What Weekender Workshop Level are You?

[MartinHarper]

Would detailed descriptions of workshop levels do a better job of separating the wheat from the chaff than the one-word descriptions we are currently subjected to?

Beginner: You are just starting off your journey with Modern Jive, and want to do it right. You find you learn a lot from beginner classes. Dancing in freestyle might feel daunting.
You will learn the basic moves of Modern Jive and how to perform them with confidence in freestyle. You will learn important aspects of dance etiquette.

Intermediate 1: You know a variety of simple left-handed, right-handed, and two-handed moves. You are happy dancing freestyle, but can already tell how much better other dancers are. You are very comfortable in regular beginner classes, and are starting to take intermediate classes. You can spin well both on your own and with a partner. You can lead or follow with both hands, but one hand may feel better than the other. You have danced with your local teacher and may have picked up some valuable feedback that way. You don't yank your partners, or make them feel uncomfortable, and rarely fall over. In freestyle you are aware of other dancers and considerate towards them.
You will add more variety to your dancing, and learn to lead or follow all kinds of movements, from double spins to precise footwork.

Intermediate 2: You have a solid repertoire of moves, including a few "trademark" moves that are more complex or surprising. You also know some close moves, some spinny moves, some travelling moves, some footwork, and some dips. You are still learning from regular intermediate classes, but are now feeling comfortable with that level. You have been to a few weekenders. You recognise the differences between different types of music, but don't know what do with them.
You will learn to dance with more style and better technique. You will also learn the basics of musicality, fitting your dancing to the music.

Post-Intermediate: You have stopped collecting moves, and have started collecting new ways to move. You can dance to a wide variety of music, and your dancing reflects that music. You have been to many weekenders. You are one of the best dancers in your local scene. You can have great dances with international teachers and with complete beginners. You may have started teaching, or competing. Your dancing looks great and feels great. You have learnt the basics of some other dances, but are focused on Modern Jive.
You will learn to perfect your dance technique, hitting great lines and elegant sweeps that match every nuance of the music. Depending on the teachers, you may learn aerials, or drops, or other challenging moves.

Advanced: When you dance, you frequently draw a crowd of onlookers. You are a weekender regular, and one of the best dancers here. You can dance to any music at any speed, but you know which music you like best. All the other Advanced dancers know who you are, probably by name. You no longer have a repertoire of moves: you just dance. If you teach, you have taught at several weekenders. If you compete, you compete at Advanced or Open level. You search out the best national and international teachers for private tuition. You are so connected to your dance partners that it is as if they are an extension of your own body.
You will be taken to the very limit of your abilities. You will be asked to do things that defy the laws of physics. Your teachers will work you hard and give no mercy.

Given the descriptions above, which level of workshop would you take?

[David Franklin]

Would detailed descriptions of workshop levels do a better job of separating the wheat from the chaff than the one-word descriptions we are currently subjected to?

Yes. But the emphasis is on detailed. Not just the "level", but the content of the course, etc.

If the course was on, say, "hip-hop movement", I'd probably put myself as beginner. While if it was aerials, I'd go for advanced.

[Mythical]

I think it'd depend what workshop I was looking at, and wether I wanted to lead or follow (and what time in the morning it was and how hungover I was). Some stuff from all of the first four levels applies, so I'd probably work to the lowest common denominator.

[DavidY]

Do you think that organisers would run an "advanced" (according to your description) workshop at a weekender?

It certainly seems unlikely at the likes of Southport/ Ceroc Escape weekends - although I don't have knowledge of other weekends in other dance styles where maybe it's appropriate?

It feels to me that there'd be very few people at that level and they'd be (as it says in the description) looking for private lessons.

So while it's certainly a way to categorise dancers, I wonder if that is a realistic categorisation of a top level weekender workshop?

[Lory]

I'm a beginner, I can't 'lead' anything

[Andy McGregor]

Would detailed descriptions of workshop levels do a better job of separating the wheat from the chaff than the one-word descriptions we are currently subjected to?

I think this question is indicative of Martin Harper's view of the world. Wheat vs Chaff. In this comparison it's all about good and bad, maybe even useless waste products

Dancers are neither good or bad. IMHO they are more or less experienced, skilled, etc. We are all on a journey. Some people have progressed further than others on that journey. And some people have a different destination.

Maybe the derogatory comment is the reason that nobody has voted. Nobody wants to place themselves in the "chaff" category - I'm not even sure I want to be "wheat".

Come on Mr Harper, your posts are usually better worded. They are usually wrong in their premise, but this isn't due to lack of intelligence, it's usually due to warped thinking and too often relating MJ to Lindy Hop

[Andy McGregor]

I'm a beginner, I can't 'lead' anything

Apart from leading me into some ebarrassing situations

[Lory]

Apart from leading me into some ebarrassing situations

YOU lead yourself into that one, I clearly remember you rummaging though our underware, trying everything on with great excitement, I was just waiting for an opportune moment to happen and BOY did it happen

Captured on film and embedded in my memory for ever

[MartinHarper]

Come on Mr Harper, your posts are usually better worded.

My apologies. In my defence, it's 7am here, and I've not gone to bed yet.
Also, sorry for the occasional lead-centric description. Follows please feel free to "translate".

Do you think that organisers would run an "advanced" (according to your description) workshop at a weekender?

I'm thinking that there are probably around 50 people at JiveAddiction's Southport who could reasonably place themselves in the "advanced" section (please don't ask me to name them). To my mind that's enough to justify a few classes for those people, assuming that they'd find some value in spending time dancing in a study setting with the best partners in the game. A few might need to be gently pushed in the right direction, I guess. And sure, the description is gratuitously intimidating.

[Frankie_4711]

I have chosen the post-intermediate category, but as has been said before, it would depend on the workshop content - although most of the workshops that I would want to attend would probably be aimed at dancers of that sort of level anyway eg aerials, drops etc.

[MartinHarper]

I picked Intermediate II, but I might try out Post-Intermediate if I felt I could handle it. I also might try an Intermediate I class if I found the subject matter interesting.

[Mezzosoprano]

Somewhere in between Intermediate 1 and 2 - I think....but I can't lead so maybe not?

[ducasi]

I picked Intermediate II, but I might try out Post-Intermediate if I felt I could handle it. I also might try an Intermediate I class if I found the subject matter interesting.

I'm sort-of the reverse – based on the description of the dancer, I'd call myself "post intermediate" (though if there was a category between Intermediate 2 and it, I'd probably put myself there), but I might still choose to go to a "intermediate 2" class, depending on the content and teacher.

[MartinHarper]

Sorry, Mezzosoprano, I just realised I've been unclear in my description.

You can lead or follow with both hands

This meant that you can either lead with both hands (if you're a leader) or follow with both hands (if you're a follower), not that you can do both! I guess this could have been worded better.

[Ghost]

Ok I selected "beginner"

I wouldn't say I can spin well (I don't spin when leading, though that is from choice) and I haven't been to any weekenders

[Trouble]

it depends on many things as to what level i am.....

1. Time of the month
2. Men around me
3. Teacher
4. Atmosphere
5. If im feeling sexy or not
6. The man im dancing with is attractive or Andy Mcgregor
7. Ive had a drink or two
8. My week has been a good one.

These all effect, quite drastically, the level at which i dance.

[tsh]

There seems to be a huge gap between intermediate II and post intermediate - maybe it's intentional. Although I'm not sure that my dancing is in the post intermediate category, that is probably the type of class (in MJ) where I'd want to be learning things. I wouldn't necessarily expect the level of the class to be difficult but I would expect to learn and practice concepts that would improve my dancing. That being said, if there was a beginners class by a teacher I respect, I'd be likely to chose that instead.

I don't believe that aerials and drops fit into this grading scheme at all. It's not necessary to be able to dance to do a lift or a drop. I've seen acrobatics taught successfully to complete beginners.

I wouldn't expect classes at these levels on a MJ weekender (although Southport certainly has enough people in the advanced group - but they seem to have an informal semi-class in the blues room to trade ideas) - certainly other styles would use them, but there there is more need for the intermediates to have a chance to focus on moves at about the equivalent of 'jango fundamentals' level (anyone can do them in a class, not so easy to lead with a beginner).

Sean

Sean

[straycat]

It would depend on the workshop. Move-based ones, put me into Inter II. In entirely connection-based or musicality-based workshops I'd put myself into advanced (who - me? Modest?). I'd happily do an Inter I or even beginners' spinning workshop. In the unlikely event of me trying an aerials workshop, I'd seek out the remedial category

It's true that I don't really have a repertoire of moves, but 'just dance' - but then... I never had much of a repertoire of moves, and anyway - I'm a long way from having followed the progression described here.

Anyway - to summarise, if I could, I'd check all the categories. I love to be difficult.

[Dreadful Scathe]

I would check all the catagories too, depends on a lot of things, style and teacher being the main ones. Also, previous experience with "advanced" classes tell me they're not all that advanced in the MJ world at least

[Wuzzle]

I would say am somewhere between R in BeginneR and one of the vowels in intermediate 1

Quite content with learning new gorram shiny stuff