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View Full Version : How many dancers are in the UK?



David Bailey
10th-October-2005, 03:04 PM
Following on from my comments in this post (http://www.cerocscotland.com/forum/showpost.php?p=159049), it just occurred to me that I could be talking rubbish (!) - there could very well be more ballroom than MJ dancers. So I'd like to know the numbers.

Looking at Ceroc.com, there appear to be 134 ceroc venues in the UK (11 in Scotland, 4 in the Northwest, 9 in the Northeast, 29 in Midlands, 7 in the West, 32 in the Southeast, 19 in East Anglia and 23 in London). Ceroc.com also says "Around 55,000 people are learning to dance with Ceroc every month.".

Assuming that's correct, and that Ceroc accounts for (rough guess) just over 50% of the MJ dancers in the UK, let's say there may be around 100,000 MJ-ers (people who regularly go to an MJ event) in the country.

For salsa, I'd guess (very very very roughly) there are maybe about half that number; I'd estimate maybe 400 club nights in the UK a week, based on listings, and maybe 100-150 people per night.

Does anyone have some more decent figures for these two dances?

Also, does anyone have some figures for the number of people doing other types of dancing?

LMC
10th-October-2005, 03:09 PM
Unfortunately, the Office for National Statistics consultation on topics to be included in the 2011 Census ended on 5 August 2005 (I :heart: Google) - but maybe we could ask for a dancing question to be included in 2021?

El Salsero Gringo
10th-October-2005, 03:12 PM
Following on from my comments in this post (http://www.cerocscotland.com/forum/showpost.php?p=159049), it just occurred to me that I could be talking rubbish (!) - there could very well be more ballroom than MJ dancers. So I'd like to know the numbers.

Looking at Ceroc.com, there appear to be 134 ceroc venues in the UK (11 in Scotland, 4 in the Northwest, 9 in the Northeast, 29 in Midlands, 7 in the West, 32 in the Southeast, 19 in East Anglia and 23 in London). Ceroc.com also says "Around 55,000 people are learning to dance with Ceroc every month.".

Assuming that's correct, and that Ceroc accounts for (rough guess) just over 50% of the MJ dancers in the UK, let's say there may be around 100,000 MJ-ers (people who regularly go to an MJ event) in the country.

For salsa, I'd guess (very very very roughly) there are maybe about half that number; I'd estimate maybe 400 club nights in the UK a week, based on listings, and maybe 100-150 people per night.

Does anyone have some more decent figures for these two dances?

Also, does anyone have some figures for the number of people doing other types of dancing?I can't answer your question directly, but your figures don't match.

If there are 134 ceroc nights and you accept the figure of 55,000 people, then that would be (if they all danced weekly) 400+ people for each event. That's much higher than your equivalent figure of 100-150 for Salsa.

In other words, you've got twice as many Salsa events, but only half as many dancers. Are you happy that one figure or the other doesn't need adjusting? Personally I think there are more Salsa dancers than MJers.

David Bailey
10th-October-2005, 03:24 PM
If there are 134 ceroc nights and you accept the figure of 55,000 people, then that would be (if they all danced weekly) 400+ people for each event. That's much higher than your equivalent figure of 100-150 for Salsa.
The ceroc figure is venues, not events - venues can run several events a week. But yes, it still seems a little high to me - I'm only quoting ceroc.com, not defending it. I'm happy to accept anyone else's numbers?


Personally I think there are more Salsa dancers than MJers.
Source? :whistle:

Msfab
10th-October-2005, 03:28 PM
Following on from my comments in this post (http://www.cerocscotland.com/forum/showpost.php?p=159049), it just occurred to me that I could be talking rubbish (!) - there could very well be more ballroom than MJ dancers. So I'd like to know the numbers.

Looking at Ceroc.com, there appear to be 134 ceroc venues in the UK (11 in Scotland, 4 in the Northwest, 9 in the Northeast, 29 in Midlands, 7 in the West, 32 in the Southeast, 19 in East Anglia and 23 in London). Ceroc.com also says "Around 55,000 people are learning to dance with Ceroc every month.".

Assuming that's correct, and that Ceroc accounts for (rough guess) just over 50% of the MJ dancers in the UK, let's say there may be around 100,000 MJ-ers (people who regularly go to an MJ event) in the country.

For salsa, I'd guess (very very very roughly) there are maybe about half that number; I'd estimate maybe 400 club nights in the UK a week, based on listings, and maybe 100-150 people per night.

Does anyone have some more decent figures for these two dances?

Also, does anyone have some figures for the number of people doing other types of dancing?

Whats it matter DJ?:cool:

David Bailey
10th-October-2005, 03:31 PM
Whats it matter DJ?:cool:
What does anything matter, in 5 billion years the Sun will explode...

I'm just interested, really, and wondered if anyone had some figures.

It might indicate the relative strengths of different dances if we knew how many people actually did them - for all I know, there are a million C&W line-dancers out there, swamping everyone else. :eek:

Msfab
10th-October-2005, 03:39 PM
What does anything matter, in 5 billion years the Sun will explode...

I'm just interested, really, and wondered if anyone had some figures.

It might indicate the relative strengths of different dances if we knew how many people actually did them - for all I know, there are a million C&W line-dancers out there, swamping everyone else. :eek:

Really 5 billions years? :really:

El Salsero Gringo
10th-October-2005, 03:40 PM
The ceroc figure is venues, not events - venues can run several events a week. But yes, it still seems a little high to me - I'm only quoting ceroc.com, not defending it. I'm happy to accept anyone else's numbers?


Source? :whistle:Also I'd be surprised if Ceroc "owns" as little as 50% of the MJ dancers, nationally.

Why do I think there are more Salsa dancers? a gross supposition that there are many more than 23 salsa venues in London, and that this pattern is repeated nationally.

My mind is made up - don't confuse me with the facts.

Paul F
10th-October-2005, 03:47 PM
As long as there are absolutely no follow up questions
.
.
.
There are exactly 673,878 dancers in the UK
:wink:

El Salsero Gringo
10th-October-2005, 03:49 PM
As long as there are absolutely no follow up questions
.
.
.
There are exactly 673,878 dancers in the UK
:-)Go on ... just one follow up, please:

Is it or is it not the case that 673,868 of them want slower, bluesier music?

CJ
10th-October-2005, 03:50 PM
Really 5 billions years? :really:

one week on Tuesday was already taken

David Bailey
10th-October-2005, 04:05 PM
Also I'd be surprised if Ceroc "owns" as little as 50% of the MJ dancers, nationally.
Probably correct, but 100K is a nice round figure.


Why do I think there are more Salsa dancers? a gross supposition that there are many more than 23 salsa venues in London, and that this pattern is repeated nationally.
Yes, but:
- most of those venues are 1 night / week jobs
- most of them are much smaller than MJ venues (in fact, 100-150 looks much to high now - let's say 50-100 on average)

I only know of about 10 salsa nights a week in the North-ish London area, for example - and I'd be astonished if there were more than 20. Assume 50-ish nights a week in Greater London, - that's probably roughly the same as Ceroc nights, but with fewer numbers. So I win.

OK, fun though this banter is, does anyone know any numbers here?

CJ
10th-October-2005, 04:07 PM
Probably correct, but 100K is a nice round figure.


No, David 100k is nice and round in the middle, but jaggy at the edges...

A nice round figure would be.... Lory!!:rofl: :rofl:

Paul F
10th-October-2005, 04:07 PM
Go on ... just one follow up, please:

Is it or is it not the case that 673,868 of them want slower, bluesier music?

Oh go on then I will let you :blush: :blush: :D

If it is that sounds like a good demographic to start up a special freestyle night :clap:

Now all I need to do is to find out how to attract all 673,000+ of them. Cant be that hard can it? ;)

ducasi
10th-October-2005, 04:10 PM
"How many dancers are in the UK?"

A lot fewer than think they are. :wink:

El Salsero Gringo
10th-October-2005, 04:16 PM
Oh go on then I will let you :blush: :blush: :D

If it is that sounds like a good demographic to start up a special freestyle night :clap:

Now all I need to do is to find out how to attract all 673,000+ of them. Cant be that hard can it? ;)Not hard at all: ChrisA knows most of them personally.:wink:

stewart38
10th-October-2005, 04:33 PM
Probably correct, but 100K is a nice round figure.


Yes, but:
- most of those venues are 1 night / week jobs
- most of them are much smaller than MJ venues (in fact, 100-150 looks much to high now - let's say 50-100 on average)

I only know of about 10 salsa nights a week in the North-ish London area, for example - and I'd be astonished if there were more than 20. Assume 50-ish nights a week in Greater London, - that's probably roughly the same as Ceroc nights, but with fewer numbers. So I win.

OK, fun though this banter is, does anyone know any numbers here?


Some Salsa clubs in London attract far more then a 100

In Hemel id guess there was 85-100 as the salsa club if that helps

There is certainly more 'jive' clubs then i ever thought , e.g Boxmoor beat etc. However what 'I thought' would have a bearing on actual numbers

im going for 670,500 but a lot of duplication

I think the acid text is office christmas parties NO-ONE dancing ceroc/jive. most never heard of it !

so on that basis i review my nos to 370 in the uk :yeah:

Lynn
10th-October-2005, 05:22 PM
Re salsa - can only comment on here but there are about say 10 classes per week in Belfast, with more in the area say 30 miles radius, but I only one has a class of anywhere near 100, most are classes of maybe 20 or so. Maybe 250 salsa dancers in Greater Belfast? I don't know about Derry. But not as many dancers as you would think there are by the number of salsa nights - just the same core of about 50 people who go to everything!

Point is that numbers of venues can mean a small group of lots of enthusiastic dancers, or a lot of people who go once a week - how do you work out which way to extrapolate it?

(No numbers for MJ to compare - I had an MJ evening the other week at about 10 days notice and had 45, but maybe I'm just very persuasive :whistle: ).

Russell Saxby
10th-October-2005, 05:24 PM
If there are 134 ceroc nights and you accept the figure of 55,000 people, then that would be (if they all danced weekly) 400+ people for each event.

DJ's orignal statement was 55,000 a month, which brings it down quite a bit from 400+

Either way, I wish they (the 55,000) would all come and pay us a visit, just once a year mind - I am not greedy.

El Salsero Gringo
10th-October-2005, 05:28 PM
DJ's orignal statement was 55,000 a month, which brings it down quite a bit from 400+

Either way, I wish they (the 55,000) would all come and pay us a visit, just once a year mind - I am not greedy.Yes, I think it's ambigous, 55,000 members, or 55,000 admissions each month? Not quite the same...

CJ
10th-October-2005, 05:35 PM
Yes, I think it's ambigous,

Ambiguous?!!?!?:eek:

You mean they can pay with their left hand AND their right!!!!!??:confused:

Cooooollll...:worthy:

Dreadful Scathe
10th-October-2005, 05:39 PM
indeed - sometimes the Ceroc card and is all you need to get the chicks :)

"no i cant demonstrate just now - I sprained my dancers ligament."

David Bailey
10th-October-2005, 08:09 PM
Yes, I think it's ambigous, 55,000 members, or 55,000 admissions each month? Not quite the same...
So why are you complaining to me? I'm only repeating what ceroc.com says - I didn't have any other figures, so I used those. Do you have any better data?

Does anyone have any data?

I dunno, ask a simple question....

spindr
10th-October-2005, 09:19 PM
Rough count; on my Jive links/map page (http://www.afterfive.co.uk/maps/Jive-links.html) seems to have 319 regular weekly Modern Jive venues, 282 of these seem to be unique -- so 37 of them have events regularly on more than one night. Of course, there might be some missing :)

SpinDr.

El Salsero Gringo
11th-October-2005, 12:30 AM
So why are you complaining to me? I'm only repeating what ceroc.com says - I didn't have any other figures, so I used those. Do you have any better data?I'm not complaining to you. I'm not complaining, and it wasn't to you. So there. (Is there a sticky-out tongue smiley that doesn't look like it's about to crap its pants?)

foxylady
11th-October-2005, 09:05 AM
(Is there a sticky-out tongue smiley that doesn't look like it's about to crap its pants?)

No, but we need one

bigdjiver
11th-October-2005, 11:11 AM
My guess is about 450 events a week, 40,000 attending per week, and about 150,000 "active" MJ dancers.

Msfab
11th-October-2005, 11:18 AM
My guess is about 450 events a week, 40,000 attending per week, and about 150,000 "active" MJ dancers.


Do you know how long they are "active" for?

Dreadful Scathe
11th-October-2005, 11:26 AM
Do you know how long they are "active" for?
they have a half-life of 12 years before they are normal again.

Lou
11th-October-2005, 11:49 AM
Do you know how long they are "active" for?
Stop poking them, then we might find out.... :whistle:

David Bailey
11th-October-2005, 07:50 PM
Oh, ***... :rolleyes:

If you want something done well, etc.

*David flounces off to hit the Google*

El Salsero Gringo
11th-October-2005, 08:11 PM
Oh, ***... :rolleyes:

If you want something done well, etc.

*David flounces off to hit the Google*Yes, but if you want:

Someone to tell you why you shouldn't bother
Someone else to tell you why it's a meaningless question, but really you should be wanting something entirely different
Four wise-cracks (including one funny, and one you don't understand)
Someone to micro-analyse what you wrote, subject it to linguistic analysis and hilight every possible ambiguity and contradiction (don't say it..)
Someone to completely misunderstand what you intended to say
Three pieces of sexual inuendo loosely based on what someone thought you might have said (again, one funny, and one you don't understand)
and no answers to your original question,

then you've come to the right place.

David Bailey
11th-October-2005, 08:22 PM
... hilight ...... inuendo ...
You forgot "Oh, and someone to anally point out spelling mistakes". :innocent:

LMC
11th-October-2005, 08:35 PM
< snips nearly comprehensive list, it's just up there ^^^ >

oooh, oooh, please tell me I was one of the funny ones?? please please pick me, pick me :clap: :clap: :clap:

Sorry ESG, but your list isn't quite complete.

You omitted:


243 posts arguing over whether someone who thinks f*o*w*rk isn't important is a true dancer
gratuitous mention of the FSM
and several thousand :rofl: smilies


Of course, that's purely subjective opinion :whistle:

David Bailey
11th-October-2005, 09:11 PM
OK, having spent an hour or so on Google, Wikipedia and elsewhere, I've got to come to the rather startling conclusion that... no-one really knows. Or if they do, they're not telling anyone about it.

That's a surprise - but I guess there are so many different dance styles and organisations, all competing with each other (even in the same genre), that the job of finding out a comprehensive set of nationwide statistics on this area is very difficult.

At least I've added to the vast number of things I don't know.

I'm now going with the LMC 2021 census idea - unless we can sneak "dancer" as an answer to the "religion" question in 2011, of course.