It amazes me that knowing people who have been going for years still don't know where to go when they reach the end of a row (especially the men).
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It amazes me that knowing people who have been going for years still don't know where to go when they reach the end of a row (especially the men).
Ah sorry, I meant the guy can always step forward if the follow takes big steps, not back.
[/quote] You sound like a gentleman, but some guys are as stubborn as mules, and won't be told anything.
You know, could it just be the London guys because there are so many venues in London and it would be easy for them to keep up bad practice?
In a place where there are not many venues these mules would have to sort themselves out because otherwise there would come a day when no one would deign to dance with them.[quote]
London again.He's a twat. What's the betting that he had a middle class accent.Quote:
he then looked me up and down and said " i can count perfectly ****ing well thanks" I was floored and before i could decide how to react, the teacher started the music and we started the moves. I was so upset by his reaction that i just walked, stood and basically ****ed up his moves. Then i walked away, welcomed the next dancer who i knew with a hug.
Is it me? What a twat.
Definition of a mule -
won't be told anything - 'I know what I'm doing'
is stubborn
kicks the people around him
keeps his arm bent
stares at ladies bosums
ill mannered
probable misogynist
ladies 'in the know' avoid him
Bring on the stallions :respect:
Yep being this interested in sleaze is ........ well, sleazy!
So, have I got this right, the follows are responsible for telling the leads if their behaviour is socially unacceptable. Sorry, I disagree. there are natural consequences when behaviour is our of kilter with social expectations and acceptability. I have no responsibility in the world to tell someone that they make me feel uncomfortable. I can choose to. I can choose not to. There are situations in which I might choose either course of action.
There are no wrong or bad moves (other than ones that end up in blood and pain ... :blush: ) The rest are simply moves that are still maturing. I find hamming it up and making it into something funny ensures people know I am enjoying the dance and it doesn't matter who b@llsed up.
wrong interpretation.
I'm saying this thread (or similar) empowers the partner and then he/she chooses to comment.
You are entitled to disagree. And your observation is quite obviously correct, there are consequences.Quote:
Sorry, I disagree. there are natural consequences when behaviour is our of kilter with social expectations and acceptability.
that's empowerment. You get to choose, rather than being afraid to speak out/report the situation, or simply put up. We don't want "battered wives" syndrome here.Quote:
I have no responsibility in the world to tell someone that they make me feel uncomfortable. I can choose to. I can choose not to. There are situations in which I might choose either course of action.
We've never danced, Dep. Are You going to Southport?Who? :confused:Quote:
but looked up the dictionary:blush: to discover there's someone else who's worse.:wink:
I meant he keeps his elbow bent on the turns.
It's OK if I let go of his hand and complete the turn alone.
Unfortunately the mule likes to keep a firm grip on my hand and I end up turning with a twisted spine or bent knees, or both.:angry:
Leads are supposed to keep their elbows straight when leading turns aren't they Stray?
the mysoginists. Unlikely to be this Southport but may try one later in the year.
I still don't see it.Quote:
I meant he keeps his elbow bent on the turns.
It's OK if I let go of his hand and complete the turn alone.
Unfortunately the mule likes to keep a firm grip on my hand and I end up turning with a twisted spine or bent knees, or both.:angry:Leads are supposed to keep their elbows straight when leading turns aren't they Stray?
Whether my elbows are straight or bent or flexing has little to do with leading my partner around into a turn or spin. I think it's more to do with providing a useful reaction against which the Spinner pushes. The longer the reaction is available, the less force is required to reach the same angular momentum. I prefer the gentle rather than the short sharp forceful push around/off. I suspect many of my partners would appreciate the same. Here's an example of where being able to follow and feel this would help my leading ability.
Personally, I prefer a very late release of the Followers hand, giving her time to push off and around and release as her hand starts to go behind her back. By that time my arm has started to curl around my partner to enable that late release to work.
Some Followers release very early and they must then freewheel for much longer before they come around to take my offered hand. Beginners and newish intermediates benefit from the late release until they have learned to balance better in their turns. But even skilled turners/spinners use the late release to their advantage, particularly if they intend to go into a multiple unassisted spin.
If I were to adopt a straight arm release, all that would be unavailable.
^^ Late releasers I find restricting say on an exit to a catapult. It can stop me from not releasing to go into something else or for me to spin myself, single and especially double. Some never actually let go merely switching hands behind their back. Hmm.
I knew there was a reason to start following. You've just shown an example of early release preference.
But tell me, since I haven't experienced it yet.
If I take the start of the catapult spin around with a piggy grip (or cupped hand) and then as the follow starts to go around change to nearer a palm push, does that leave the Follow the choice of whether to accept the late release or for Follow to do her own thing after she chooses to release? (that was a long winded way of saying I do not "hold" or "grip" my partners hand).
As a beginner follower I'm not sure what I do. I think I wait until I'm released by the leader. There's certainly no grip. But as I discribed, releasing too late is not preferable to the leader.
I'm average height. Also I never have to contort myself to turn under the shorter guys, possibly because they have to have their elbows straight. The tall guys also knock our heads.
Well I was talking about the beginers turn. A basic turn. This is taught in a way that the lead and follows hands stay connected. There should not be any reason to break hold.
I only break hold if I can't do the turn without bending. If I break hold I can keep my upright posture. However, if the lead has his elbow straight and arm straight I would be able to keep erect and not have to break hold.
The problem starts if I need to break hold to keep my frame and posture - because I can't turn under his hand properly - and he won't let go of my hand. This is probably because he knows it's a move where the hands stay held. Also he doesn't have a light handhold that I can slip out of.
I'm not going to give a 'supposed to' or otherwise on this one. I'll just say that I don't if I can help it - straightened leading arms are an evil that I try my level best to avoid at all times. A straight arm has neither the strength nor the control of a bent one.
Right. So guys shorter than you will often need to use a straight arm during a turn, while guys who are your height or taller will not. It also depends on the distance between you and your leader. It's all about the geometry of the situation. Pythagoras and all that.
I agree. The aim point is just above the follower's head. Guys of all heights can get that wrong, in either direction. I know I do.
I gather you're complaining about a specific individual. One change a follower can make in this situation is to have a more robust frame during assisted turns, such that if the leader is pushing her hand towards her head, she matches that force. That's not always possible, and may not be with this guy. I don't know if you'll find that preferable to bending your knees and/or spinning off center.