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robd
27th-May-2005, 10:57 PM
Not sure if it's beginners corner or not but had a class last night where the teacher threw wiggles into a few moves. Now, I don't mind a wiggle but as one kind lady in freestyle gently pointed out when giving me some private tuition my attempts were a bit "Stevie Wonder" with the shoulders giving it more than the hips. I know I need to practice in front of a mirror until I get it right but can anyone give me any tips or exercises that might accelerate the learning?

Also, out of interest do people find it harder stepping back, spinning, wiggling whatever with their left foot, leg, hip (or their right if they are left handed) or is it just me?

Robert

David Bailey
28th-May-2005, 12:46 AM
can anyone give me any tips or exercises that might accelerate the learning?
Hi Robd

I believe we have experts (or possibly, obsessives :) ) on wiggling in this forum, but I'll give it a go with my meagre level of knowledge.

I think the best bet is not to try so much to wiggle - certainly, yes, it's all in the hips, and the shoulders shouldn't move that much. If you want to work on wiggles, the best notion I could think last time this topic came up was to try some merengue classes if you can find some - you could argue that merengue is a slowed-down, wiggly, latin version of Modern Jive.

I'm sure the Wiggle Appreciation Group will have something to say on this one, so I'll bow out. But, you know, it's not compulsory to wiggle, and don't let certain forumites tell you otherwise. Develop your own style; wiggles or lack thereof will come in time. There are some awesome dancers out there, who wouldn't touch wiggles with a bargepole. So to speak.

El Salsero Gringo
28th-May-2005, 12:57 AM
I would very much like to hear from Andreas on this subject... please?

spindr
28th-May-2005, 12:52 PM
Hmmm, best suggestion is probably that you should find a partner to practise wiggling with.

I disagree that "it's all in the hips" -- you may find it easier to think about your knees -- especially if you are standing "pulled up" --there will be no slack in your knees/legs to let you wiggle -- you need to keep "soft knees".

A lot of hip action is really driven by weight transference -- rather than trying to push a hip in isolation.

A cheats way may be to place you knees together with legs slightly bent, and then draw small horizontal circles with your knees -- which should necessarily wiggle your hips.

Lastly, if you're practising -- its easier to feel how your hips are moving if you place both your hands at the top of you pelvis and use your arm feedback to feel how you are actually moving.

Cheers,
SpinDr.

P.S. You could always buy a lady's styling DVD -- always good to watch how the experts wiggle :)

jiveoholic
29th-May-2005, 06:00 PM
You could try Salsa classes for a while. Its impossible to dance Salsa without some form of wiggle!

David Bailey
29th-May-2005, 06:29 PM
You could try Salsa classes for a while. Its impossible to dance Salsa without some form of wiggle!
Yes - when I started, my teacher (superb dancer, Columbian) kept telling me off for wiggling too much :rofl:

I still think merengue's a better bet for wiggleage though.

Gadget
29th-May-2005, 08:13 PM
This thread on Wiggling (lack thereof) (http://www.cerocscotland.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4087) holds some decent advice.

cerocmetro
30th-May-2005, 05:20 AM
This thread on Wiggling (lack thereof) (http://www.cerocscotland.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4087) holds some decent advice.

or alternatively if you want some major wiggling; Finchley would seem to be the place to be /snip/

jiveoholic
30th-May-2005, 09:47 AM
Thinking about it - I am usually asked to wiggle infront of my oesteopath a the beginning and end of a session. She asks me to bend one knee, then the other etc. It seems to work! Not sure if this is the "right sort of" wiggling.

Little Em
23rd-June-2005, 05:26 PM
If i ever teach a wiggle to my class....

moving the hips, doing a figure of eight..... :grin:

LMC
23rd-June-2005, 10:32 PM
I was convinced that my hips contained concrete not cartilage when I started salsa at the end of March. I was given some excellent advice - well, it worked for me - stand with feet hip width apart, then allow all your weight to drop into one hip, hold for 10-15 seconds ('work it down' if you can) - then switch. Repeat. This loosened up my hip joints no end and I'm beginning to think that there is hope/potential for me to wiggle in future. (Similar to littleemc's advice, but much less movement).

I agree that 'deliberately' wiggling just doesn't look good. But if you can get the flexibility in your joints then I reckon it will come naturally. I'm hoping so anyway!

Clive Long
23rd-June-2005, 10:57 PM
or alternatively if you want some major wiggling; Finchley would seem to be the place to be /snip/
Adam high-jacks a thread with a blatant plug for Finchley - that's novel :wink:

Whitebeard
23rd-June-2005, 11:20 PM
I agree that 'deliberately' wiggling just doesn't look good.
Have to agree, as a too often spectator, that many of the attempts at wiggling are pretty cringeworthy (my own included no doubt). The ladies in general seem to have a natural aptitude or advantage which few men can equal. The secret, I feel, is that it will just come naturally as we think less of the mechanics of the dance and are able to repond to the music. Real music, not the thump thump club stuff.

foxylady
23rd-June-2005, 11:47 PM
I was convinced that my hips contained concrete not cartilage when I started salsa at the end of March. I was given some excellent advice - well, it worked for me - stand with feet hip width apart, then allow all your weight to drop into one hip, hold for 10-15 seconds ('work it down' if you can) - then switch. Repeat. This loosened up my hip joints no end and I'm beginning to think that there is hope/potential for me to wiggle in future. (Similar to littleemc's advice, but much less movement).

I agree that 'deliberately' wiggling just doesn't look good. But if you can get the flexibility in your joints then I reckon it will come naturally. I'm hoping so anyway!

This works (as well as the weight sinking into your hips the knee gives way a little too, this is what gives your hips a natural wiggle - just watch SliverFox or Andreas from behind - its all in the knees actually).

Avoid the advice of people who advise you to step on your tip toes... it makes you 'mince'. Not attractive in either male or female. It has the secondary effect of making ones hips wiggle, but mincing (whether wiggling or not) is not a desirable trait.

Foxy ( wiggler/wriggler extraordinaire....!)

David Bailey
24th-June-2005, 08:56 AM
Have to agree, as a too often spectator, that many of the attempts at wiggling are pretty cringeworthy (my own included no doubt).
:yeah:
Totally - but also in ladies, over-hip moving just looks like, trying too hard really. A certain weekender DVD I borrowed has a very good example of this :whistle:

I think the key phrase is "attempts at wiggling". Don't attempt to wiggle, it should flow out of your own style. Or, if you're not a wiggler, it won't - don't worry about it. As far as I know, wiggling isn't totally mandatory :)

LMC
24th-June-2005, 09:05 AM
This works (as well as the weight sinking into your hips the knee gives way a little too, this is what gives your hips a natural wiggle - just watch SliverFox or Andreas from behind - its all in the knees actually).

:yeah:

One thing I should have said is that if you try the wee exercise that works for me, it is very important not to lock your knees - or you may damage them, leaning all the weight on one side.

I'm not sure its *all* in the knees - the movement may be, but if your hips won't 'flex' then the wiggle ain't going to happen.


....it will just come naturally as we think less of the mechanics of the dance and are able to repond to the music
:yeah: too

Zebra Woman
24th-June-2005, 09:30 AM
This works (as well as the weight sinking into your hips the knee gives way a little too, this is what gives your hips a natural wiggle - just watch SliverFox or Andreas from behind - its all in the knees actually).

:rofl:

So that's your excuse Foxy Lady!!! :whistle:

Er...Is anyone sitting next to you?



Popcorn anyone?

LMC
24th-June-2005, 09:32 AM
Popcorn anyone?

OMG... it's contagious :eek:

sorry :blush:

Zebra Woman
24th-June-2005, 09:54 AM
OMG... it's contagious :eek:

sorry :blush:

Hey Newkid! Come and sit here :hug:

We've been expecting you :wink:

Didn't Silver Fox's say his motto is 'If you can take it, I can shake it'?

Apt eh? :devil:

Sparkles
24th-June-2005, 10:03 AM
It's not 'all in the hips' or the knees for that matter.
Wiggling IMO starts from within - you've got to lose your inhibitions first!
Then you need to use a combination of feet, ankles, knees, hips and abdominal muscles to get your body wiggling - just be sure to move them all in the right order and orientation otherwise you'll look like you're having a siezure... I agree with Spin Dr - find someone whose wiggle you like and practise with them... :whistle:
S. x

SilverFox
24th-June-2005, 11:26 AM
just watch SliverFox or Andreas from behind - Wiggling, maybe.......but slivering? :sick: :blush: :flower:

Gojive
24th-June-2005, 11:40 AM
Wiggling, maybe.......but slivering? :sick: :blush: :flower:

I think she meant "Salivering" :wink: :whistle:

Purple Sparkler
24th-June-2005, 12:10 PM
just watch SliverFox or Andreas from behind


So that's your excuse Foxy Lady!!!

Er...Is anyone sitting next to you?



Popcorn anyone?


OMG... it's contagious

sorry


Hey Newkid! Come and sit here

We've been expecting you

Room for one more, girls?

*joins Foxylady, Zebra Woman and NewKid*
*passes around some toffee popcorn*

One of these days I'll have to bring some butterkist to a Friday freestyle just so we can do this for real! :D

*realises she should probably contribute something serious to the thread*


If i ever teach a wiggle to my class....

moving the hips, doing a figure of eight..... :grin:

Which IIRC from my belly dancing classes (they were a while ago) is a proper belly dancing move, and most efficacious in Ceroc where wiggling is required.

Zebra Woman
24th-June-2005, 02:35 PM
Wiggling, maybe.......but slivering? :sick: :blush: :flower:

Don't worry, you wiggle ...and leave the 'slivering' to us girls :drool:





<Submit Reply> *No don't submit!!* <Submit Reply> * NOooooo...

(Too late) :blush:

foxylady
24th-June-2005, 04:38 PM
....... you've got to lose your inhibitions first!.................


Inhibitions ?? :eek: What are they, how precisely does one lose them, and can you find them again once lost ??

Purple Sparkler
24th-June-2005, 04:43 PM
Inhibitions ?? :eek: What are they, how precisely does one lose them, and can you find them again once lost ??

Foxy, if you want some, I have PLENTY to go around :rolleyes: :( (I guess I must've got your share? :wink: :na: :flower: )

Golly, that was a lot of smilies.

LMC
27th-June-2005, 11:50 AM
:clap:

Well, I don't know "what happened", but I appear to have developed an auto-wiggle function at some point over the weekend. I didn't have it on Saturday, but I did on Sunday.... Maybe osmosis from watching all the good dancers at MJC on Sat?

So FWIW, my advice is not to worry about it, don't try to do it deliberately ('cos it looks really naff, as many others have said) - let it develop naturally. Because if I have developed a wiggle, anyone can :rofl:

Purple Sparkler
27th-June-2005, 01:19 PM
:clap:

Well, I don't know "what happened", but I appear to have developed an auto-wiggle function at some point over the weekend. I didn't have it on Saturday, but I did on Sunday.... Maybe osmosis from watching all the good dancers at MJC on Sat?

So FWIW, my advice is not to worry about it, don't try to do it deliberately ('cos it looks really naff, as many others have said) - let it develop naturally. Because if I have developed a wiggle, anyone can :rofl:

Yay for wiggling! But booooo for us not meeting! Maybe next time, eh?

Sparkles
27th-June-2005, 01:48 PM
Inhibitions ?? :eek: What are they,??
They're not anything you need to worry about, Sweetie - as I'm sure DavidB will testify... :whistle: :wink:

Purple Sparkler
27th-June-2005, 01:59 PM
They're not anything you need to worry about, Sweetie - as I'm sure DavidB will testify... :whistle: :wink:

:confused: Why DavidB?

Just Wiggle
27th-June-2005, 05:18 PM
Since I took my name from the many comments I have had about "my wiggle" I thought I'd better post something on this!

Not that I have any more pearls of wisdom that hasn't been already addressed.

I think it is a combinaton of hips, knees, ankles etc... and practising in front of a mirror does help! Although locking your knees together does remind me of the "Trevor and Simon's swing your pants" Going Live sketch!

Dreadful Scathe
27th-June-2005, 05:41 PM
Since I took my name from the many comments I have had about "my wiggle" I thought I'd better post something on this!

Not that I have any more pearls of wisdom that hasn't been already addressed.

I think it is a combinaton of hips, knees, ankles etc... and practising in front of a mirror does help! Although locking your knees together does remind me of the "Trevor and Simon's swing your pants" Going Live sketch!
You certainly do have a wiggle to be proud of :)

Daisy Chain
27th-June-2005, 08:29 PM
I partook of an intermediate lesson recently where we were taught the mechanics of wiggling like "The Lovely Claire". It involved hips and figures of 8. Could I do it? Could I buffalo.

So that night I went home and tried in front of the mirror. It was appalling - think Dad Dancing. I stayed dancing in front of the mirror whilst the rest of the Mavericks (guess which track) played on the hi-fi and absentmindedly danced as I usually do. Blow me! There it was. I could do the wiggle all along.

Breaking the wiggle down in the lesson hadn't helped at all!

Daisy

(A Lovely Little Wriggler)

JoC
30th-June-2005, 01:09 PM
It was the last night at the Mardi Gras last night, and to celebrate Lorna taught us a mega-wiggle, that one where you're arms oot and you basically have a bit of time to shake that booty, or do a cross-step or whatever, and both partners have a go.

First off, I've been hoping for that move to be taught for ages so thanks!
Also just want to say...

Lorna's wiggling... :worthy:

Steve's wiggling...can't decide which smiley to use...still hypnotised! (Nice hair too)

Purple Sparkler
30th-June-2005, 01:15 PM
Going to MJC has dramatically improved my wiggling, I must say.
Nicky Haslam gave some excellent advice on how to do it properly in her Close Moves classes. I'd explain the Cuban Exercise, but it would probably be easier if I simply say that any forumites who wish to learn it should grab me when they're next in town/at a venue I'm at.

Sheepman
30th-June-2005, 05:58 PM
I agree that 'deliberately' wiggling just doesn't look good. I have a little theory about this.

Take as an example, when you smile. If you do this naturally, it looks right, but if someone tells you to "smile for the camera" the result is normally forced and unnatural. The reason for this is that these responses are controlled by different parts of the brain, and that trying to consciously simulate the exact muscle control required for a natural smile is practically impossible. It's much easier to smile naturally if you think of something nice, or amusing.
So perhaps there is something similar happening when we are consciously thinking "wiggle"?

Now all you need is something to think about which will make you wiggle naturally...

Greg

Clive Long
30th-June-2005, 06:11 PM
Going to MJC has dramatically improved my wiggling, I must say.
Nicky Haslam gave some excellent advice on how to do it properly in her Close Moves classes. I'd explain the Cuban Exercise, but it would probably be easier if I simply say that any forumites who wish to learn it should grab me when they're next in town/at a venue I'm at.
Me please.

Clive

ducasi
30th-June-2005, 07:32 PM
Now all you need is something to think about which will make you wiggle naturally...
Me please. Was I the only one that thought that Clive was replying to Greg? :D

Andreas
30th-June-2005, 11:59 PM
I would very much like to hear from Andreas on this subject... please?


:rofl: :rofl:

DJ has mentioned the right thing. The easiest way is by LEARNING Merengue. I put an emphasis there on learning because everybody can just walk. The idea is to 'walk into a straight leg'. That means you step onto a bend leg and while you transfer weight you straighten the leg. You can even try that on the spot. It'll give sore hips after a while if you do it properly but that will fade :D

The other and probably most important thing is: ESG will guess 'rib shifts'. Rib shifts are shifts of your rib cage, left, right, front and back WITHOUT moving hips or shoulders. If you do it right then you will soon feel a relieving pain in your sides :rofl: It is an exercise of separation. You can also practice them while lying in bed, just small motion. Just be warned, partners don't like it if you do that all the time :blush: The easiest way to practice rib shifts, btw, is while being seated on a chair. That way you don't have to concentrate on your hips.

I can show you if you are serious about it. Though, it is reasonably painful to start with as you will have to 'discover' muscles you didn't know of.

As DJ said before, try to do small motions to start with. There is no point in doing huge motions if you can't do them in small. :wink:

Andreas
1st-July-2005, 12:38 AM
I forgot to mention Lambada. Lambada has a lot of hip action, mostly lateral. This is also a dance worth looking at when trying to improve ones wiggles. So is Samba (brasilian Samba) but it is a lot harder to learn.

I personally don't think Salsa is such a good dance to learn to wiggle. You can get away quite easily w/o wiggles in it.

jockey
1st-July-2005, 03:15 AM
Not sure if it's beginners corner or not but had a class last night where the teacher threw wiggles into a few moves. Now, I don't mind a wiggle but as one kind lady in freestyle gently pointed out when giving me some private tuition my attempts were a bit "Stevie Wonder" with the shoulders giving it more than the hips. I know I need to practice in front of a mirror until I get it right but can anyone give me any tips or exercises that might accelerate the learning?

Also, out of interest do people find it harder stepping back, spinning, wiggling whatever with their left foot, leg, hip (or their right if they are left handed) or is it just me?

Robert
I did a belly dancing class once (4 men 40 women) and the main thing is to separate the upper torso from the hips; one move in Lindy is a North -West - South - East movement with the hips called ?; I do a lot of hip circles as I am Michael Jackson (version circa 1980s) but if you are influenced by salsa you will favour body rolling. "Wiggles" are great if you can pull them off and when you get really confident do them in a train so the girl is behind you or what is called the "Knights Move where you stand still (wiggling for all you are worth) and you lead the lady full circle clockwise around you. Or, if she is in front and you do hip circles you can watch her looking at you...but you had better be good! :waycool:

David Bailey
1st-July-2005, 07:45 AM
I personally don't think Salsa is such a good dance to learn to wiggle. You can get away quite easily w/o wiggles in it.
Good point.

I'd argue that Columbian salsa is maybe more wiggly, simply because of the faster weight-transfers involved, but certainly, New York and Cuban styles don't have much inherent wiggling.

Maybe we should have Merengue warmups in Ceroc classes, they're always fun. Obviously, I sneer at Merengue as a wussy dance in general, but it's pretty much all about the wiggle. I did a great (well, I liked it) Merengue with someone (ZW? Can't remember) a week ago at Ceroc, it's surprising how difficult it is not to launch into turns and spins...

Andreas
1st-July-2005, 08:02 AM
Maybe we should have Merengue warmups in Ceroc classes, they're always fun. Obviously, I sneer at Merengue as a wussy dance in general, but it's pretty much all about the wiggle. I did a great (well, I liked it) Merengue with someone (ZW? Can't remember) a week ago at Ceroc, it's surprising how difficult it is not to launch into turns and spins...

I used to use Merengue and the basics of Lambada for a warm-up for all my classes. 1) it gets the body moving and 2) people lose inhibitions of moving their body after a while.

MartinHarper
1st-July-2005, 09:28 AM
One move in Lindy is a North -West - South - East movement with the hips called ?

"Messin' Around".