Who Should Help Struggling Intermediate Newbies?

[StokeBloke]

Here's a hypothetical situation that I'm sure many of you can relate to.

You are in the intermediate class and you get to dance with a relative newbie. They have just decided to move up to the intermediate class, and really from their ability they are out of their depth. They may have moved up for a variety of reasons, over confidence or perhaps the six week mantra that teachers seem so fond of chanting (Ohh that's another thread right there).

1. Who, if anyone, should take responsibility and speak to them about this?
2. What would your advice be if you were to give it?
3. How do you feel is the best way to deal with this situation? Knowing that they may hurt themselves or someone they are dancing with, should you speak out and risk upsetting them, or keep schtum for fear of upsetting them?

N.B. This is a slight rewording of a question posed by Woodface earlier today. Play nice please

[dave the scaffolder]

Here's a hypothetical situation that I'm sure many of you can relate to.

You are in the intermediate class and you get to dance with a relative newbie. They have just decided to move up to the intermediate class, and really from their ability they are out of their depth. They may have moved up for a variety of reasons, over confidence or perhaps the six week mantra that teachers seem so fond of chanting (Ohh that's another thread right there).

1. Who, if anyone, should take responsibility and speak to them about this?
2. What would your advice be if you were to give it?
3. How do you feel is the best way to deal with this situation? Knowing that they may hurt themselves or someone they are dancing with, should you speak out and risk upsetting them, or keep schtum for fear of upsetting them?

N.B. This is a slight rewording of a question posed by Woodface earlier today. Play nice please

When i first went into the intermediates class i stepped out on more than one occasion and a couple of experienced ladies stepped out and went one on one with me on many an occasion.

Without their help i would not be the fantastic and modest dancer that i am today.

Seriously tho before i started seeing Trouble, and learning together, i would often take a newbie to one side and run thro the moves until she was more confident to carry on.

I think it is everyones responsibility to encourage and nuture newbies, because todays newbies are tomorrows rising stars.
XXX XXX DTS

[Lee Bartholomew]

I tell them to take up Darts / Snooker / Fishing etc


Seriously, I don't think there is really much that can be done other than giving them alot of dance time in freestyle.

[drathzel]

As a teacher of a smaller class i watch out for my intermediates during the class, especially if i know they have just moved up.

After my class i will then ask them for a dance, not mentioning how they did the class. I will then prompt them to try that nights routine. At this point i will help that person with the move/s that they are having trouble with. After we have run through it a few time i will encourage them, ask for a second dance and not mention the moves, if they put them in great if not then thats fine.

If the ladies are struggling i will lead them and see if its the leads fault or whether the lady just isnt getting the move. I then repeat as above.

[dave the scaffolder]

We as men in MJ are in an elite group. There is always more women than men, and if as a man you can dance half decent you are in an enviable position.

If we then become aloof and standoffish we can easily put off newbie women.

Therefore i will never refuse a woman a dance because the confidence it takes to ask a man for a dance is enormous. When i have been refused i am gutted i am sure it is worst for women as it is not a natural thing to do to ask a man to dance.

So always say yes always smile and tell them how wonderful they are, because eventually the majority of them will be.

XXX XXX DTS

[StokeBloke]

As a teacher of a smaller class i watch out for my intermediates during the class, especially if i know they have just moved up.

Cool plan Do you make the taxis aware of potential problems too, as I assume they are off taking the review and are then only allowed to dance with beginners for the main part of the rest of the evening leaving the new intermediate dancers a bit exposed. I always thought that was a strange way for the taxis to be used (yet again another thread perhaps).

[Lee Bartholomew]

I dance with a few beginners a night. Try to always get a dance with 2-3 people I have never danced with before.

Have danced with beginners that were great. Have danced with some that were painful. Have danced with some that were just 'ok'.

[Beowulf]

I for one didn't move up for at least 12 weeks. I think I did every beginners move AT LEAST twice in class before I even considered moving up. it was probably nearer 2 months in beginners before I "advanced"

I am not really in the situation to criticise anyone's dancing, but if someone's got a vice like grip I will suggest they stop gripping.. for their benefit as much as mine, or if they have spaghetti arms I will "suggest" that "perhaps" they could do with a little more tension. But I put it to them in a way that suggests they'll get more out of it if they do so.

I don't suggest to people in intermediates that they're doing things wrong or if they haven't got things right as ,chances are, the other 10-15-20-or so followers I've attempted the routine with have thought the same about me !!

Like woodface stated, I don't/can't really do anything except dance with them and hope they get lots of practice in Freestyle. Luckily we have excellent teachers up here and Lisa is very mobile and works the class afterwards.. She dances with everyone and is very good at giving you a little 1-on-1 and suggestions. I know she's grabbed me for a dance at times (when I've been fit and able that is) and my dancing has improved for it.

I think IMHO that's really the only option. The beginner/intermediate/advanced level thing is really only arbitrary anyway, people take dancing WAY too seriously. It's a fun and healthy hobby.

You don't see many 5 a side football teams saying "no you can't join our team until you can score 10 goals from the center line and keep the ball in the air for 10 mins in keepy-uppy!" (or maybe you do.. I never liked football so I don't know! )

[Lee Bartholomew]

I only done one beginners class. Was asked by my MJ teacher to do the intermediate on the second week as not enough men!!!!!!!

[drathzel]

Cool plan Do you make the taxis aware of potential problems too, as I assume they are off taking the review and are then only allowed to dance with beginners for the main part of the rest of the evening leaving the new intermediate dancers a bit exposed. I always thought that was a strange way for the taxis to be used (yet again another thread perhaps).

Some of my taxis will still grab new intermediates as some weeks there arent enough beginners to keep them busy. I do say anyone who is a new intermediate can still use the taxis.

I advise people to take 8 weeks of beginners before then attempting the intermediates as well as sticking with the beginners class (not just turning up for intermediate) for a further 4 weeks at least.

During this 12 week time they can use the taxis after this then they have me and Lynn (lynn is acting as an intermediate taxi , although not official, as she was aware that i cant get round every intermediate in a night and she offered to help) to sort them out. I stay to the very end of the night and dance as much as i can. This way i can help my newbies.

Also my bangor class is a small class and i find that i can get round everyone with a few songs to spare. I have offered to help any intermediates who want to travel down to bangor and give them some more one on one tutition. It has helped them and i will only be sad that as my classes grow i wont have the time to do so much.

[Trouble]

When i first went into the intermediates class i stepped out on more than one occasion and a couple of experienced ladies stepped out and went one on one with me on many an occasion.

Without their help i would not be the fantastic and modest dancer that i am today.

Seriously tho before i started seeing Trouble, and learning together, i would often take a newbie to one side and run thro the moves until she was more confident to carry on.

I think it is everyones responsibility to encourage and nuture newbies, because todays newbies are tomorrows rising stars.
XXX XXX DTS

yes hunny thats true but now you say:

im not going to that bloody club cause im sick of dancing with the bloody beginners.

Seriously though. This is also a gripe of mine. I pay my £8 to get into a Ceroc evening. Then spend the whole of the classes teaching for free. There is no reward for that as far as im concerned. The only people benefiting out of it are the Ceroc Venue managers and of course the beginners. This is why i will only do freestyles now. Its ok saying, oh the pleasure you get out of it seeing them move on blah blah blah but all that happens is you end up with beginner stalkers wanting you to dance with them all night regardless if your working or not. Regardless of the venue your at. Sometimes its just nice to just dance.

[dave the scaffolder]

yes hunny thats true but now you say:

im not going to that bloody club cause im sick of dancing with the bloody beginners.

My God woman i was on a roll there. You have just me shot knees off, i could have been the next MJ saint..

Hows the car by the way?
XXX XXX DTS

[SnowWhite]

I think dancing with 'Struggling Intermediate Newbies' (SIN's) is a very selfish thing to do.

From personal experience I know I remember every guy who ever took the time, and had the patience to put himself through those dances with me in the early days - and I never miss the opportunity to dance with them when I can.

If that works in reverse - then when some of these SINs have turned into amazing hotshots, who normally wouldn't give me the time of day - I've already bought myself all the dances I want!!!

How good is that!

[dave the scaffolder]

I think dancing with 'Struggling Intermediate Newbies' (SIN's) is a very selfish thing to do.

From personal experience I know I remember every guy who ever took the time, and had the patience to put himself through those dances with me in the early days - and I never miss the opportunity to dance with them when I can.

If that works in reverse - then when some of these SINs have turned into amazing hotshots, who normally wouldn't give me the time of day - I've already bought myself all the dances I want!!!

How good is that!

Can you clarify what you are saying here. XXX XXX DTS

[Beowulf]

I think dancing with 'Struggling Intermediate Newbies' (SIN's) is a very selfish thing to do.

From personal experience I know I remember every guy who ever took the time, and had the patience to put himself through those dances with me in the early days - and I never miss the opportunity to dance with them when I can.

If that works in reverse - then when some of these SINs have turned into amazing hotshots, who normally wouldn't give me the time of day - I've already bought myself all the dances I want!!!

How good is that!

Can you clarify what you are saying here. XXX XXX DTS

I was a little confused at first but then I realise that by Selfish she means that she gets the benefit.

So it's a selfLESS act done for selfISH reasons She dances with (what she calls) SINs so that she can claim a dance with them later when they are much much better !!





I think?

[SnowWhite]

I was a little confused at first but then I realise that by Selfish she means that she gets the benefit.

So it's a selfLESS act done for selfISH reasons She dances with (what she calls) SINs so that she can claim a dance with them later when they are much much better !!





I think?

A dance?

Try lots...

[FoxyFunkster]

[It`s the responsibility of all of us to help anyone in whatever way we can IMHO, as long as it`s done in a friendly and informal way then we shouldn`t wait to see who`s responsibilty it is, i don`t think everyone will take as kindly to the offer of help as others but the majority will be very grateful for the advice and help....
i actually saw a teacher stop a couple mid dance because this guy was yanking and pulling the poor girl around with the best of em as well as dancing so far off the beat it was unreal, but it was done in a very friendly way and he took the advice brilliantly, he improved no end after a short one to one session with the teacher.....

[Twirly]

Don’t most leads struggle a bit for a while when they go from beginners to intermediates – mostly with remembering moves? (Apart from Woodface that is )

I’ve chatted to several relatively new intermediates who have had this problem. I usually ask if they’ve done workshops, and if they haven’t suggest that they do some. If they have, but are still struggling, then I suggest they just try and remember one move each week or fortnight – if necessary, writing it down immediately after the class (think I read that suggestion on here somewhere).

On one occasion, I did point someone out to the taxi dancers. It was his second week (he told me in beginners) and he decided to do intermediates. He’d been clueless in beginners. I didn’t say anything to him, just told the taxi dancer what had happened, and I did spot her with him later. The following week he did beginners and the review class. I’m not sure if he came back after that.

[ducasi]

I don't try to correct SINs too much, but instead encourage them. While a mini private lesson during the class may be intended to help, it can also have the opposite effect.

I think taxi dancers, if able, should still be there for the new intermediates, but the responsibility of teaching falls to the teacher.

[MartinHarper]

You are in the intermediate class and you get to dance with a relative newbie. They have just decided to move up to the intermediate class, and really from their ability they are out of their depth. They may have moved up for a variety of reasons, over confidence or perhaps the six week mantra...

If I'm leading, I just lead what I'm meant to lead, as I'm meant to lead it. She will of course mess it up, as she can't follow yet. Then I say nothing and leave her to draw her own conclusions. If I'm leading, and my partner is backleading, I lead in a way that communicates to her that she is backleading, and say nothing.

If I'm following, I do my best to follow what's being lead. This is very difficult, as it often bears little relationship to either the beat, or to the move(s) being taught. This is always a big opportunity to improve my following skills.