the music is quite upbeat, energetic and bouncy, this is the best type of music to spin to in my opinion, you can really let yourself go and throw yourself around, well I do anyway.

    It's what I'd do, in bouncy bouncy ceroc type dancing, I'd definately throw loads of multi spins in because quite frankly, theres no musicality going off in the dance because it's just thump thump, so it's move move move, hence the ways for a follow, or indeed a lead to express themselves are limited, why not spin? It's different and it's definately a skill.

    However, in a blue dance/environment I rarely do more than a double spin, I base my spins on the speed of the music and length of breaks etc.. During my dances with woodface, I've noticed he indeed does the same which shows to me, he has musicality. It might not be to the level as some other forumites who are jumping down his throat, but the guy's having a go and for that I say

    Keep on spinning Lee.

    Jamie
    cheers Jamie.

    I think some people forget that there is more than Blues music out there. It is something that would happen more in the bouncy room than blues.

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    Re: You Tube Dance videos

    Quote Originally Posted by woodface View Post
    But a few post ago, you were saying Amir leads without sight or touch.
    No, I said I'd seen him lead without those. He led. A step. And he wasn't spinning at the time.

    Quote Originally Posted by woodface View Post
    Is Amir God like?
    Hmmm.... Possibly. I think that calls for a poll...

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    Re: Spinning videos thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jamie View Post
    I think you're all getting a bit too "let's diss woodface cause we can"...

    (snip)

    ....some other forumites who are jumping down his throat, but the guy's having a go and for that I say
    spoilsport. How are we going to entertain ourselves while we're bored at work if we're not allowed to play with Woodie's throat ? When he is so nicely asking for it as well....

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    Re: You Tube Dance videos

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    Nope - follower-multi-spinning has the same problems, for the same reasons.
    One difference is that the leader can take advantage of the time to move into closed position, or even interrupt the multi-spin.

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    Re: You Tube Dance videos

    Quote Originally Posted by Chef View Post
    {snip}
    You know what, There are some valid point there.

    First off, knowing where your partner is....

    I have said before about I don't spot. Since I have said that, technique has developed alittle and whilst I still don't spot, as I slow down, I reference things on the last few spins.

    The power from the spins actually somes from a mixture of momentum, BlueEyes lead and me pushing off of her, hence It's mainly done from a catapult.

    The things of moving. I don't know. Will have to study that at some point and experament, but it is a good point. Could also be that it was about 4am Monday morning . There are times when I go off balance. Was going to edit the first 2/3 spins I did out just leaving the good ones in but thats just cheating isn't it? I know when it's going majorly of balance and just stop.

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    Re: Spinning videos thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jamie View Post
    I think you're all getting a bit too "let's diss woodface cause we can"...
    Nope, we're getting a bit "let's diss woodface coz he's talking absolute rubbish".

    I've been very very tolerant of people spouting rubbish, and if you look at my initial responses to his first posts, you'll see that.

    But after a while, you get this insane* urge to actually point out that he's talking rubbish.

    * Because it's clearly wasted effort.

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    Re: Spinning videos thread

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    Nope, we're getting a bit "let's diss woodface coz he's talking absolute rubbish".

    I've been very very tolerant of people spouting rubbish, and if you look at my initial responses to his first posts, you'll see that.

    But after a while, you get this insane* urge to actually point out that he's talking rubbish.

    * Because it's clearly wasted effort.
    It's what you make of it DJ.

    Chef has raised some good point and so has Jamie.

    For a sec, get Tango out of your head and thing about the bouncy room. Think of some quickish songs. Some hip hop, disco, pop. Think about the diffferent dance style that is required to dance to these tracks than you would use in a blues room.

    I belive that real dancing skill is not just about contact and technique, it is also about the ability to go in to one room and dance your socks off, then go in to another and still dance at the same level but with a different style.

    That would actually be the one bit of advice I give to people, spend time dancing to as much different music as you can.
    Last edited by Lee Bartholomew; 12th-June-2007 at 02:59 PM.

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    Re: Spinning videos thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy McGregor View Post
    Woodface has so much enthusiam and so much potential it would be a shame if he didn't realise that potential. What I think woodface needs is private lessons with a professional dancer.

    Sorry Woodface but I agree with this comment 100%.

    You are a great dancer, but you could be soo much better (you could be one of the best, in my opinion)

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    Re: Spinning videos thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Double Trouble View Post
    Sorry Woodface but I agree with this comment 100%.

    You are a great dancer, but you could be soo much better (you could be one of the best, in my opinion)
    Maybe one day.

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    Re: Spinning videos thread

    Quote Originally Posted by woodface View Post
    Maybe one day.
    with some technique

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    Re: You Tube Dance videos

    Quote Originally Posted by woodface View Post
    Broaden your mind with dancing.
    So.... having had time to mull it over - have you tried out any of what I was suggesting? Just curious...

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    Re: You Tube Dance videos

    Quote Originally Posted by straycat264 View Post
    So.... having had time to mull it over - have you tried out any of what I was suggesting? Just curious...
    To be honest, not yet had time. Danced last night but wasn't really the time or place for it.

    Dancing again on wendensday but that is for a demonstration so might try and have a 'techniques' session in the front room on Thursday.

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    Re: Spinning videos thread

    Quote Originally Posted by woodface View Post
    I belive that real dancing skill is not just about contact and technique, it is also about the ability to go in to one room and dance your socks off, then go in to another and still dance at the same level but with a different style.

    That would actually be the one bit of advice I give to people, spend time dancing to as much different music as you can.



    this is my intention. but we don't all wan't the same

    Just seems to me at times on this forum, people don't seem to respect that we wan't different things form dance, live and let live

    Tango is fine if thats what you wan't, and not much else, but it does limit your ability to comment, with any first hand knowledge if you don't experience other styles, I like the new funky style music been played. I would like a dance with you to that DJ

    and before its mentions I tried Tango with Ian at Southport and CrisA tried at Ashton's on Friday.



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    Re: You Tube Dance videos

    Quote Originally Posted by woodface View Post
    To be honest, not yet had time. Danced last night but wasn't really the time or place for it.

    Dancing again on wendensday but that is for a demonstration so might try and have a 'techniques' session in the front room on Thursday.
    Do let me know how you get on - as I said, I hope you find it helpful.

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    Re: You Tube Dance videos

    Quote Originally Posted by woodface View Post
    The power from the spins actually somes from a mixture of momentum, BlueEyes lead and me pushing off of her, hence It's mainly done from a catapult.
    I can seen that the power from the spin comes from a MIXTURE of sources. It was late at night and it was a bit of fun - which I can see. But if you really want BlueEyes to lead and for you to truly follow then you must allow your leader to make thier mistakes so that they can learn from them. As a follower that means only following what is led. On your video this was a late night bit of fun and it doesn't really matter. What you do later will depend on what you want in your future in terms of BlueEyes ability to lead and your ability to follow. If you "help" too much in your follow then BlueEyes will never learn to lead and you will never learn to truly follow.

    Quote Originally Posted by woodface View Post
    The things of moving. I don't know. Will have to study that at some point and experament, but it is a good point. Could also be that it was about 4am Monday morning . There are times when I go off balance. Was going to edit the first 2/3 spins I did out just leaving the good ones in but thats just cheating isn't it? I know when it's going majorly of balance and just stop.
    So it was 4am and probably were probably not at your best(s). Yes, you could have editted it. I think the only person you would have cheated would have been yourself though. People learn from their mistakes rather than their successes.

    If others see things that they think are mistakes they can offer their opinions and advice and you can mull over and evaluate that advice. You may decide that some of the advice has merit and take it on board and other stuff you don't value and don't take on board. Most people won't mind you deciding not to take on board their advice provided you a) give it proper consideration beforehand and b) don't tell them they are talking rubbish. You can give people advice but you can't make them take it. Once you have given the advice your involvement is over unless the recipient chooses to come back to you.

    As for Amir being a dance god. I believe he was a national MJ and AT champion before he even came to this country. He spent a few years teaching in this country where his lessons used to always start with movement and spinning excercises and always contained the technique that lay beneath a move. He then started a 3 year degree in dance with Ballet Rambert where he lived and breathed dance all day every day for those three years. I have seen no evidence that that has changed since he has graduated. To my knowledge he has been to Argentina twice for month long AT training.

    There is a good possibility that Amir knows SOMETHING about dance that may be useful to you. It may not be the style you covet but he sure knows something about human movement, dance and music.

    BTW. What you feel as chippy self promotion on the forum will probably seem funny to your friends that know you but to some on the forum it can come across as arrogant and abusive. IMVHO let your dancing do your talking, it will talk louder than you ever can. I have seen you dance and Like Andy McG I can see you have potential. How you choose to realise that potential is up to you

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    Re: You Tube Dance videos

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    Put it another way, can you lead your partner whilst spinning?
    Yup.

    Or at least I know people who can (Taz and Dizzy spring to mind )

    I read a while back about how silly guys felt offering their hand every time the lady came round in a multi-spin. So I tried staying very focussed on the connection and found I could keep my hands down and only offer on their final spin. (It's too subtle for me to explain, but might make sense if you play around with it)

    However because it is so subtle, I'm very focussed on the connection.

    She won't tell me, but I'm pretty certain Taz did a spin of her own whilst I was spinning in a dance where she was leading and I had my eyes closed . Assuming I'm right then we had enough connection to feel her doing her spin whilst I did mine with my eyes closed. (I could of course be wrong )

    Amir leading a lady without touch with her eyes closed Ok I can think of two ways to do it - any idea how it was done?

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