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View Full Version : What makes Religions/Philosophies/Theologies (un)attractive?



Magic Hans
21st-April-2005, 09:32 AM
....inspired/provoked by the Scientology thread ...

Taoism **** happens.
Confucianism Confucius say, "**** happens."
Buddhism If **** happens, it is not really ****.
Zen Buddhism What is the sound of **** happening?
Hinduism This **** happened before.
Islam If **** happens, it is the will of Allah.
Protestantism Let **** happen to someone else.
Catholicism If **** happens, then you deserve it.
Judaism Why does this **** always happen to us?
New Age Affirm that **** does not happen to me.
Atheism I don´t believe this ****.
Rastafarianism Let´s roll this **** up and smoke it.

What makes different religions or ways of living/being more or less attractive?

It seems that in England, the traditional church (Catholic/Protestant/etc) seems to have been steadily if slowly gaining disinterest over the last decade or two.

What makes Buddhism a more attractive prospect for some?

Quakers, although few in number, seems relatively unaffected over a similar time period.

Last time I heard, Islam had the most popular world following without any signs of faultering.

What's the difference that makes the difference? Are there any differences? Is it all a load of boulder dash?

Dreadful Scathe
21st-April-2005, 10:49 AM
Atheism isnt a religion, philosophy or theology - its not an affirmation of anything - its just a lack of belief in something ;) There are certanly a lot less religious people then there used to be.

azande
21st-April-2005, 11:11 AM
Atheism isnt a religion, philosophy or theology - its not an affirmation of anything - its just a lack of belief in something ;) There are certanly a lot less religious people then there used to be.
Why not defining atheism as the belief in the non-belief?

Lory
21st-April-2005, 11:52 AM
I must be a true athiest, cos when I read the title of this thread, I thought to my self, Oh no, not this **** again! :whistle:

Dreadful Scathe
21st-April-2005, 12:06 PM
Why not defining atheism as the belief in the non-belief?
its a lack of belief in something others believe i.e. lack of theism because atheists are not theists. You will of course believe you are an atheist because you are. :)

azande
21st-April-2005, 12:11 PM
its a lack of belief in something others believe i.e. lack of theism because atheists are not theists. You will of course believe you are an atheist because you are. :)
From Wikipedia: (Emphasis are mine :wink: )

Atheism is the state either of being without theistic beliefs, or of actively disbelieving in the existence of deities. In antiquity, Epicureanism incorporated aspects of atheism, but it disappeared from the philosophy of the Greek and Roman traditions as Christianity gained influence. During the Age of Enlightenment, the concept of atheism re-emerged as an accusation against those who questioned the religious status quo, but by the late 18th century it had become the philosophical position of a growing minority. By the 20th century, atheism had become the most common position among scientists, rationalists, and humanists.

David Bailey
21st-April-2005, 12:16 PM
I must be a true athiest, cos when I read the title of this thread, I thought to my self, Oh no, not this **** again! :whistle:
:rofl: - that puts you firmly in the "Agnostic" camp I suspect...

Dreadful Scathe
21st-April-2005, 03:45 PM
Atheism is the state either of being without theistic beliefs, or of actively disbelieving

Notice the EITHER and OR there - I highlighted the first definition, you are highlighting the second. The 2 positions are often called Weak and Strong Atheism.


become the philosophical position

It may be a philosophical position but does that make it a philosophy? Your religious position can be atheist but that doesnt make atheism a religion and if your smoking position is rabid anti-smoker that doesnt make you a smoker :)

azande
21st-April-2005, 03:50 PM
Notice the EITHER and OR there - I highlighted the first definition, you are highlighting the second. The 2 positions are often called Weak and Strong Atheism.



It may be a philosophical position but does that make it a philosophy? Your religious position can be atheist but that doesnt make atheism a religion and if your smoking position is rabid anti-smoker that doesnt make you a smoker :)
I consider it a philosophy because I studied it at school in a subject called...................

philosophy

Swinging bee
21st-April-2005, 05:27 PM
As far as all religion goes I can say that I have lost the will to be apathetic.......Too many years as a 'Bobby' at the "sharp end"
caused this... If there are gods out there, then they need to smarten up their act...
Just be nice to everybody that will do......

stewart38
22nd-April-2005, 04:09 PM
There are certanly a lot less religious people then there used to be.

In UK or the world ?

More practicing Muslims today then the population of the entire planet in 1800

Dreadful Scathe
22nd-April-2005, 05:22 PM
In UK or the world ?

More practicing Muslims today then the population of the entire planet in 1800
I meant the UK. I also meant by percentage, not number :)

Magic Hans
23rd-April-2005, 09:08 PM
... There are certanly a lot less religious people then there used to be.

That there might be (in our country/culture) ... so .... if people aren't believing in a classical type religion thing, what are people believing in?

Personally I would not believe "nothing" as an answer?

Atheism, hmmm, yes maybe a belief in no god, but replaced by what? [bearing in mind that (at least) one purpose of religion/philosophy, is to supply a set of beliefs/values to follows/adhere to/be guided by.

... slight aside .... as a teenager, I liked to think that I followed no style, ie portrayed no image. Now is seems to me that the "portraying of no image" is an image in itself .... a "no image" image!!

Does this make sense? Clearly a "no smoker" smoker doesn't!

hmmmm [ ..... sound of head slightly imploding!]

Dreadful Scathe
23rd-April-2005, 09:27 PM
I see what you mean. I think its generally more common for people not to have a belief in god(s) anymore - society is not based around religion as it once was, religious education and prayers in school are no longer compulsory, weddings are happening out with church more, it is no longer assumed that people believe a certain religion. Also, people are clever enough to judge that religion doesn't necessarily make you a nice human being.

I think when society gets out of the habit of worship and education improves, certain individuals find they have little need for religion. So a lack of religious belief is not a loss and as long as society can be unconcerned by the individuals beliefs or lack of beliefs in gods - it can only get better.

Of course part of a religious upbringing is the moral and ethical standards that religion introduces. So what replaces it? Simply the moral and ethical standards humans already had - love for family, the sense of belonging to a community etc..its not as if religion is introducing new foreign ethical and moral concepts and its not as if religious practitioners are consistent in following them! (suicide bombers, anti-abortion activists firebombing hospitals etc..) I dont see why disbelieving in one thing means that there is a gap to fill. I dont believe Harry potter is real but I dont have another boy wizard in mind to "fill that void" :confused:

Magic Hans
24th-April-2005, 12:51 PM
I see what you mean. I think its generally more common for people not to have a belief in god(s) anymore

Agreed. However, what about the divine/spiritual/supernatural etc? It strikes me that science has been eclipsing religions over the past 100 years or so, but has begun to reach it's limits. We can't focus down much further than electrons/neutrons and their constituents, without any certainty. Various Eastern practices such as Shiatsu, thai massage, Acupuncture, India head massage, Reiki, Traditional Chinese Medicine systems seem to be gaining in popular acceptance, despite the difficulty in being scientifically proven (also homeopathy). Emotional (eg EQ, rather than IQ) and inuitive aspects on the individual seem to be gaining recognition, where 50/60 years ago they might have been instantly dismissed.


I think when society gets out of the habit of worship and education improves, certain individuals find they have little need for religion. So a lack of religious belief is not a loss and as long as society can be unconcerned by the individuals beliefs or lack of beliefs in gods - it can only get better.

Agreed, however, I propose that everyone has a set of (beliefs or)principles/values that govern their behaviour and decision making. If this is the case, what might they be? Capitalistic, maybe? Striving for wealth, or at least a decent standard of living. [Of course, the basic set of principles/values are defined in most religions .... 8/9 of the ten commandments ensure that we can live together in close proximity]


Of course part of a religious upbringing is the moral and ethical standards that religion introduces. So what replaces it? Simply the moral and ethical standards humans already had - love for family, the sense of belonging to a community etc.. its not as if religion is introducing new foreign ethical and moral concepts ...

Quite true! Various religions brought nothing new. What then did they bring? What was the purpose of religions? What have religions achieved? [Also how have religions been misuse!?]

Seems to me that religions brought us out of caves and into more ordered civilisations. They gave us an initial template as to how to conduct ourselves, and described to us some of the mysteries of this world. Then science started doing a better job that was far more plausible (or believable!), and most certainly objective (or collectively subjective!!). However, what better tool then a religion, to (unite and) control entire populations?? Enter politics, and most of the major historical world conflicts.



and its not as if religious practitioners are consistent in following them! (suicide bombers, anti-abortion activists firebombing hospitals etc..) I dont see why disbelieving in one thing means that there is a gap to fill. I dont believe Harry potter is real but I dont have another boy wizard in mind to "fill that void" :confused:

Maybe their are some aspects to humanity that are necessary for existence. Certainly there are some physical aspects [ ... like blood, or skin]. Any emotional aspects? Mental aspects? Psychological aspects? Spiritual aspects?