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Thread: 10% my Arse

  1. #121
    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: 10% my Arse

    Quote Originally Posted by El Salsero Gringo View Post
    I'm now completely confused about Franco's balancing policy now - for my peace of mind could someone summarise it accurately for me?

    Does he / doesn't he?

    If he does, is that based on men/women or self-avowed leader/follower roles?
    Tell me about it - I lost the will to live halfway through reading the post... but OK, stripped of most of the ranting, I think relevant parts are

    Quote Originally Posted by Franco / MaxBeat
    I have never said at any time that due to the survey’s outcome I would gender control the events. Scotttwin’s fails to understand that “leaders and followers control” is not gender based, as anyone would be free to book either role irrespective of their gender.

    More to the point, there was no survey, but a voting process, which, as advertised on my web site at the time was in fact won by only 4 votes by those who did not wish to see gender control implemented (voting returned: 249 against 245 in favor). What I had publicly stated on my web site at the time { rant } was that tickets will be made available to all, albeit one gender if need be would have been allowed to purchase an extra specified amount of tickets. This would counter act any possible claim by any party of “indirect sex discrimination”, where, as it is the case at present, there are more women then men looking to buy tickets.
    I've read it three times now and I still don't understand it. And I make a living from trying to explain complex things in an understandable manner.

    But if I had to guess, I'd say he's sitting on the fence. Can someone explain it to us in a simple manner, answering the questions as ESG's put them?

  2. #122
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    Re: 10% my Arse

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    Tell me about it - I lost the will to live halfway through reading the post...
    Have you considered reading the rest of it then?

  3. #123
    Formerly known as DavidJames David Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: 10% my Arse

    Quote Originally Posted by TheTramp View Post
    Have you considered reading the rest of it then?
    Alas, I managed to struggle through.

  4. #124
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    Re: 10% my Arse

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidJames View Post
    Alas, I managed to struggle through.
    RIP DavidJames....

  5. #125
    Registered User El Salsero Gringo's Avatar
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    Re: 10% my Arse

    Quote Originally Posted by TheTramp View Post
    Have you considered reading the rest of it then?
    You're a lawyer. Pretend it's an instruction from a client that you have to explain to your principal. What's it all about? (And is now an appropriate time to re-introduce the "gender" vs. "sex" debate, or shall I wait till later?)

  6. #126
    Registered User stewart38's Avatar
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    Re: 10% my Arse

    Quote Originally Posted by El Salsero Gringo View Post
    You're a lawyer. Pretend it's an instruction from a client that you have to explain to your principal. What's it all about? (And is now an appropriate time to re-introduce the "gender" vs. "sex" debate, or shall I wait till later?)
    What id like to know is when does gender balance ‘kick in’

    e.g. 600 men places 600 women places

    Do they wait for 500 women places sold and see they have only sold 250 men ? ooops

    As women panic more and men get more laid back this ‘kicking in’ will happen earlier ??

  7. #127
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    Re: 10% my Arse

    I do recommend reading Franco's post on the thread I linked earlier. Regardless, here's a quick precis.

    1. Balancing is done based on leader/follow roles, not gender or sex. Those who book tickets as leaders will be "expected" to lead in classes and freestyle. Similarly for followers.

    2. Balancing is not intended to be exact, nor does it aim for a 50-50 split. There are ~100 extra tickets available for whichever role turns out to be more popular.

    I hope that this sets ESG's mind at rest.

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    Re: 10% my Arse

    Quote Originally Posted by stewart38 View Post
    What id like to know is when does gender balance ‘kick in’
    According to the draft policy Franco emailed you, and you posted on the forum:

    Quote Originally Posted by Franco
    An equal number of tickets for Leaders and Followers will be made available at the onset. However, these will be sold in batches such that neither the Leader nor the Follower group will be allowed to have a gap of more than 100 tickets between each other.

  9. #129
    Registered User El Salsero Gringo's Avatar
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    Re: 10% my Arse

    Quote Originally Posted by MartinHarper View Post
    I hope that this sets ESG's mind at rest.
    It does, thank you Martin. It's been a fraught morning, so Nanny's warmed me a bottle and I going to have that then a lie down for my afternoon nap.

  10. #130
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    Re: 10% my Arse

    Quote Originally Posted by MartinHarper View Post
    1. Balancing is done based on leader/follow roles, not gender or sex. Those who book tickets as leaders will be "expected" to lead in classes and freestyle. Similarly for followers.
    How would they enforce that? "Sorry Miss Batty we are out of follow tickets", "Oh, that's ok I can lead", "Right you are then one ticket coming up then".

    Would you have the some blue/pink armbands on? If I decided to dance as a follower in freestyle for a dance would the gender police pull me off the dance floor and beat me up, in a dark room, with rubber truncheons?

  11. #131
    Registered User Tessalicious's Avatar
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    Re: 10% my Arse

    Does seem a little strange - I don't think I'd ever be able to go to Franco's Camber (even if I wanted to) because I'd hate to feel like I had to be restricted to leading or following for the entire weekend. Especially if there were women over, I'd just spend the whole time feeling guilty for something, whether it was being there as a leader and still wanting to follow or being there as a follow and therefore keeping one other lady out of the place.
    Quote Originally Posted by kt
    Would you have the some blue/pink armbands on?
    Honestly Gary, how terribly un-PC. Yellow and Green armbands would be much more appropriate (can't have black and white cos that's racist, can't have red cos it's too much like pink, which in turn is too much of a gay icon colour, can't have orange cos that's Ceroc, can't have purple cos that suggests sexual frustration, can't have brown 'cos it would offend rehabilitated chocaholics).

  12. #132
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    Re: 10% my Arse

    Quote Originally Posted by MartinHarper View Post
    I do recommend reading Franco's post on the thread I linked earlier. Regardless, here's a quick precis.

    1. Balancing is done based on leader/follow roles, not gender or sex. Those who book tickets as leaders will be "expected" to lead in classes and freestyle. Similarly for followers.

    2. Balancing is not intended to be exact, nor does it aim for a 50-50 split. There are ~100 extra tickets available for whichever role turns out to be more popular.

    I hope that this sets ESG's mind at rest.
    It may do his, but not mine.

    That's just weird.

    How on earth are they going to enforce that - wristbands? Are "leader" women going to be ejected if they dare to follow or vice versa?

    And what's the point of a "balancing" policy which inherently aims for 100 more women at every event anyway? Why bother?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tessalicious View Post
    Honestly Gary, how terribly un-PC. Yellow and Green armbands would be much more appropriate (can't have black and white cos that's racist, can't have red cos it's too much like pink, which in turn is too much of a gay icon colour, can't have orange cos that's Ceroc, can't have purple cos that suggests sexual frustration, can't have brown 'cos it would offend rehabilitated chocaholics).
    So, what you're really saying is, "Wristbands Are Evil"?

  13. #133
    Registered User killingtime's Avatar
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    Re: 10% my Arse

    Quote Originally Posted by Tessalicious View Post
    Honestly Gary, how terribly un-PC. Yellow and Green armbands would be much more appropriate
    Oh I was going for pink for leads and blue for followers.

    They had them at Storm in those colours, ma'am. What is good enough for Ceroc is surely good enough for the rest of the world?

  14. #134
    Forum Bombshell - Our Queen! Lory's Avatar
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    Re: 10% my Arse

    I've just had this funny vision...

    All these lovely 'extra women' standing a round and S38 saunters casually over and asks one of them to dance and she replies, "Sorry, i'm only allowed to lead!"

    Sorry Stewart
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  15. #135
    Registered User stewart38's Avatar
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    Re: 10% my Arse

    Quote Originally Posted by Lory View Post
    I've just had this funny vision...

    All these lovely 'extra women' standing a round and S38 saunters casually over and asks one of them to dance and she replies, "Sorry, i'm only allowed to lead!"

    Sorry Stewart

    As a leader I dont follow ???

    The gender kick in is explained by Franco but not ceroc etc ? or is it ie if a gap of a 100 or more appears

  16. #136
    Registered User El Salsero Gringo's Avatar
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    Re: 10% my Arse

    Quote Originally Posted by stewart38 View Post
    As a leader I dont follow ???

    The gender kick in is explained by Franco but not ceroc etc ? or is it ie if a gap of a 100 or more appears
    Instead of asking here, why not email ceroc to ask?

  17. #137
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    Re: 10% my Arse

    Quote Originally Posted by stewart38 View Post
    As a leader I dont follow ???
    Not if that was the premise you booked on/prerequisite to you getting a place

    What would be the point of the so called 'balancing' then?
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    Re: 10% my Arse

    Quote Originally Posted by killingtime View Post
    Would you have the some blue/pink armbands on?
    Colour-coded wristbands/armbands seem to be the way gender balancing is handled at many events, including Ceroc events. I'd expect jivetime to do the same thing with their role balancing.

    It is irritating that this policy isn't on the jivetime website. I shouldn't really have to go to the Ceroc Scotland forum to get an idea of what their policy is.

  19. #139
    Registered User stewart38's Avatar
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    Re: 10% my Arse

    Quote Originally Posted by Lory View Post
    Not if that was the premise you booked on/prerequisite to you getting a place

    What would be the point of the so called 'balancing' then?
    That was a joke ??

    Quote Originally Posted by El Salsero Gringo View Post
    Instead of asking here, why not email ceroc to ask?
    Ive sent a e-mail to Mike Ellard and if he is kind enough to respond I said ill publish it on here

    However 94% of questions posted on here the answer could be found elsewhere, just thought someone may know.

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