Results 1 to 10 of 10

Thread: What should be the criteria for different freestyle categories at competitions?

  1. #1
    Basically lazy robd's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Nr Cambridge
    Posts
    3,696
    Rep Power
    12

    What should be the criteria for different freestyle categories at competitions?

    Whilst contemplating entering the Ceroc Champs last week (left it too late ultimately even for a 'no practice - just find a partner' effort) I was having difficulty deciding which category would be appropriate to enter. On the one hand I have been dancing now since the start of 2005 which strikes me as a long time to be going in at entry level. On the other hand I have never competed save a couple of fun DWAS at normal freestyle nights. I do believe that people should not compete at different levels in the same comp (e.g intermediate and advanced at the Champs even though it may be with different partners) - in my mind, you are either one level or you are the other.

    I looked at the requirements for the entry level category (not always called intermediate) and the logical next category on the major comp sites (couldn't find the Scottish Champs site) and they all differ but tend to split along either
    * length of time dancing
    * previous competing achievement
    The criteria for each comp is as follows (my additional comments in bold)

    Entry Level

    Champs
    This section is recommended (use of the word recommended is interesting - see also the Leroc criteria) for those who have danced for six months or more but do not wish to compete with the Advanced dancers.

    Leroc
    This section is recommended for those who have danced for at least 6 months. Dancers from the Advanced freestyle section will not be permitted to enter this section. Not for teachers or professionals.

    Britrock
    This section is for couples neither who have won an intermediate or better category at any modern jive competition.

    Blackpool
    Called 'novice' - Freestyle dancing, this section is open to couples that have been dancing for less than 9 months.How is this verified?

    Next Level

    Champs
    This is the advanced freestyle section. It is recommended for those who want to compete with the best.What about the Open??

    Leroc
    This section is recommended for those who have been dancing for one year or more. Dancers from the intermediate section will not be permitted to enter this section. Not for teachers or professionals.

    Britrock
    There is no 'middle' level freestyle category - the next level is the open category

    Blackpool
    Called 'Intermediate' - Freestyle dancing. No teachers or professionals

    Now I know the obvious answer to 'What category should you enter?' is 'Whichever is the most applicable to your situation based on the rules of the specific competition' but I'd still like people's views on what criteria they think should be applied when deciding what is the most suitable category. Should it be length of dancing experience? Previous competition achievements? I saw a few people in the intermediate at the Champs this Sunday who I thought really should have been in advanced IMO but who were perfectly entitled to enter Intermediate based on the criteria given. The significant excess of competitors in the Intermediate compared with the Advanced also suggests that perhaps a review of the criteria for entry to the two categories might be in order. I guess forcing teachers into the Open also has an impact here as there were some competitors in the Open who would IMO have been more suited to the Advanced but I know that debate has been had here before.

    Robert

  2. #2
    Dickie Davies' love-child Cruella's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Rugby
    Posts
    6,159
    Rep Power
    13

    Re: What should be the criteria for different freestyle categories at competitions?

    This is an interesting question. I would be perfectly happy to enter at an intermediate level and i've been dancing nearly 10 years! But I haven't a 'competition style' i'm not a showy dancer so would feel under pressure in the advanced as I don't have any big showy ladies styling. I'd want to be having fun not feeling old, fat and frumpy next to all these young, nubile girls in their itsy bitsy costumes doing the splits etc. But by the ruling I should do the Advanced. What if I was competing with someone that had only been dancing for 6 months? I don't really think time frame can be taken into consideration, there are people out there that have been dancing for years that have no chance of being placed but others that have only danced for a short time that look fantastic . I think previous competition experience is far more important.

  3. #3
    Lovely Moderator ducasi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Glasgow
    Posts
    10,015
    Rep Power
    14

    Re: What should be the criteria for different freestyle categories at competitions?

    Obviously those dancers that are better than me should be in the next category up – anything else is unfair!
    Let your mind go and your body will follow. – Steve Martin, LA Story

  4. #4
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Sunny KSA :/
    Posts
    3,383
    Rep Power
    10

    Re: What should be the criteria for different freestyle categories at competitions?

    Quote Originally Posted by robd View Post
    Whilst contemplating entering the Ceroc Champs last week (left it too late ultimately even for a 'no practice - just find a partner' effort) I was having difficulty deciding which category would be appropriate to enter. On the one hand I have been dancing now since the start of 2005 which strikes me as a long time to be going in at entry level. On the other hand I have never competed save a couple of fun DWAS at normal freestyle nights. I do believe that people should not compete at different levels in the same comp (e.g intermediate and advanced at the Champs even though it may be with different partners) - in my mind, you are either one level or you are the other.
    *snip*
    Now I know the obvious answer to 'What category should you enter?' is 'Whichever is the most applicable to your situation based on the rules of the specific competition' but I'd still like people's views on what criteria they think should be applied when deciding what is the most suitable category. Should it be length of dancing experience? Previous competition achievements? I saw a few people in the intermediate at the Champs this Sunday who I thought really should have been in advanced IMO but who were perfectly entitled to enter Intermediate based on the criteria given. The significant excess of competitors in the Intermediate compared with the Advanced also suggests that perhaps a review of the criteria for entry to the two categories might be in order. I guess forcing teachers into the Open also has an impact here as there were some competitors in the Open who would IMO have been more suited to the Advanced but I know that debate has been had here before.
    I’m used to competing under rules that use both time, competition achievements, teaching level and performance level as the criteria level, I’m also used to more levels – 4 or 5 levels of Freestyle.

    Beginners – for those who have had less than 40 classes or been dancing less than 12 months

    Intermediate B – for those who have had more than 40 classes, been dancing more than 12 months or have placed in Beginner section in any Modern Jive Style Competition up to and including the previous competition.

    Intermediate A – for those who have had more than 40 classes and/or more than 1 year dancing Modern Jive and/or are a:
    • Regular Intermediate class demonstrator.
    • Regular Show Performer.
    • Beginner Progression teacher who does not qualify for Advanced
    • place-getter (ie 1st, 2nd or 3rd) in the Intermediate B Freestyle (or equivalent) section in any Modern Jive Style Competition up to and including the previous competition.


    Advanced – if for all Mainstream Modern Jive or similar teachers/regular show performers and demonstrators considered by the organisors to fall into this category and/or placed 1st, 2nd or 3rd in the Intermediate A Freestyle (or equivalent) section in any Modern Jive Style Competition up to and including the up to and including the previous competition.

    Champions– This is the category for Advanced dancers who have placed 1st on two or more occasions, or any combination of 1st, 2nd or 3rd placings on 3 or more occasions in any Modern Jive style competitions at Advanced Freestyle or higher eg, Masters Level.

    Competitors have 12 months to compete at a given level – so if you place at a particular comp you don’t have to go up a level until the next time that comp comes along.

    In the nature of honesty – I’ll admit I have cribbed this from the 2007 CMJ comp rules and generalised them as well as removing references to assessment cards – there was/is one comp only requires you to have placed once to move have to Compete in Champions!!!(some comps call Champions, Masters) In some comps there is only one intermediate level.


    Having now seen 2 Modern Jive Comps and read the rules for a number of others I really appreciate the different levels that they use for comps in Australia – the ability to compete against your peers and to be able to progress through a number of levels makes it a much less daunting experience.

    Have really come to appreciate why so many people here look at me in horror when I ask have they considered competing… in many cases people are forced into levels in which they feel they will be completely out classes.

    The category I find the hardest to understand here is open it encompasses such a broad skill level as to be rather incomprehensible to me – to be in the same category in my second comp in the UK against Yuko & Phil and Simon & Nicole was a truly daunting prospect

  5. #5
    Registered User FoxyFunkster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Aldgate London
    Posts
    490
    Rep Power
    9

    Re: What should be the criteria for different freestyle categories at competitions?

    Quote Originally Posted by robd View Post
    I do believe that people should not compete at different levels in the same comp (e.g intermediate and advanced at the Champs even though it may be with different partners) - in my mind, you are either one level or you are the other.

    Sorry Rob can`t quite agree with this statement, surely it`s the standard of the couple rather than of the individual ??? why shouldn`t people be allowed to compete is as many sections as they like????.....another point i`d like to make is this, people generally don`t kid themselves about their dancing and i didn`t think anyone looked out of their depth nor competed at too higher level on sunday..... if anything i think you`ll find people will generally challenge themselves at a more demanding category if anything....

    by the way is anyone up for competing in the showcase section next year....i was thinking of doing a jango style routine wearing hob nailed boots and using umbrellas, also i was thinking of wearing some boots no7 make up to look like a dead person all performed with style to Musicology by prince!!
    Last edited by ducasi; 8th-May-2007 at 08:03 PM. Reason: watch those quotes!

  6. #6
    Dickie Davies' love-child Cruella's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Rugby
    Posts
    6,159
    Rep Power
    13

    Re: What should be the criteria for different freestyle categories at competitions?

    Quote Originally Posted by FoxyFunkster View Post
    by the way is anyone up for competing in the showcase section next year....i was thinking of doing a jango style routine wearing hob nailed boots and using umbrellas, also i was thinking of wearing some boots no7 make up to look like a dead person all performed with style to Musicology by prince!!
    Oh go on then, well I have the boots, umbrella, make up and I even have big knickers like Mary Poppins too............

  7. #7
    Registered User Ickle Chick'n's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Paignton
    Posts
    88
    Rep Power
    10

    Re: What should be the criteria for different freestyle categories at competitions?

    Quote Originally Posted by robd View Post
    I do believe that people should not compete at different levels in the same comp (e.g intermediate and advanced at the Champs even though it may be with different partners) - in my mind, you are either one level or you are the other.
    I am afraid I totally agree with this. I was suprised last year, whilst a spectator at the ceroc champs, to see one guy compete in the intermediates and the advanced, albeit with different partners, but to see this year someone competing at intemediates and Open level I think is even worse. As a competitor at intermediate level I was quite upset by this. I agree there are all sorts of arguments when deciding what level to compete at but at least pick one, particularly the lead as yes it is a partnership but the lead decides a great deal of what is performed, the follower adding style, following skills, a sense of interaction/feeling etc.

    I have been told by various people that they;d expect me to compete t Advanced level for which I am very flattered but for me my decision has been based on a number of factor which may help others decide for themselves hat to do if they want to enter so I'll mention them briefly... (trying to be brief!)

    1. My reasons for competing are not to prove a point, like some people I know, and try to say I'm the best dancer abuot, it is something for me to aim at, measure myself against and push myself to improve for. In other styles of dance I've done there have been certificates or medals to go for to mark a progression, there is no such thing in MJ so competitions is it for me.

    2. Competition dancing, in my eyes, is very different to general freestyle as you have to consider other parties in the dance, it is no longer you, your partner and the music as before, particularly in blues where I was challenging myself previously, you also have to present to judges/audience. It's almost like learning another form of dance, a challenge in itself.

    3. I have been dancing for a while now but I still have a lot to learn for styling etc as it's not something I was confident about doing before.

    4: My partner, who asked me to compete after he'd only been dancing 3 months, has only been dancing for about 10 months now so is still finding his feet and we have a lot to learn and develope as a partnership still.

    Lastly: Because my reasons for competing is to mark my personal development as much as for the fun and challenge of it all I feel that until I place or win an intermediate level comp I am entitled to continue to compete at this level until I get 'good enough' to do so at which point I would then progress to Advanced.

    The leroc champs say they will move you up if you are obviously in the wrong category and this has actually been shown to have been carried out as Becky and her partner were moved up to advanced category and went on to win it the year before last!

    It depends who you're doing comps for and your conscience to how honestly you will pick your category to compete in I think but only individuals can decide really, based on the rough guidelines set by various organisers. As for the Open...I think the name itself explains it is open to everybdy, including teachers to complete novices if they see themselves as good enough in their eyes, who's to say they can't enter, though I would expect them not to win unless they were amazing of course!

  8. #8
    Registered User Rhythm King's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    In London, by the
    Posts
    3,057
    Rep Power
    11

    Re: What should be the criteria for different freestyle categories at competitions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ickle Chick'n View Post
    Lastly: Because my reasons for competing is to mark my personal development as much as for the fun and challenge of it all I feel that until I place or win an intermediate level comp I am entitled to continue to compete at this level until I get 'good enough' to do so at which point I would then progress to Advanced.


    I agree with Ickle Chick'n's comments, especially on advancement to the next category. Surely you should compete in the lowest category you fit, then move up on placing. Having said that I was bemused to see at least one person dancing in the Intermediates this year, who danced in the Open last year. So what are the criteria for moving down then?

  9. #9
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    bedford
    Posts
    4,899
    Rep Power
    13

    Re: What should be the criteria for different freestyle categories at competitions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rhythm King View Post
    ...I was bemused to see at least one person dancing in the Intermediates this year, who danced in the Open last year. So what are the criteria for moving down then?
    Open is "Open". A novice can enter, there is no "down".

  10. #10
    Registered User Spiky Steve's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Beckenham
    Posts
    433
    Rep Power
    9

    Re: What should be the criteria for different freestyle categories at competitions?

    I think maybe this is difficult like judging criteria.

    Take two examples. One person with no dance training and and no competition experience due to a shortage of teachers locally decides to teach and maybe even only up to the beginners moves. They have to enter the Open category.

    Someone with copious amounts of dance training even at a proper dance school and maybe other training in other dance styles can enter the intermediate category.

    Don't know what the answer is but doesn't seem fair to me.

    Oh! and I fall into neither of the above....

    Spiky Steve

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Bedford Kempston freestyle Easter Sunday
    By Lost Leader in forum Social events
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: 10th-April-2007, 08:18 PM
  2. Freestyle info./whos going to Southport?
    By V C in forum Let's talk about dance
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 27th-December-2006, 02:33 PM
  3. What is Freestyle in Dance Competitions?
    By Roger C in forum Let's talk about dance
    Replies: 64
    Last Post: 3rd-August-2005, 08:38 AM
  4. Time for competitions to evolve ?
    By RobC in forum Let's talk about dance
    Replies: 55
    Last Post: 7th-August-2004, 08:09 PM
  5. Competition Categories
    By Andy McGregor in forum Let's talk about dance
    Replies: 47
    Last Post: 3rd-April-2004, 02:03 PM

Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •