Life is a Cabaret

[Lounge Lizard]

Life is a Cabaret

Since I started MJ last century I have seen many cabarets, some amazing, some not so amazing.

Many of the big names in MJ put on a great show with great routines, cool costumes etc. many other big names cant be bothered with the costumes – after all we are there to see them dance. Is the appearance as important as the dance.

There are a number of venues (and weekenders) that put on regular cabarets, sometimes booking unsuitable acts and often resulting in a poor performance by an unprepared professional or social dancer doing their best in a nerve racking arena.

Should a cabaret be something special or just a regular interval during the Saturday dance night (Even the good and great have to develop their skills somewhere)

Are cabarets an annoying interference with the Saturday night dance.

Should the performers make an effort or is it ok to freestyle or just dance the choreographed routine in the jeans & T shirts.

Personally I like a cabaret when it is really special (e.g. Rebel Yell) and think even top names are boring when there is no preparation or effort on their part to make the routine look good

Are certain stars overexposed or is the constant influx of new dancers keeping their routines ‘fresh and exciting’

Should we be expected to pay more/less if there is or is not a cabaret

Hopefully there is something here to discuss (but has probably already been covered on the forum)
Peter

[Dreadful Scathe]

Should a cabaret be something special or just a regular interval during the Saturday dance night (Even the good and great have to develop their skills somewhere)


A cabaret has to be something special, or i dont believe its a cabaret at all. If its just some people with choreographed moves then its just a demonstration, not a cabaret. Costumes, a mix of music, acting, team work, interesting/original moves and a well polished performance are things that i would look for in a cabaret. Do you all concur :)

[Gus]

Good thread. Must admit to mixed feelings. I think a cabaret can produce a usefull break in the proceeding ... if you've got 4+ hours of freestyle a small break can be useful. As to what it should contain ... well, I dont think it has to be the 'best of the best' as long as its entertaining. I would prefer to see someone like either of the Scottish Cabaret Teams than some of the profesional dancers who may be technically better but lack that pure enthusiasim. At the same time, seeing someone like Paul Warden just freestyle can be entertaining and impressive enough on its own.

[Lounge Lizard]

Just thought of another bit
Should the performance differ between venues.....e.g if I book a top name for hastings with about 80 - 100 dancers should I expect the same performance the same dancer/artist would give to (say) The Camber or Hipsters

All to often venues in the 'sticks' get less effort it seems

[TheTramp]

A cabaret has to be something special, or i dont believe its a cabaret at all. If its just some people with choreographed moves then its just a demonstration, not a cabaret. Costumes, a mix of music, acting, team work, interesting/original moves and a well polished performance are things that i would look for in a cabaret. Do you all concur :)
:yeah:

Sadly, I almost totally agree with the Smurf.

If it's not choreographed to a piece of music, then it's not a cabaret. It's a demonstration.

And if someone has taken the time to do the choreography, then they usually do the costumes etc. too.

The disagreement comes with the 'mix of music'. I don't necessarily see why this has to happen. I've seen some very good routines that just use one track from start to finish. Most (all?) of Nigel & Nina's routines for example are done to just one track...

Trampy

[Dreadful Scathe]

I'd agree with that but i would say that it has to be an interesting track that is interpreted well, but i suppose even the most boring track could be interpreted brillantly and make for a good cabaret. If there is a mix of music it should a well-edited mix of music, can make all the difference i think.

oi...Why is it sad that you agree with me :)

[TheTramp]

I'd agree with that but i would say that it has to be an interesting track that is interpreted well, but i suppose even the most boring track could be interpreted brillantly and make for a good cabaret. If there is a mix of music it should a well-edited mix of music, can make all the difference i think.

oi...Why is it sad that you agree with me :)
I think that many people would agree that Nigel & Nina are among the top (if not the top) performing cabaret artists in the UK.

Maybe it's because their dancing is so good, rather than relying on additional support, like well-edited mixes of music :wink: :flower:

It's sad that I agree with you, because you're small and blue. Or something :whistle:

Trampy

[Dreadful Scathe]

Maybe it's because their dancing is so good, rather than relying on additional support, like well-edited mixes of music :wink: :flower:


Theres no "maybe" about it, it is a dance cabaret after all. You triumph or fail on the dancing and although badly editied music will detract a bit from the performance, I can't see how "well edited" music would "support" bad dancing !
:confused:

[Sheepman]

A cabaret has to be something special, or i dont believe its a cabaret at all. If its just some people with choreographed moves then its just a demonstration, not a cabaret. I didn't initially consider this distinction, but the most impressive cabaret I've seen to date (and I only saw it on video, which is never as good as live) was Robert Cordoba and Deborah dancing at Rebel Yell in 2002. It was freestyle, and they didn't dress up, but it was the most inspirational dance I've seen. (Perhaps partly because it seemed attainable, given enough time and effort.) I do wonder how much better it would have seemed if they had dressed up for it.

IMO the top cabarets on the MJ scene are those at Beach Boogie and Rock Bottoms. Individual acts at other events may be just as good, but they don't normally have the strength in depth. (Will anyone who was at BB this year ever forget Johnny and his balls? :worthy: )

I think it is fine to have the occasional cabaret at (say) a normal Saturday night dance, provided the organiser is happy that it will be entertaining. The important thing is not to have too long a break and lose "momentum" for the night. I know a number of people at Camber (e.g.) don't come out dancing until after the cabaret has finished (well after midnight), as they don't want to get too hot, then too cold and stiff while the cabaret is on, then start up again.

Greg

[RobC]

Just thought of another bit
Should the performance differ between venues.....e.g if I book a top name for hastings with about 80 - 100 dancers should I expect the same performance the same dancer/artist would give to (say) The Camber or Hipsters

All to often venues in the 'sticks' get less effort it seems
I dont think it's so much the venue as more the type of event that matters. If the cabaret is just an interruption in an otherwise 'normal' dance evening, then I don't think the punter's expectations are likely to be as high as if it is a special event where the punters have been charged more than the usual entry fee and the cabaret has been advirtised as a main attraction at the event.

[TheTramp]

I didn't initially consider this distinction, but the most impressive cabaret I've seen to date (and I only saw it on video, which is never as good as live) was Robert Cordoba and Deborah dancing at Rebel Yell in 2002. It was freestyle, and they didn't dress up, but it was the most inspirational dance I've seen. (Perhaps partly because it seemed attainable, given enough time and effort.) I do wonder how much better it would have seemed if they had dressed up for it.

I think it is fine to have the occasional cabaret at (say) a normal Saturday night dance, provided the organiser is happy that it will be entertaining. The important thing is not to have too long a break and lose "momentum" for the night. I know a number of people at Camber (e.g.) don't come out dancing until after the cabaret has finished (well after midnight), as they don't want to get too hot, then too cold and stiff while the cabaret is on, then start up again.
As I recall, Robert and Deborah did 2 songs at Rebel Yell. I was under the impression that one was choreographed, and one was freestyle. Though, I have to be honest, and say that I couldn't actually tell which was which (I was there live)!!

Agree with what you say about Camber, which was why I (and a couple of others) persuaded Franco to keep the music going on downstairs while the cabaret was on for those people who wanted to carry on dancing, and not have a break. It's what happened at Southport too - music playing in the blues area while the cabarets, prizes etc. took place.

Trampy

[Dreadful Scathe]

I didn't initially consider this distinction, but the most impressive cabaret I've seen to date (and I only saw it on video, which is never as good as live) was Robert Cordoba and Deborah dancing at Rebel Yell in 2002. It was freestyle, and they didn't dress up, but it was the most inspirational dance I've seen. (Perhaps partly because it seemed attainable, given enough time and effort.) I do wonder how much better it would have seemed if they had dressed up for it.


Just 2 of them? I would call that a spotlight or a showcase not a cabaret. I should have stressed that ive been talking about Team Cabarets. Was Lounge Lizard talking about teams or not ? Im not sure now, but i thought so initially. I think dressing up, acting etc.. is a lot less important in a showcase, as is dancing to a mixed track. 1 track would be better in most cases. Now reading back, I think TheTramp was talking about showcases too...oh well :).

[TheTramp]

Ummm. Yeah. I was talking about showcases - generally, when they are performed outside of a competition, the usual name is a cabaret (or demonstration if it's not choreographed). I'm pretty sure that's what LL meant as well...

Sorry for any confusion...

Trampy

[Dreadful Scathe]

....no worries, it was perfectly obvious to everyone bar me :) the forum has half my attention today.

Not that anyone is going to notice a slip in my standard of posting :)

[foxylady]

AT Jumping at the woodside (2003) the cabaret was superb. Breathtaking, innovative, fun, lively, inspiring... pretty early on in the evening... and didn't detract from the dancing at all...

At Camber (Nov 2003) the cabaret was boring, self indulgent, underrehearsed, definitely detracted from the dancing, and far far too long...
(I should note I missed the teachers part of the cabaret session which may possibly have been better than the rest)... IMO took a while for the evening to warm up again...

Conclusion, cabaret's (or showcases, or demonstrations even) have a place if the are good to watch...

(I know what I have said is a bit harsh, and a lot of people worked hard for the performances that were put on, but they just didn't make good viewing - sorry)

[RobC]

It was freestyle, and they didn't dress up, but it was the most inspirational dance I've seen. (Perhaps partly because it seemed attainable, given enough time and effort.)
Interesting that most of the posts on this thread mention the word "entertaining". For me however, I think Greg has hit the nail on the head with "Inspiring". Yes, I can have a good laugh at an entertaining cabaret (Johnny's Balls were great, and Amir's p!$$-take of Johnny's Balls had me in stitches, especially when Johnny joined in and did 'Amir' :rofl: ), but the cabarets that do it for me are the ones that inspire me, either to improve my dancing, or to try something different or whatever.



IMO the top cabarets on the MJ scene are those at Beach Boogie and Rock Bottoms. Individual acts at other events may be just as good, but they don't normally have the strength in depth.
:yeah:

[DavidB]

it is a dance cabaret after all. You triumph or fail on the dancingSorry - I don't agree. You triumph or fail on entertaining the crowd. Your dancing ability can have little to do with it.

It is the opposite of competitions & judging. In a comp the winners should be the best dancers, and couples who just do crowd-pleasing flashy moves shouldn't get as much reward from the judges. But a cabaret is about pleasing the majority of the crowd, not the minority who know (or think they know) about what constitutes good dancing.

Obviously many times the two go together.

As far as freestyle demonstrations go - I wouldn't be too happy to pay for a cabaret and just get freestyle. (I know many WCS pros in the US have one fee for their proper cabaret routines, and an substantially lower fee for a simple freestyle demo. That is perfectly acceptable - you know in advance what you are getting.)

David

[spindr]

I think the secret is that the audience needs to have at least a good a time watching than the dancers performing -- otherwise they start getting a bit self indulgent.

Found a resonable recipe for a successful (team) cabaret (http://www.salsamafia.com/index.html?http://www.salsamafia.com/Salsa_Choreography.html) -- certainly the comments about abrupt music editting and rip changes rang true to me.

SpinDr.

P.S. Most professional cabaret -- Graham and Ann (http://www.hoppinmad.co.uk) at Minstead a few years ago -- completely brilliant for such a small venue. They danced a superb acrobatic lindy routine for about 3 minutes and missed one throw -- I think even the audience was about of breath from clapping -- they just turned round and danced the entire 3 minute routine again and nailed it, absolutely superb.

[Dazzle]

I saw my first cabaret about 3 months after I started to dance MJ. I was so inspired by the entertainment and skill exhibited that it has lead me on to completely change my life. I am now planning to go back to college to undergo formal dance training! :flower: Not saying who it was but it was Amirzing!! :worthy:

In the NW there are often moans when a freestyle night is interrupted by a fun class (Tip: Never come between a northern dancer's drink, partner or the dance floor!). But at the last freestyle where there was also a cabaret, numerous people on entry moaned about the inclusion of it because they felt it interrupted their dancing time. Very shortly afterwards, they all returned to the Front Desk to say they were blown away by it and took back everything they had said earlier! They were obviously inspired! :clap:

Demonstrations have an important part to play too. I find they are often the ones where you think, with a bit of effort you could do that.

I totally agree that a cabaret is something that inspires and is a complete self-contained package, choreography, music, costumes, something different and special, a mini production! :yeah:

[Dreadful Scathe]

Sorry - I don't agree. You triumph or fail on entertaining the crowd. Your dancing ability can have little to do with it.


I totally agree even though it doesnt sound like it from that quote :). That was more in context with Nigel and Nina specifically and theTramps comment that they need no extras - in their case the entertainment value comes from the fantastic dancing and in a showcase i would say thats still very important. In a team cabaret, for me to be a good cabaret its ALL about entertrainment. So i think theres a distinction between a showcase and a team cabaret. We had a standing ovation for a cabaret at Scotland last year and didnt win, as the judges look for far more than just entertainment value. :). So it was a triumph from that point of viw at least.

[Minnie M]

Did anyone go to Camp Savoy ? Amazing and very professional cabarets (costumes an' all)

The Lindy Circle did an very clever and very entertaining cabaret, there were about 20 of them (well it seemed that many) most of whom most of you know as they are MJ to Lindy converts

We (the MJ scene) have a lot to learn IMO from the other dance styles with regard to cabarets - i.e. Ballroom / WCS / Lindy / Tango & Salsa