Improving posture

[Cornish Pixie]

i know this might have been covered in various other threads but cant find any specific ones.

Iv got to the stage in my dancing (imho) where iv got a few decent moves, bit o style ad sum musicality and now i feel the one thing that i want to improve is my posture. Everytime i feel iv got it sussed i watch a vid and i look like the hunchback of notre-dame.

Have noticed that i dance with my legs fairly far apart and dancers that i respect and have psoture that is reasonably good stand with their feet extremely close together, would this have any effect?

cheers wurlitzerrocks xx

[Dreamer]

What you said about feet being apart reminded me of this thread, so you may have something there :nice:

http://www.cerocscotland.com/forum/showthread.php?t=7957

[mikeyr]

What you said about feet being apart reminded me of this thread, so you may have something there :nice:

http://www.cerocscotland.com/forum/showthread.php?t=7957

Excellent tips from Amir as you'd expect. Others things would be to improve
your core strength which will have a knock on effect to your balance which will in turn improve your feeling of connectivity to your partner. I wear Latin Shoes, to my mind these will not only help improve your posture but make yer bum look smaller (a different thread there I think) and stop you leading off your heel. Dont lead from the heel of the foot (unless dancing WCS).

Hope that helps.

[Dreamer]

Latin Shoes will make yer bum look smaller

Where can I get hold of these magical shoes??

On a more serious note, how does one improve core strength - are there exercises one could do?

[Chef]

Try learning some ballroom dances (waltz might be best). The very close hold (body to body) means that unless you stand up straight you are making your partner bend backwards. It really makes you think about if you are really standing up straight. If you stand up against a wall with your bum, shoulders and back of head all touching the wall then you are standing up straight. It just doesn't feel right when walking or dancing.

My ballroom teacher told me that it was a particularly common problem for tall men since they spend their whole like with everything they want to look at being below thier eyeline and they just can't get out of the habit.

I guess in MJ that if you are very tall and your partner shorter then trying to have eye contact (not done in ballroom dances) and standing up straight are going to be hard to achieve at the same time.

[robd]

I think good posture can make such a dramatic difference to the appearance of a dance (STFO really) but I don't think you can switch it on and off as you enter / exit the dancefloor. It's something that you need to work on in everything you do. 2 of my favourite dancers to watch, Paul(s) F & W both have great posture and you can see that as much when they are off the dancefloor as on it. I realise this post does little other than re-inforce what you already knew but having said yesterday (and still believing) that MJ is a dance for doing not for viewing I should also say that the honourable exceptions I mentioned are almost all those individuals with fantastic posture.

Robert

[jivecat]

On a more serious note, how does one improve core strength - are there exercises one could do?

Yes, PILATES. Works like magic. If you do it twice a week I think you would start to feel a difference after only a few weeks. I can only describe it as like having internal lycra! I've been doing it since Christmas and can't recommend it too highly, it has been more effective than years of going to the gym. It's a bit like yoga but focuses on posture and strengthening the core muscles of the back, abdomen and pelvic floor, which in turn improves balance. It requires tremendous concentration and fine-tuned adjustments to the movements.

IME, it's a bit of a girly thing - if men show up you don't usually see them again! No stamina, obviously.

[mikeyr]

Yes, PILATES. Works like magic. If you do it twice a week I think you would start to feel a difference after only a few weeks..


IME, it's a bit of a girly thing - if men show up you don't usually see them again! No stamina, obviously.


Pilates does work. But Jivecat is right, Blokes dont do Pilates. The bloke equivilent is sit-ups, but sit-ups isnt the complete answer, you have to view your core muscles as a whole and balance your workout. So basically think Front, Back and Sides, I never work one without the other two. For specific exercises that you can tailor to your own needs try www.menshealth.co.uk
there pretty good info there.

When you have the core muscles working then some exercises for balance. I use a couple of things, A voodoo board (looks like a skateboard on a shaped roller) or the simplest is ball walking. I use a medicine ball at the gym. First learn to just stand on then progress on to walking/ jumping etc.

I should point out the above things I have been doing for a lot of years and I have history in Martial Arts and also a rollerblade dancer. Like all things of this nature take it in easy steps but above all make it fun.

Good Luck.

[Gadget]

There were a couple of (rather drastic) things suggested to me that have worked on other dancers:
A neck brace
Gaffataping shoulderblades together
Wearing a back brace

Personally I am trying to just improve my posture everywhere - in the car, sitting at my desk, walking, ... and hopefully it will result in better posture while dancing.

As an addition to this, I am trying to be more "connected" within myself and my leads:
Most leads come directly from the leads' hands. Hand location and direction of movement have very little to do with where your body is, what angle it's at to your partner, how it's moving, etc.
I am trying to keep my elbows in, and lead moves from my torso (my 'core') rather than using my shoulders and arms too much. In theory, this should provide a more "connected" dance and allow greater control. It should also highlight an reduce 'slouching'.

Good luck. And if you find a guaranteed solution, let me know :sick:

[philsmove]

You might try a few absolute beginner Tango classes

If your posture is wrong the dance won’t work

Unlike MJ You can’t “fuge” Tango

And posture is a key element

A good teacher will cover and demonstate all of Amirs points

Good luck

[Ghost]

Look at your posture right now. Easiest way to muck it up is hunched over a computer screen :blush: .

There's a Buddhist concept of awareness. Basically keep reminding yourself to check your posture throughout the day.

Take care,
Christopher

[frodo]

Look at your posture right now. Easiest way to muck it up is hunched over a computer screen :blush: .

There's a Buddhist concept of awareness. Basically keep reminding yourself to check your posture throughout the day.
...:yeah: There is a security camera where I can see the monitor I started going past frequently. It does focus the mind when you cannot help catching a glimpse of your posture many times during the day.

I reckon a webcam positioned and timed to take a posture snap every half or so and display it would do the trick quite effectively.


You might try a few absolute beginner Tango classes... I think possibly Argentine Tango posture is may be a bit too subtle to get much out of a few beginners classes in terms of posture. At least that has been my experience.
The teachers may shift you around a bit, but I don't remember ever being specifically pulled up on my, now known to have been, awful dance posture.


I'd agree with Chef - I got a huge amount in terms of posture out of a single closed hold waltz class, which unexpectedly also considerably improved my latin posture.

Having said that I don't think it has carried though so much to MJ - it may be not having a basic step means less muscle memory repetition to associate with good posture - so there may be less of a short cut from good posture all the time.

[El Salsero Gringo]

Pilates does work. But Jivecat is right, Blokes dont do Pilates.This bloke did - made a huge difference.
The bloke equivilent is sit-ups, but sit-ups isnt the complete answer, you have to view your core muscles as a whole and balance your workout.
There are different kinds of sit-ups, and the Pilates ones and the ones that you get taught at the gym are totally different.

What mikeyr says is right though, if you do exercises you *must* balance both front and back (and both sides) - it's terribly easy just to do hundreds of situps but unless you strengthen your back as well you'll end up with a terrible hunch and *worse* posture, not better.

Pilates will give you core strength without developing bulging muscles; it will get your shoulders back down where they should be, your stomach flat as a board, your back straight, and give you better balance and better breath control. It was invented by a dancer, for dancers. It's absolutely the right thing to do.

[Whitebeard]

Try learning some ballroom dances (waltz might be best). The very close hold (body to body) means that unless you stand up straight you are making your partner bend backwards.

Which is just what both partners do to a degree if they were taught as I was taught. We were told that contact should be at the diaphragm with the upper body slightly arched away from the partner in a rather formal and stylised manner. Quite different to the hold taught at the one blues class I have done where the partners were encouraged to really "hunch" into each other in a very close and much more intimate "embrace", side of head to side of head.

[pjay]

Pilates does work. But Jivecat is right, Blokes dont do Pilates. The bloke equivilent is sit-ups, but sit-ups isnt the complete answer, you have to view your core muscles as a whole and balance your workout. So basically think Front, Back and Sides, I never work one without the other two. For specific exercises that you can tailor to your own needs try www.menshealth.co.uk
there pretty good info there.


Some blokes do do Pilates, in fact it tends to be incredibly common in professional sports people these days, not to mention that a lot of trainers now use Pilates techniques linked to other exercises.

[Chef]

Which is just what both partners do to a degree if they were taught as I was taught. We were told that contact should be at the diaphragm with the upper body slightly arched away from the partner in a rather formal and stylised manner. Quite different to the hold taught at the one blues class I have done where the partners were encouraged to really "hunch" into each other in a very close and much more intimate "embrace", side of head to side of head.

You are indeed absolutely right. My teacher was initially content to get both of us to merely stand up straight. As we moved towards our exams there was more emphasis for both partners to adopt a posture that was more like two staves of a barrel with our connection point at about the point of the solar plexus.

So much emphasis was placed on my standing up straight at the beginning because until I did my partner would never be able to adopt this shoulders back stance. With her bowing slightly backwards and me hunched forwards "going over the top of her", as it was always refered to,
it would only be a matter of time before we became unbalanced as a partnership and she would topple backwards with me falling on top of her.

My reccomendation for beginners waltz lessons was because any dance teacher worth thier money has always required an upright stance as the minimum starting point before moving onto the slightly bowed away posture.

[Donna]

I know one solution that can improve your posture (as seen on SCD) Stick a yard brush down the back of your trousers. It works wonders.. :D

[Cruella]

Stick a yard brush down the back of your trousers. It works wonders.. :D
That just sounds plain kinky to me.:blush:

[Donna]

That just sounds plain kinky to me.:blush:


:rofl:

[Cornish Pixie]

Thanks for the great help guys, i already do some pilates type exercises to strenghten my back so guess il have to increase the dose to other parts of my body!

[Rebecca]

Due to my childhood being dominated by ballet training I am told that the one thing I do well when dancing MJ is posture (I should now qualify that with a list of my rubbish points I know, but I won’t bore you. . .)

Zebra Woman asked me for some advice to help her daughter’s ice skating and I’m told after applying this simple exercise she had a breakthrough, so you could give it a go:

• Whilst reading this, push your chair back away from the screen and sit with the base of your spine pressed against the chair back.

• Try not to focus on pushing your shoulders anywhere. Ignore them for now. Ignore your chest too.

• Raise both of your arms parallel in front of you until they reach the horizontal plane (elbows and hands relaxed)

• Take both arms out to your sides by allowing your shoulder blades to meet – nearly (arms still on the horizontal plane)

• Whilst holding them there start to focus on holding firm the muscles between, and at the base of your shoulder blades (no idea what they’re called)

• Now relax your arms down by your sides continuing to focus on your shoulder blades being held in place.

• Then try the same exercise standing – then dancing. . .

I find that whilst I can hold the strength in this area of my back (and stomach of course) I can be free with my arms, shoulders, head etc whilst retaining posture.

Difficult to articulate – search me out at Southport if you’re going and if this seems like something you want to try.

nb. Stretch out the muscles by holding your hands together and pushing them out in front of you afterwards.

All the best, Rebecca :flower:

[Anna]

Where can I get hold of these magical shoes??

On a more serious note, how does one improve core strength - are there exercises one could do?

To improve core strength.. sit ups, pilates, yoga, martial arts. Or other forms of dance, for example, Egyptian dance is for everyone (men and women) and it builds your core as well as teaching you to isolate.

Ballroom dancing is very good for overall posture, it was the first partner dance style I learnt and even though I have now progressed to Street Latin (the antichrist of ballroom), I still have my ballroom posture - a straight line from head to the base of my spine and an ever so slightly elevated chin. You will not regret learning to have Ballroom posture!! As it's also a lot better for your back in the long run :)

[Dorothy]

Due to my childhood being dominated by ballet training I am told that the one thing I do well when dancing MJ is posture (I should now qualify that with a list of my rubbish points I know, but I won’t bore you. . .)
All the best, Rebecca :flower:

Great advice Rebecca :D Not boring at all!
Ballet is excellent for posture, and ballroom helped me too.

[killingtime]

Interesting stuff here. I'll purchase a pilates DVD and give it a go. Does anyone have any recommendations for (pilates) DVDs?

[Donna]

Ballroom dancing is very good for overall posture, it was the first partner dance style I learnt and even though I have now progressed to Street Latin (the antichrist of ballroom), I still have my ballroom posture - a straight line from head to the base of my spine and an ever so slightly elevated chin. You will not regret learning to have Ballroom posture!! As it's also a lot better for your back in the long run :)

That's exactly why we took up ballroom. I find the waltz has done helped us to hold our posture for longer without having to really think about it... even when you get tired! (as by then, most people tend to go round shouldered)