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jiveoholic
21st-February-2003, 12:59 AM
I have a question. Jive dance is great because one can dance with anybody without "complications" such as giving the wrong message about liking them in a special way.

However, when two jive dancers become intimately entwined, the situation can change to:

1. They carry on dancing with others as if they were not partners, although they might sit together, but often will go to other venues alone. No threat to their relationship, indeed no change either as far as dancing is concerned.

2. They spend lots more time dancing with each other, improving etc, but both realise that they must dance with others to keep up their lead follow abilities. No threat to relationship, but they "hog one-another" a bit dancing and become less available.

3. They become rather concerned about each other, "is she getting enough dances", "is he dancing inappropriately with that georgous blond" etc. However, they know these emotions need suppressing, fight them and keep dancing with others.

4. They have to take some serious action to stop emotions, such as not look at the other when dancing, or immediately inviting someone to dance when the other does, or go to diferent venues.

5. Basically they give up the fight trying to dance with others, look inwardly and only dance with each other or just a few "trusted friends".

So folks - how do you find it?

Northants Girly
8th-September-2007, 09:25 AM
What an old thread! How did someone come across it?

whoops - it looks like it was me - but I just noticed it was a "new post" so I guess someone must have found it and voted.

David Bailey
10th-September-2007, 11:22 AM
I've closed this poll - but if people want to discuss the topic further, I'll re-open it.

Gav
10th-September-2007, 11:36 AM
I've found that people ask DT to dance a lot less since we became a couple and it's a real shame. I've even had two plonkers ask my permission, f.f.s!

As a result we end up dancing with each other a lot more and I expect that probably makes people even more reluctant to ask!
Trouble is, when you dance with someone that much at my level, it can become boring. I even bore myself with my limited repertoire, so it must be awful for her.

Please don't resist asking, she'd love to dance with you, and if you catch me watching, it's because I enjoy watching her dance and seeing her enjoy herself, I'm not keeping an eye on what you're up to! :flower:

MartinHarper
10th-September-2007, 11:54 AM
I've found that people ask DT to dance a lot less since we became a couple and it's a real shame. I've even had two plonkers ask my permission, f.f.s!

Another example of good old-fashioned manners. :)

Gav
10th-September-2007, 12:04 PM
Another example of good old-fashioned manners. :)

I'd say bad old-fashioned manners from the days when a lady would need her partners permission to anything more than breathe.
DT doesn't need my approval to do anything she likes especially dancing, and clumsily implying that she does is offensive to both of us.
I'm sure the men concerned didn't mean any harm, maybe they accidentally bought a 1907 calendar instead of 2007? :rolleyes:

It's meant to be a relaxed, social environment where anyone is free to ask anyone else. Please don't start introducing etiquette that puts barriers in the way of that.

David Bailey
10th-September-2007, 12:10 PM
I'd say bad old-fashioned manners from the days when a lady would need her partners permission to anything more than breathe.
Nope, I agree with Martin. If a couple is sitting together, clearly as a couple, it's occasionally polite to ask permission. Admittedly, this is less common in MJ, but it's quite common in the salsa and AT dance scenes.

And this is polite, because you occasionally get a stroppy guy, who will get annoyed if his permission is not asked. So you can't win either way :rolleyes:

The solution? If you don't want this approach, don't sit together as a couple. :D

robd
10th-September-2007, 12:26 PM
Trouble is, when you dance with someone that much at my level, it can become boring.

It happens when you get to my level too Gav :whistle:


















































:devil:

MartinHarper
10th-September-2007, 12:38 PM
I'd say bad old-fashioned manners from the days when a lady would need her partners permission to anything more than breathe.

Well, it's old-fashioned. In the days when it was fashionable, it was good. :)

Caro
10th-September-2007, 12:51 PM
Well, it's old-fashioned. In the days when it was fashionable, it was good. :)

Although I think manners are important, I have to say I'm with Gav on this one... asking permission to somebody to dance with somebody else implies a sense of 'belonging' to somebody which I'm utterly uncomfortable with.

Now if a couple is deep discussion yes it is polite to ask (the person you want to dance with directly) if it's ok to interrupt and dance, but simply because of the interruption thing and should have nothing to do with the fact that they are a couple - it should be the same for any 2 people in deep conversation.

I know I'd be either gaggling myself or a tad annoyed if somebody was to ask my partner (ok, assume I have one for the sake of this thread :rolleyes: ) if they could dance with me. You know, freewill and all. :rolleyes:




me... I don't belong to anybody ;)

Lou
10th-September-2007, 01:05 PM
Although I think manners are important, I have to say I'm with Gav on this one... asking permission to somebody to dance with somebody else implies a sense of 'belonging' to somebody which I'm utterly uncomfortable with.

I guess it depends on how it's done. I wouldn't "ask permission", as such - but I would smile & ask "do you mind?", if only to acknowledge the other person. :flower:

ducasi
10th-September-2007, 01:11 PM
I guess it depends on how it's done. I wouldn't "ask permission", as such - but I would smile & ask "do you mind?", if only to acknowledge the other person. :flower:
:yeah:

Caro
10th-September-2007, 01:12 PM
I guess it depends on how it's done. I wouldn't "ask permission", as such - but I would smile & ask "do you mind?", if only to acknowledge the other person. :flower:

well, exactly, in the same way that I would to that with anybody in deep conversation with the object of my dance desire. That's just polite. Now asking a boyfriend / girlfriend 'can I dance with your other half' before even asking the person in question is just total non-sense. And in this day and age, I would actually think it shows pretty bad manners. :what:

Double Trouble
10th-September-2007, 02:02 PM
I've found that people ask DT to dance a lot less since we became a couple and it's a real shame. I've even had two plonkers ask my permission, f.f.s!

I suppose the 'plonkers' are covering their arse in case you get the hump. If they don't know either of us, they can't make an assumption that you are not a nutter.




when you dance with someone that much at my level, it can become boring. I even bore myself with my limited repertoire, so it must be awful for her.

It doesn't matter what level you are at. My ex has been dancing for 15+ years but I still got bored dancing with him all the time.


Please don't resist asking, she'd love to dance with you, and if you catch me watching, it's because I enjoy watching her dance and seeing her enjoy herself, I'm not keeping an eye on what you're up to! :flower:

I've made a pact with myself to ask as many men as possible to dance at Southport. It's a total drag having to ask all the time, but it's the only way I'm going to get any action.

David Bailey
10th-September-2007, 02:14 PM
I guess it depends on how it's done. I wouldn't "ask permission", as such - but I would smile & ask "do you mind?", if only to acknowledge the other person. :flower:
Yes, that's the type of approach I was thinking of. Like all these things, there are right and wrong ways of doing it.

I have to say, I don't think I've ever asked anyone's permission to dance with their other half. But that's mainly because, if I see an obvious couple, I don't ask one of them to dance, so I avoid the whole situation.


If they don't know either of us, they can't make an assumption that you are not a nutter.
That's too much of a feed, I'll ignore the obvious comeback. :na:

Double Trouble
10th-September-2007, 02:25 PM
But that's mainly because, if I see an obvious couple, I don't ask one of them to dance, so I avoid the whole situation.

Great...so I'm not imagining things then...men avoid women who are with their partners.

Gav...I'm sorry dear, I wont be spending much time with you this weekend. I'm off on a man hunt.

Lynn
10th-September-2007, 02:25 PM
I've made a pact with myself to ask as many men as possible to dance at Southport. It's a total drag having to ask all the time, but it's the only way I'm going to get any action.I've been at Southport with a partner, most of the time we didn't even dance in the same room, let alone together a lot. In fact we probably dance together more now we are just friends than when we were a couple.

I was also at Southport in June with a group of friends, some of whom were couples. And I didn't ask the men to dance, even though I know them, and dance with them at local freestyles, simply because they were always sitting with their partner.

So I think the level of approachability to be asked for a dance depends on if you are obviously together, sitting/standing together all the time, or if you are both just 'there' but mixing in with everyone else.

David Bailey
10th-September-2007, 02:54 PM
Great...so I'm not imagining things then...men avoid women who are with their partners.
I can't speak for all men, but yes, I tend to avoid approaching the "obvious couples sitting together", simply to avoid encountering that "asking permission" type of situation - it feels too much like an interruption really.

fletch
10th-September-2007, 03:04 PM
I would normally say to the lady, 'is it Ok to grab your man' :confused:


It just seem good manners to me :flower:

I have asked the man direct, and the guy has turned to the lady and asked permission :sick:its a bit embarrassing :blush:

Gav
10th-September-2007, 03:06 PM
I know I'm not a great one to talk about not asking people to dance, I'm cr4p.

But, if I want to ask someone to dance, the fact that they're with their partner won't bother me (nor, will I ask permission :devil:) unless they happen to be all over each other at the time. If they're just sitting together, what does it matter? If you don't know them, they could be 2 strangers that happened to sit next to each other. :confused:

stewart38
10th-September-2007, 03:19 PM
I know I'm not a great one to talk about not asking people to dance, I'm cr4p.

But, if I want to ask someone to dance, the fact that they're with their partner won't bother me (nor, will I ask permission :devil:) unless they happen to be all over each other at the time. If they're just sitting together, what does it matter? If you don't know them, they could be 2 strangers that happened to sit next to each other. :confused:

If I don’t know someone, who am I likely to ask someone sitting behind 4 chairs in a crowd having a laugh with that crowd or someone standing by the side tapping her foot

Its not rocket science

If you want to dance you got go look or be approachable

David Bailey
10th-September-2007, 03:22 PM
I know I'm not a great one to talk about not asking people to dance, I'm cr4p.
Well, yeah. :na:


IBut, if I want to ask someone to dance, the fact that they're with their partner won't bother me (nor, will I ask permission :devil:) unless they happen to be all over each other at the time. If they're just sitting together, what does it matter? If you don't know them, they could be 2 strangers that happened to sit next to each other. :confused:
Fair enough, but face it, like it or not, some people just don't feel that way - if I had to hazard a guess, I'd say that most people don't feel the way that you do.

It's all part of the "Why do you ask people to dance?" thing. And someone who's (for want of a better term) clearly "available" will get asked more than someone who isn't, all other things being equal.

And as I said, there's a simple and obvious remedy to this, if it bothers you.

Gav
10th-September-2007, 03:22 PM
If I don’t know someone, who am I likely to ask someone sitting behind 4 chairs in a crowd having a laugh with that crowd or someone standing by the side tapping her foot

Its not rocket science

If you want to dance you got go look or be approachable

My mistake, I thought we were discussing asking someone to dance who appears to be with their partner, not discussing asking someone to dance, who's with their partner and sitting behind 4 rows of people. :rolleyes:

and yes, I do get that you're making a point about being approachable.

stewart38
10th-September-2007, 03:34 PM
My mistake, I thought we were discussing asking someone to dance who appears to be with their partner, not discussing asking someone to dance, who's with their partner and sitting behind 4 rows of people. :rolleyes:

and yes, I do get that you're making a point about being approachable.

Thought we were discussing why DT wasnt getting any ?

Double Trouble
10th-September-2007, 05:12 PM
Thought we were discussing why DT wasnt getting any ?

Well...for me to get more, it looks like I'm gonna have to keep my distance from Gav this weekend.

Perhaps I should have a T-shirt made up saying "Please give to charity and ask me to dance".

Twirlie Bird
10th-September-2007, 06:47 PM
I'd say bad old-fashioned manners from the days when a lady would need her partners permission to anything more than breathe.
DT doesn't need my approval to do anything she likes especially dancing, and clumsily implying that she does is offensive to both of us.
I'm sure the men concerned didn't mean any harm, maybe they accidentally bought a 1907 calendar instead of 2007? :rolleyes:



It's just being polite and acknowledging your partner. It works vice versa too. :flower: As for being old fashioned there is nothing at all wrong with a bit of old fashioned manners. :eek:

It's nice to belong. :wink:




It's all part of the "Why do you ask people to dance?" thing. And someone who's (for want of a better term) clearly "available" will get asked more than someone who isn't, all other things being equal.


I am clearly unavailable and I get asked loads to dance :rolleyes:

StokeBloke
10th-September-2007, 07:02 PM
I can't speak for all men, but yes, I tend to avoid approaching the "obvious couples sitting together", simply to avoid encountering that "asking permission" type of situation - it feels too much like an interruption really.
I will ask ladies who are chatting to dance. I simply ask the lady if they're too busy chatting for a quick dance. It never seems to cause any problems; and very seldomly do they say that they are too busy chatting... so everyone's a winner baby :D:D:D

I wouldn't ask a guy if I could dance with the lady he is sitting with.... what's that all about? If you are a jealous paranoid obsessive man, maybe taking your wife partner dancing isn't the best choice of pastime :whistle:

David Bailey
10th-September-2007, 07:59 PM
I am clearly unavailable and I get asked loads to dance :rolleyes:
Oh well, fair enough, maybe DT's just ugly then :whistle:

Connie
10th-September-2007, 08:10 PM
Oh well, fair enough, maybe DT's just ugly then :whistle:

Uh are YOU in trouble now :whistle:

Raul
10th-September-2007, 08:18 PM
I have to say that my biggest dance "disappointments" have been with followers who look quite good when dancing with their partners but cannot follow another lead. I would rather dance with beginners who do not follow fixed routines and anticipate moves.

The above does not apply the many good followers who learned to dance well before they met their partner but rather to those who learned with the partner and have very little experience with other leaders.

With that in mind, if I do not know a follower and she is with her partner and staying by his side and dancing most of the time with him, I am not asking her to dance.

MartinHarper
10th-September-2007, 09:12 PM
Perhaps I should have a T-shirt made up saying "Please give to charity and ask me to dance".

Or Gav could get a T-shirt saying "I don't mind if you grind with my girl"?
Though he is less intimidating now he has hair.

David Bailey
10th-September-2007, 10:00 PM
Uh are YOU in trouble now :whistle:
Am I? :eek: :na:

fletch
10th-September-2007, 10:28 PM
Am I? :eek: :na:


you should get an infraction for that smutty comment :na:

now go and thrash your self for been a naughty boy :devil:

Gav
11th-September-2007, 08:33 AM
Or Gav could get a T-shirt saying "I don't mind if you grind with my girl"?
Though he is less intimidating now he has hair.

Intimidating? Moi? How VERY dare you? :angry:

I'm just a soft little pussy cat, me. :flower:

Gav
11th-September-2007, 08:44 AM
Oh well, fair enough, maybe DT's just ugly then :whistle:

Did you hear what happened to the last person that upset DT?











No? neither did anyone else, but they haven't been seen since :whistle: :devil: :D

Connie
11th-September-2007, 09:45 AM
you should get an infraction for that smutty comment :na:

now go and thrash your self for been a naughty boy :devil:

What does thrash means :sick:

David Bailey
11th-September-2007, 09:47 AM
Did you hear what happened to the last person that upset DT?
No - did they get in trouble?

I know, you can over-milk a joke...