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View Full Version : Is it worthwhile complaining?



Clive Long
13th-February-2006, 03:53 PM
Prompted by this (http://www.cerocscotland.com/forum/showthread.php?p=203417) post, I'm wondering how venue managers and franchisees handle such situations. I'm interested in your actual experience.

This may encourage / discourage complaints about certain behaviour at a venue.

Note: I'm not saying that all compaints are well-founded. A complaint may be malicious in an attempt to get an innocent person "expelled" just because of "friction" between two people.

The poll is anonymous.

Clive

Tessalicious
13th-February-2006, 03:59 PM
Prompted by this (http://www.cerocscotland.com/forum/showthread.php?p=203417) post, I'm wondering how venue managers and franchisees handle such situations. I'm interested in your actual experience.When I first started Cerocing in London, there was a particular man at Jive Bar that I had issues with - he was very gropey when dancing with me (without any encouragement whatsoever I might add) - but I hadn't been dancing long, and didn't really know any better. However, when I took my flatmate along and she made a comment along the same lines, I was really concerned, as he had put her off and she didn't want to go back for weeks. I asked a couple of other ladies I knew at the venue and they all agreed they had similar problems with him but that he asked for a dance in a way that gave you no option of saying no.

I'm not normally the type to make a stand, but I spoke to the venue manager and requested that they mention to him that he was making several ladies uncomfortable. This was done, and a dance I had with him a couple of weeks later was much less touch-feely. But, I think he must have become bored with 'clean' Ceroc, because in less than a month he had stopped turning up.

El Salsero Gringo
13th-February-2006, 04:10 PM
I think one would have to "follow up" all complaints, but what that would consist of would have to be judged case-by-case.

Sparkles
13th-February-2006, 04:13 PM
I was put in a similar situation when I first started dancing in London at the ISH - the problem was that the guy was just plain creepy :sick:... he wasn't necessarily touching me inappropriately but he was making suggestive comments and doing things like holding me much closer than I was comfortable with even after I asked him not to hold so tightly or so close.
I wasn't sure what to do so I spoke to the taxi dancers about it. I said that I didn't mean to cause any trouble but that they might like to keep an eye on the guy and see if they got any other complaints about him - sure enough they did.
I don't know exactly what happened after that but I believe the venue manager dealt with him - I've not seen him there since, thankfully.

Dreadful Scathe
13th-February-2006, 04:20 PM
Theres no point in complaining it never gets you anywhere you can complain till you're blue in the face and they never listen ive complained on and on and on about the state of the world to several people and nothing ever happens no not even close im sick of the bus service and i complain but do we get more buses? not bleeding likely some bloke turns up in bleeding mini bus when theres little old ladies with their shopping in a hurry to go to the bingo they complain of course but it never gets them anywhere and dont get me started on the trains makes the buses look the epitome of effiency trains gah trains they keep putting up the prices so you can sit in some sweaty carriage with bleeding veggie students going to protest about something or other in some obscure part of britain nobody cares about and being forced to listen to their incessant whining about mcdonalds and commercialism with their bleedin ring tones on at full volume so mother can ask them where they are you can complain but it never gets you anywhere bleedin liberals dont know theyre born

Cruella
13th-February-2006, 04:21 PM
Theres no point in complaining it never gets you anywhere you can complain till you're blue in the face and they never listen ive complained on and on and on about the state of the world to several people and nothing ever happens no not even close im sick of the bus service and i complain but do we get more buses? not bleeding likely some bloke turns up in bleeding mini bus when theres little old ladies with their shopping in a hurry to go to the bingo they complain of course but it never gets them anywhere and dont get me started on the trains makes the buses look the epitome of effiency trains gah trains they keep putting up the prices so you can sit in some sweaty carriage with bleeding veggie students going to protest about something or other in some obscure part of britain nobody cares about and being forced to listen to their incessant whining about mcdonalds and commercialism with their bleedin ring tones on at full volume so mother can ask them where they are you can complain but it never gets you anywhere bleedin liberals dont know theyre born
And breathe...

Jurasell
13th-February-2006, 06:08 PM
When I first started Cerocing in London, there was a particular man at Jive Bar that I had issues with - he was very gropey when dancing with me
I had a similar problem when I started. I did complain to the venue manager, who just said "he would keep an eye on it," with an attitude that said "you're making a mountain out of a molehill." Luckily the guy concerned soon vanished from the scene completely.

J.

Donna
14th-February-2006, 12:55 PM
I had a similar problem when I started. I did complain to the venue manager, who just said "he would keep an eye on it," with an attitude that said "you're making a mountain out of a molehill." Luckily the guy concerned soon vanished from the scene completely.

J.

That's what they all say but that is all they can do to start with. Until more complaints come in, it's only then they can tell them not to come back. They've got to think about how many people they would lose if they were to allow someone like that to stay. Losing one is not going to bother them.

If the person warned can all of a sudden change, he obviously knows what he is doing wrong. Some are just like that but don't realise it because it's a habit. The fact that they don't come back means that they were only there for one thing.

Jurasell
14th-February-2006, 01:23 PM
That's what they all say but that is all they can do to start with. Until more complaints come in, it's only then they can tell them not to come back. Yes, but although this guy hadn't been complained about before, he was avoided by most of the women, and known about on the grapevine.

J.

Lee
14th-February-2006, 01:35 PM
Theres no point in complaining it never gets you anywhere you can complain till you're blue in the face and they never listen ive complained on and on and on about the state of the world to several people and nothing ever happens no not even close im sick of the bus service and i complain but do we get more buses? not bleeding likely some bloke turns up in bleeding mini bus when theres little old ladies with their shopping in a hurry to go to the bingo they complain of course but it never gets them anywhere and dont get me started on the trains makes the buses look the epitome of effiency trains gah trains they keep putting up the prices so you can sit in some sweaty carriage with bleeding veggie students going to protest about something or other in some obscure part of britain nobody cares about and being forced to listen to their incessant whining about mcdonalds and commercialism with their bleedin ring tones on at full volume so mother can ask them where they are you can complain but it never gets you anywhere bleedin liberals dont know theyre born

I think you are right in most cases, but with dancing it's different, people make friendships and can very quickly weed out the weirdos and creeps, if i hear about any dodgy business at my regular venue i would be the first to complain on behalf of the person affected. 99% of the time it's a guy that is the problem and these guys should be banned from all venues.

Worthwhile complaining, i think so. If the venue manager doesn't do anything, complain about him/her to ceroc HQ.

Lee

Asif
14th-February-2006, 01:46 PM
Yes, it is worth complaining .... or at least making the venue managers, teachers or taxi dancers aware of a problem.

I have experienced various different types of "complaints", ranging from the inconsiderate dancers (dance for themselves, dancing a bit rough, etc) to the inappropriate dancers (sleezy, smelly, sweaty, etc). The varying solutions ranged from a polite word in the persons ear or giving general advice/help with their dancing, to actually banning someone from the venue due to their behaviour.

All cases need to be dealt with individually but none-the-less should be addressed.

Donna
14th-February-2006, 01:50 PM
if i hear about any dodgy business at my regular venue i would be the first to complain on behalf of the person affected.

So would I but the ones who are coming up to me and complaining about it don't want me to say anything yet. :confused:

Lynn
14th-February-2006, 01:52 PM
you can complain till you're blue in the face That could explain a lot Mr Smurf...

Donna
14th-February-2006, 01:53 PM
That could explain a lot Mr Smurf...


:rofl:

LMC
14th-February-2006, 02:48 PM
So would I but the ones who are coming up to me and complaining about it don't want me to say anything yet. :confused:
Well, they are adults, so the following won't apply in a legal sense...

but I work with kids, and all our training says that there are some things we have to tell - obviously child protection related. If a kid asks "Can I tell you something in confidence" then you have to respond that you are happy to listen to them, but that you might have to tell someone else. That's the law.

In a "moral" sense, if someone was being made unhappy by another dancer's behaviour, then I would feel no guilt in telling the venue managers/someone in authority - and I would tell the person complaining that I was going to do so. That might mean that they stop confiding in me - but that's fine: I don't want to live with a burden of not being able to help my friends.

Donna
14th-February-2006, 03:07 PM
and I would tell the person complaining that I was going to do so. That might mean that they stop confiding in me - but that's fine: I don't want to live with a burden of not being able to help my friends.
This is why I'm not sure what to do. Tell my friends first or just go and tell they guy who runs it. Either way it might cause a bit of an argument. Maybe I should just keep quiet and let him get on with harrassing more of my mates. Don't think so somehow.

LMC
14th-February-2006, 03:21 PM
Maybe I should just keep quiet and let him get on with harrassing more of my mates. Don't think so somehow.
Well, exactly - which is why I would tell my friend "Look, I know you don't want to make a fuss, but if you don't report this, then I will, because it's not acceptable". They might argue against me doing that, but I would tell 'em straight how much I hated them being upset.

Donna
14th-February-2006, 03:24 PM
Well, exactly - which is why I would tell my friend "Look, I know you don't want to make a fuss, but if you don't report this, then I will, because it's not acceptable". They might argue against me doing that, but I would tell 'em straight how much I hated them being upset.

It's worth a try. cheers! :hug:

LMC
14th-February-2006, 03:27 PM
Unfortunately, you might be into a bit of an argument either way. But of the three options

1. Do nothing, just let your friend complain to you
2. Go behind your friend's back and tell
3. Tell you're friend that you're going to tell, then tell

I know which option I'd pick. Good luck.

Donna
14th-February-2006, 05:05 PM
Unfortunately, you might be into a bit of an argument either way. But of the three options

1. Do nothing, just let your friend complain to you
2. Go behind your friend's back and tell
3. Tell you're friend that you're going to tell, then tell

I know which option I'd pick. Good luck.


3. :yeah:

tomboh
15th-February-2006, 12:23 AM
Yes, it is worth complaining .... or at least making the venue managers, teachers or taxi dancers aware of a problem.

Definitely. A couple of my female friends tried Ceroc and gave it up after their first week because they found some of the men too intimate. I don't know which men - I wasn't there that week.

If anyone feels discomforted by other dancers in their first week, Ceroc has something wrong.

I remember feeling uncomfortable due to my own inability - other dancers struck me as considerate and helpful - but not due to others' superiority. I found Ceroc supportive and encouraging, despite my fear of the unknown.

But I'm not a pretty thrity-something woman. It irritates me that my friends who are had a very different experience.

Ultimately, I'd love to have had the wisdom and affirmation I now have. I'd love to bring them along to a lesson and ask them to point out who they felt uncomfotable around and quietly discuss this with the venue manager.

Well, if this happens again, I'll act differently.

El Salsero Gringo
15th-February-2006, 10:06 AM
Definitely. A couple of my female friends tried Ceroc and gave it up after their first week because they found some of the men too intimate. I don't know which men - I wasn't there that week.Are you quite sure it wasn't just the normal "intimacy" of a partner dance like Ceroc that put them off? I'm sure for some people even holding hands with strange men would take some getting used to.

philsmove
15th-February-2006, 10:30 AM
.

If anyone feels discomforted by other dancers in their first week, Ceroc has something wrong.

.


I don’t think it’s unusually for people to feel a little uncomfortable at their first dance

A recently separated friend told me it was the first time she had held another mans for 15 years
Before we went, I had told her, she was not allowed to give up at the first attempt

She did come again, and really enjoyed it

Back on topic - if you do witness totally inappropriate behaviour and the organiser has not noticed, I think you have a duty to bring to their attention. That said I have found organisers do keep an eye on people and have witness people being removed from class on at least two occasions

Donna
15th-February-2006, 03:23 PM
A recently separated friend told me it was the first time she had held another mans for 15 years
Before we went, I had told her, she was not allowed to give up at the first attempt

She did come again, and really enjoyed it


:eek: :blush:

:rofl: :rofl:

Dreadful Scathe
15th-February-2006, 04:06 PM
wow ! I usually just lead with my hands too :) hmm possibilities.....

tomboh
15th-February-2006, 08:01 PM
Are you quite sure it wasn't just the normal "intimacy" of a partner dance like Ceroc that put them off? I'm sure for some people even holding hands with strange men would take some getting used to.

Given the people involved, this struck me as unlikely. It's possible, though. Also, people sometimes deal with situations in ways that seem out of character.